Marriage is a Team Sport

[kbachler]

I find it disheartening that in many threads on topics of marriages that face challenges, the posters tend to look at the situation as one of – one of the spouses is “right” and the other is “wrong”.

By now I would think that we would know that marriage is a team sport. It requires both partners, working in the same direction, to be a success. “Sacrificing” indefinitely for a marriage - that is, sacrifice without great communication and great context - is a wonderful way to have a mediocre relationship, because inevitably it means that one party is left out or left behind.

When people point out that it takes two for a marriage to fail, we are not trying to defend bad behavior on behalf of one partner. If there is infidelity, contentiousness, whatever - those things are wrong and are still wrong - they are not appropriate responses to the ills of the marriage (which are typically created by BOTH partners) We are simply noting that treating the symptom doesn’t treat the disease - the marriage will still be sick. We may state that we understand why certain behavior occurred - but that doesn’t mean that we accept the behavior.

Easterjoy made a great post on this topic:

easterjoy:

She [a wife] is discontented, and that is important. While the affair was a sinful way to address her discontent, we cannot jump to the conclusion that her discontent is itself rooted in her own selfishness. It could be rooted in a selfishness or self-centeredness in her husband that comes out in their sex life and that he is aware of but unwilling to change–“he is a ‘great’ husband, but…”. In spite of his giving nature in all other respects, his selfishness or blindness to her needs in that limited sphere may have left her vulnerable to sexual sin of her own. After all, if she thought indulging herself was her only duty in life, why would she post here?

OK, so let us say that she has a problem with her marriage that is not her fault or not entirely her fault. Maybe it is not anyone’s fault, so much as it is a difficulty of the kind that can arise due to natural differences between spouses…natural differences meant to be bridged by supernatural attitudes of grace on both sides. Let us say that she has done a lot of work to address this problem and feels discouraged about reaching a solution. Giving herself permission to leave her husband and family for a different lover and totally disregarding the unhappiness she feels in her marriage “for the sake of everybody else” are hardly her only two options.

She and her husband have not come to a meeting of the minds with regards to their sexual relationship. That was and is something to work on. When it was not worked out to their mutual satisfaction, the temptation of extramarital affairs became a much greater danger. That doesn’t mean that one fall necessarily spells the end of her marriage, but the urgency of working on her primary relationship with her husband is obviously great.

I think she needs to be encouraged to get back into her marriage and give her all to make it succeed. She needs to be encouraged that others have gone through what she is going through and have emerged still married and in a better marriage at that (not because of the affair but because the work the affair showed needed to be done was actually done). She needs to find guidance to work on her first attempt at marriage until all options with it are exhausted, and then and only then look into whether the marriage was ever valid in the first place.

When, and only when, it becomes clear by failure to live in peace and a subsequent finding by a tribunal that her first attempt at marriage was not valid, then she can entertain the possibility of a second attempt at marriage. Until then, it is either live in peace with the man she chose or else, forced by the impossibility of living in peace, live without a husband at all. The Catholic Church teaches that this is the nature of the commitment she made when she married. It is the intention of the Church to be with married couples as they go through the difficulties this can present. The Church does not exist to make rules, but teaches what the reality of the nature of love makes the law and gives pastoral support to help us all with the task of living that law. By all means, she should avail herself of that help whereever she can get it.

If the husband she has is better than no husband at all, then by all means, she ought to quit looking where the grass seems greener. Those are not pastures open to her. She has moral options, but her lover is not one of them.

I bolded the last sentence to point out that Easterjoy is not accepting the sin - she is quite clear on this. But she is also quite clear that it (usually) takes two to make a marriage fail.

I hope that in future discussions, we can keep a Christian focus on helping a person who has come for help through a bad time toward the right thing - rather than just condemning them and beating them with a stick!

When Christ met the Samaritan woman at the well, He TALKED to her (a big deal to begin with) and treated her gently. He told her to move forward and not sin again. He acknowledged what she had done wrong - but he didn’t beat her up for it.

When people come to the forum looking for help - lets keep that in mind.

 

[EasterJoy]

While destruction is sometimes the work of two, it only takes one to make a marriage fail.

It takes two to make a marriage last.

It takes three to make a marriage what marriage is intended to be!

 

[TheRealJuliane]

I think this is a great point. I know I am guilty of feeling justified for my own behavior and condemning of my husband for his. And I am the one who came to this forum, so you are hearing only MY side of the problems. He has an equally valid perspective, which you will not hear. I have to own my part of the problem, and try to keep my own side of the street clean, if you will, and not point my finger at him. He’s not perfect, but neither am I.

