Mary and the Holy Apostolate of Motherhood

[daniellet]

I am a Protestant (Presbyterian) in the process of converting to Catholocism. I am having some problems understanding what the Catholic Church’s teachings are in regards to the role of Mary. My concerns are arising as a result of reading “The Apostolate of Holy Motherhood” which records apparitions of Mary and Christ in 1987 to an anonymous mother of 3 children. This is somewhat ironic because Mary essentially led me to consider Catholocism after spending my entire Protestant life being very anti-Catholic. I began to consider the Catholic Church because I felt that Protestants were sorely missing the mark when it came to motherhood and family life in general. After reading Humane Vitae and On The Role of the Christian Family in the Modern World, I was convinced that the Catholic Church did indeed protect Truth. I concluded that the reason Protestants don’t have a beautifully developed idea of the family being the Domestic Church is because they are so darn afraid of Mary. They minimize the role of Mary as Mother of God and minimize the importance of mothers in the Domestic Church.

Now, after that long winded introduction, here are my problems:

If Mary is supposed to play such a huge role in our lives, why aren’t there more passages in scripture to support this? The main support I can see is when Jesus says to his disciple while on the cross “Son, behold your mother”.

Why do we need help from Mary beyond intercession? Can she even provide any further help?

In “The Apostolate of Holy Motherhood” Mary tells Mariamante of her “plans”. Isn’t God the only one who makes plans?

If God is all knowing and all powerful, why do we need the help and guidance of Mary (or any of the other Saints for that matter)?

In the booklet the Christ child says that he desires all to come to him through the Immaculate Heart of Mary. I really don’t understand this. The bible says to me that we can come to Jesus directly. I love Jesus with all my heart and soul and have talked to him and walked with him since I was a child. I don’t want to have to go through someone else to get to Him. Am I misunderstanding something?

Here is a line in the booklet that I have huge problems with: “I wish only the priests to be involved with the discernment of spirits and things of this nature” (said by the Christ child). How can this be so when I John 4:1 says “Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits, whether they are of God; because many false prophets have gone out into the world.”

I really love the substance of this booklet which essentially calls mothers to holiness through a life of prayer and service to their families. I am fearful because I wonder (yes because of my Protestant ways probably) if this is in fact Satan appearing as an angel of light with a glorious message attached to a sufficient lie to lead us away from the Son.

The booklet emphasizes devotion to Mary and being consecrated to her. But what about Hebrews 12:1,2 which says “…let us run with endurance the race that is set before us, looking unto Jesus, the author and finisher of our faith…” This verse does not say, looking unto Mary.

Thank you anyone who has actually read this whole thing and I appreciate any insights you can give me. I really love Catholocism but I’m really hung up on my questions about Mary.

 

[Pray4Life]

I am rather clumsy at explaining things, so I’m sure you’ll get a better answer from someone else. But I still feel compelled to give it a try, as I don’t have my apologetic motor in gear, apparently And I do love our Blessed Mother.

The biggest point I want to address is the concept of going to Jesus through Mary, which you seem to be having trouble with. The most beautiful and simple explanation of this I have seen is from “True Devotion to Mary” by St. Louis de Montfort, and my paraphrased summary is this: Jesus could have come to us by any means whatsoever. He did not HAVE to be born of our Lady. But He chose her before the beginning of time for this purpose. When you consider that all of Jesus’ life was an example to us of how to live (and believe me, this is a very rich well of meditation, especially if you approach the mysteries of the Rosary from this perspective!), and consider that He came to us through Mary, and then went so far as to give her to us as our Mother while dying on the cross, you can easily see how important our Blessed Mother must be! He came through Mary, and so we go to Him through the same means He used to come to us- Mary. We follow His example in imitation of Him.

This does not mean you can’t address Jesus directly. You can ALWAYS go directly to our Lord. But you can also go through our Blessed Mother, taking her as your advocate, and this is arguably a better way. St. Louis de Montfort gave a good example in his book of why to do this, but I interpreted it according to MY life: my mother is not thrilled with my husband. If he gave her a gift directly, she would accept it, but she would accept it with much more joy if it came from my hands, because I am more pleasing to her than my husband is- bluntly she likes me better So it is with Mary and Jesus. Jesus does not dislike us, don’t get me wrong here- it’s obviously not a perfect example . But as Mary is without sin and perfectly conformed to His will and to His image, the most “blessed among women,” “our fallen nature’s solitary boast,” the gifts that come from her hands can’t help but please him more than the gifts we, sinful and weak, try to give on our own. Mary takes us and makes us and our prayers more pleasing to God, because she is our good Mother who loves us, and because she can do nothing else. All that is directed to our Blessed Mother, she gives to Jesus, just as she did all during her earthly life- a perfect example being the Magnificat. When she was praised, what did she do? She immediately turned to God and praised Him.

So I go the long way around to explain that no, we do not “look to Mary” when we “run with endurance the race” (etc.) We look to Jesus. Mary is our path, not our destination. She is the means, not the outcome. Another poster on these forums has a signature I love that goes something like “all true Marian devotion begins and ends with Jesus” (only it’s longer than that and much better, believe me!) If she has “plans” they are God’s plans because they can be nothing else- she is perfectly conformed to His will, as we see in the very example of her life.