In the case of adultery, it is difficult to see the other party as having any part at all. And it could be true, that the spouse committing adultery just has bad character. But there could be things going on in the marriage that BOTH husband and wife need to address. At the very least, if they are to survive as a team, they will both need to address those problems in counseling.

 

[kbachler]

While destruction is sometimes the work of two, it only takes one to make a marriage fail.

It takes two to make a marriage last.

It takes three to make a marriage what marriage is intended to be!

In terms of perhaps a “final cause” I agree that it may take only one - but there are typically many causes prior to the last one - and I think that we are agreeing on that (when you say “destruction is sometimes the work of two.”

As many of you know, my wife and I have been in counseling now, for nearly two years. We both bring issues to the table. We both have contributed to the difficulties in our marriage. We both want it to succeed, and sometimes its very hard (for each of us individually) when we seem to be stuck and can’t just move on. But we were united for 20+ years in being good parents, in doing good for others - but not in doing good for US. So we have a lot of history - but a lot of it isn’t particularly useful for US - and its often even harmful for US. That said, I do think we are making and continue to make progress.

When we see the things that happened to us as children, that are impactful on us, that continue to have an influence in our lives as adults - its not hard to understand the reality of the concept of original sin. Its handed down in our parenting mistakes (no matter how hard we try) and will influence our children. But they will have to deal with their shortcomings and how to handle them, just as we deal with ours.

 

[kbachler]

I think this is a great point. I know I am guilty of feeling justified for my own behavior and condemning of my husband for his. And I am the one who came to this forum, so you are hearing only MY side of the problems. He has an equally valid perspective, which you will not hear. I have to own my part of the problem, and try to keep my own side of the street clean, if you will, and not point my finger at him. He’s not perfect, but neither am I.

In the case of adultery, it is difficult to see the other party as having any part at all. And it could be true, that the spouse committing adultery just has bad character. But there could be things going on in the marriage that BOTH husband and wife need to address. At the very least, if they are to survive as a team, they will both need to address those problems in counseling.

We need love and validation; in addition, sex is one of 4 things naturally craved by the brain (food, water and sleep being the other three.) If one partner “holds out” on the other (a phrase I dislike - but for the sake of brevity) then its understandable that the other party may falter. Not acceptable - but understandable.

 

[EasterJoy]

In terms of perhaps a “final cause” I agree that it may take only one - but there are typically many causes prior to the last one - and I think that we are agreeing on that (when you say “destruction is sometimes the work of two.”

It takes a more profound selfishness and self-centeredness to forsake a spouse who is totally innocent than a spouse who has actually done something to drive a wedge into the marriage, but sadly, it does happen. A spouse who is abandoned or betrayed does well to look for his or her own fault, but he or she should not be under the impression that such a fault must exist. Sometimes a spouse is abandoned who deserved the most faithful treatment in the world. I don’t know what is more sad. I would never want to pile false guilt onto someone who had already been so wronged. That’s all I mean to say.

 

[joanofarc2008]

While destruction is sometimes the work of two, it only takes one to make a marriage fail.

It takes two to make a marriage last.

It takes three to make a marriage what marriage is intended to be!

Can I use this as a facebook status?

 

[EasterJoy]

Can I use this as a facebook status?

Sure! I’m flattered.

 

[joanofarc2008]

Sure! I’m flattered.

Thanks.

 

[kbachler]

It takes a more profound selfishness and self-centeredness to forsake a spouse who is totally innocent than a spouse who has actually done something to drive a wedge into the marriage, but sadly, it does happen. A spouse who is abandoned or betrayed does well to look for his or her own fault, but he or she should not be under the impression that such a fault must exist. Sometimes a spouse is abandoned who deserved the most faithful treatment in the world. I don’t know what is more sad. I would never want to pile false guilt onto someone who had already been so wronged. That’s all I mean to say.

Nods.

 

[kbachler]

Part 1

SNIP
As many of you know, my wife and I have been in counseling now, for nearly two years. We both bring issues to the table. We both have contributed to the difficulties in our marriage. We both want it to succeed, and sometimes its very hard (for each of us individually) when we seem to be stuck and can’t just move on. But we were united for 20+ years in being good parents, in doing good for others - but not in doing good for US. So we have a lot of history - but a lot of it isn’t particularly useful for US - and its often even harmful for US. That said, I do think we are making and continue to make progress.

When we see the things that happened to us as children, that are impactful on us, that continue to have an influence in our lives as adults - its not hard to understand the reality of the concept of original sin. Its handed down in our parenting mistakes (no matter how hard we try) and will influence our children. But they will have to deal with their shortcomings and how to handle them, just as we deal with ours.

I just felt like sharing; hopefully this will inspire those who have their own struggles.