Continued in next post

 

[Pray4Life]

Now, Mary is the epitome of humility. Her role in Jesus’ life, though a rich one, is a quiet one in the Bible. There is a theory, forgive me but I forgot where I read it, it may have been the same book I’ve already referenced, that not too much mention was made of her, because she was so good a Mother, such a beautiful and blessed woman, that to give her more emphasis, a more prominent role, in the time and place when she still walked the earth would have distracted from Jesus. Now that we can see the “big picture,” now that the work of redemption has been completed, there is no fear of such distraction. We can see the whole assembled puzzle rather than just the pieces, in other words. We need never fear honoring Mary too much, just like you would not think to worry about praising a good book too much, for fear of taking away from its author. It takes nothing away from the author to praise his work, but far from it, it adds to his honor! And so it is with Mary. (I know that may be a bit of a tangent, but I am a convert myself and it is one of the things that concerned me initially about Marian devotion, so I thought I’d throw that in there for you ! ).

So you ask, why do we need Mary. And I propose: Jesus did not need Mary, but He chose her anyhow, and that cannot be insignificant. We need Mary because Jesus gave her to us because He knew we would need a LOT of help. He gave us everything to bring us to Himself. He gave Himself on the cross and in the Holy Eucharist. He gave His Holy Spirit to us. He gave us the priesthood through St. Peter and his disciples. He gave us His Blessed Mother. I really don’t understand your question about “if God is all knowing and all powerful” why would we need Mary and the saints. I don’t understand how needing Mary and the saints would diminish God’s omnipotence, for example. It is not a reflection on God’s omnipotence if we need help. It is a reflection on our decided lack of omnipotence. It is a true sign of His MERCY that He has given us these avenues of help.

Now I have said all that and I know I probably haven’t addressed everything in your message (I’m sorry, I know I’m long winded) but I will add this: We are not obligated to believe private revelations. What I mean is this, and I may be saying this clumsily, but it is my understanding (and someone please correct me if I’m off base here!) but we are not obligated to believe in the apparitions at Lourdes, for example, even though they were approved by the Church. Likewise we are not obligated to believe the book you are referring to or place our faith in it. These things can be helpful to our faith and our understanding, but there is no obligation involved.

That said, and this may not be a popular view, I have read the book you’re referring to. It is not one of my favorites, that’s for sure. I felt like everything in it has been said before, and in some cases more clearly, by various saints through the ages. It is nice it is all put together and everything, and that it emphasizes the mother’s role in service to her family, which admittedly can be lacking in other sources, but it doesn’t take a lot to apply that same teaching from what certain saints have taught to ALL Christians to motherhood. I was not impressed by it. Anyway I took the line you’re having problems with as meaning that we are to trust our priests and defer to their judgment in spiritual matters, rather than relying on ourselves and our own wisdom, which is usually lacking in these things.

I hope this helps. If I’m at all off on any of this, someone please correct me! I am always learning myself. And welcome to the Church

PS. I am editing this to add that you really must look at the thread on “What is really Mary’s role” in this same forum. Very good thread!

 

[mrS4ntA]

Excellent reply I, too, always look up to St Louis deMontfort to reply questions like this. To daniellet, I really recommend True Devotion to the Blessed Virgin Mary, by St. Louis deMontfort – you’ll find all your answers there.

In Christ through Mary,
S4ntA.

 

[gomer_tree]

I doubt I have much to offer in addition with regard to your questions on Mary, but I’ll offer one other insight: the Marian doctrines are very often the most difficult doctrines for converts to accept. I have read more than one testimony that stated that once they believed in the Church teachings on the Eucharist, confession, the Pope, apostolic succession, infant baptism, contraception (another difficult one for many), and so on that at some point these people said “if the Church is right about all these other things, then I will just have to trust that she’s right about Mary.”

Scott Hahn has a good accounting of this struggle in his book “Rome Sweet Home.” I think he went so far as to force himself to say the Rosary and apologize to God beforehand, just in case it was offensive to Him.

Obviously, God blessed him with the grace to understand, as he later wrote the book “Hail Holy Queen,” which I believe would be a great read for you and answer most of your questions.

 

[martymana]

Hi - what separates the Catholic Church from the Protestant church is tradition and also
the succession of the Pope. You must not only go to scripture but also to the tradition of the church and the Pope who we believe is inspired by the Holy Spirit.

This is an interesting answer to the veneration of Mary"
catholicconvert.com/Portals/0/QueenOfHeaven.pdf

Also, for a great reference purchase the Catechism of the Catholic Church as it
states the church’s traditons and beliefs. As Catholics, we not only look a scripture but
also to the Pope for understanding and direction.
Blessings,
Maria

 

[Evan]

When you speak of “Can’t we go to Jesus directly?” I’m always reminded of the prayer Jesus taught. The “Our Father”. So back at you with “Can’t we go to the Father directly, why do we need Jesus? Why do we need the Holy Spirit to teach us to pray?”

I have a very limited relationship with Mary. I’ve never liked the rosary. All the words get in the way of contemplating the Life of Jesus and a relationship with the Father, etc. On the other hand, my mother has said a rosary every day since high school (70 years).

The teachings about Mary are to assist you to find and live a life in relationship with God. I find I build a better relationship in the silence of Eucharistic Adoration than in the words of the Rosary (although I do say one a couple times a month).

I have several prayers I regularly say to Saints (including Mary) but that does not limit me, nor does the “Our Father” restrict me from praying to Jesus and the Holy Spirit.

The Church consistently teaches that the answer to most question like
“Should I pray to Mary or to Jesus” is BOTH
not one or the other
but one and the other and one through the other.