For various reasons, I have a difficult time communicating my feelings. A key reason, of course, is that I am male and therefore handicapped in this arena . But there are other reasons also. As a child - I was long the “baby” of the family - with older brothers who - naturally enough - liked to tease their younger brother. Not so bad, but dating back to that point (and even some memories from when I was a year old that are a bit too graphic for here) I was told, as a child, that I shouldn’t feel a certain way, or not to feel a certain way, etc. There wasn’t validation of my feeling and then growth in how to handle it - my parents (probably like many) shorthanded things and I was told simply to “not feel” certain things. (Later on there were eventually two more siblings I went from being the youngest to being the oldest!)

In a nutshell, my feelings were invalidated, consistently, for many years.

Compounding this, I was a bright child. I had excellent grades, read a great deal (in addition to playing sports.) I grew up mainly around adults - I lived in a semi-rural setting so it wasn’t until I was around 8 or so that I could routinely see children my age. I spent a great deal of my formative years playing on my own - and thus in my own head. My conversations were primarily with me.

Further compounding this were some events when I was 11 going on 12. As a sixth grader I spend a great deal of time with my 6th grade teacher. He was a new teacher, young, a year older than my oldest brother and was from our small town. He spent extra time teachin me after school, sometimes for hours. He taught me algebra - we read books together (particularly Frankenstein.) I met his fiancee. She was also a teacher and she actually worked with my aunt’s mother in another local school (my aunt’s family lived next door!) I was invited to the wedding.

Two weeks before the wedding, my teacher brutally murdered his fiancee. I was asked to, and agreed to, testify in his murder trial as a character witness. When I was told of the murder, my mother eventually said “Are you ok?” I - being 11 - said yes - and of course was wrong. But no further mention, no further request was ever made to me to discuss it.

Again - it seemed like my feelings didn’t matter.

(Oddly enough, this pattern happened a few times - my feelings didn’t matter - but when a difficult situation arose I was often left to make the decision on my own with no guidance.)

Three months later - on the ides of March - my oldest brother died in an automobile accident while away at college. We discovered after-the-fact that he was driving to nearby town to purchase an engagement ring for his girlfriend’s birthday. We didn’t know about her birthday - and his funeral was on that day.

The day he died, my next older brother - who had been extraordinarily close to my oldest brother - picked me up from a friends house - I was there playing basketball. About the time that my brother’s head was being struck by the car’s motor as it was shoved through the car - I was hit in the head in the game and started bleeding profusely from my nose and lips.

Shortly thereafter my brother picked me up to take me home. On the way he calmly and seemingly dispassionately told me that my oldest brother was dead. And then explained that he and I could not cry, could not show our emotions, because of how difficult this would be on my mom and dad. Again - my feelings didn’t matter.

He never cried in front of anyone the whole time. At the funeral, (remember this was the late 1960’s) the funeral director shared with all of us a “pill to keep us calm.” I didn’t take mine.

(continued in next post)

 

[kbachler]

Part 2

(continued from prior post)

So as an adult - not surprisingly, I’ve had to do a lot of work to have, to own, and to express my feelings. I’ve worked on this before, but in our marriage trials I found that 1) Some of the prior work had faded away and 2) I needed to go deeper than I had the first time.

My wife has had to work on certain things too - I’ll leave those for another discussion.

With the above, rambling pre-amble, we have felt of late that we are beginning to talk better, be closer, communicate more fully.

I got an odd example of this about a week ago, in an odd way.

We were shopping at Costco - and were standing in line waiting to check out. In line a ways ahead of us was a tall, thin, buxom, blonde, wearing a micro jean skirt, a leapord pattern low cut blouse, and leopard pattern boots. She was there with a husband or boyfriend, and her presence was very conspicuous. My wife pointed her out, and I commented on how over-the-top her attire was - and that I didn’t find her attractive. This surprised my wife, who commented that she would have thought otherwise. I noted that sexy doesn’t have to be that overt, and being that overt isn’t necessarily sexy. Moreover, she just didn’t look happy - rather - sad and bored. Without trying to be crass I noted that the result was that she looked like she was dressed for work - rather than for trying to please herself or her bf/dh. Our conversation eventually turned to something else.

My wife and I were talking yesterday, and I commented that I found this conversation particularly meaningful in terms of how we are doing - that sometimes its the little things that give the biggest indication. She asked why. I said “Well, in the past, if I had mentioned another woman in any way, you would have thought that I really was attracted no matter what I said - and because of this, in the past I would have frankly been afraid to even have the discussion with you.”

She replied “So we had a normal conversation - huh?” I agreed - and we both smiled.