Mary "can't"? Why not?

[Alexius]

Yes, in fact, looking at this

"Hail [Mary] full of grace,
The Lord is with thee,

Luke 1:28
And the angel being come in, said unto her:
“Hail, full of grace, the Lord is with thee: blessed art thou among women.”

which of course if from that “Anatomy of a Prayer”

That particular part is the basis of the fact that Mary is sinless, is it not? The “full of grace” part…it has to do with the actual Greek word used which I think is special in some way.

“Full of grace” is used as a title, almost like a name. That is part of the basis for her sinlessness, yes…

Prayers and petitions,
Alexius

 

[2ndGen]

Full of grace…

The original Aramaic text has it as “full of grace”.

Luke 1:28
And the angel settled near her and said to her,
“Peace be with you,
…full of grace,
The Lord is with you,
…blessed among women.”

Full of grace, full of God’s favour. One can in no way be in God’s favour whilst one is in sin. Because Jesus hadn’t made the sacrifice needed to free anyone of their stain of original sin, Mary couldn’t have been full of grace if she had sin (even original sin). So, she had to have been preserved since before birth.

Besides, Mary called God her saviour.
God formed us all in the womb.
When God formed the one who would bear his son,
do you think he formed her sinful?

Another way of looking at it,
would you send your kid to school in a filthy school bus,
or a spanking brand new school bus
if you had the choice?

The loving parent would of course send their child to school in a new clean (immaculately clean) school bus.

Would God Who is perfect have sent Jesus to earth in anything less? Doesn’t His Son, especially One sent to earth to die for us at the very least deserve the absolute best?

Besides, Mary cannot have had any sin.
The fruit of her womb was Jesus.
She is the tree that produced that fruit.
As Jesus said, no rotten tree can produce a good fruit.

If we judge the tree by it’s fruit,
and Jesus is the fruit of Mary,
how are we to judge Mary?

 

[blossom02]

This is the most beautiful thread I have read. Our Lord only deserved the best Mother and Mary was certainly choosen by the Father for the Son.

If we could creat our own mother wouldn’t we make her perfect in everyway.

Thank you for your wonderful thoughts.

 

[2ndGen]

This is the most beautiful thread I have read. Our Lord only deserved the best Mother and Mary was certainly choosen by the Father for the Son.

If we could creat our own mother wouldn’t we make her perfect in everyway.

Thank you for your wonderful thoughts.

It’s easy when talking about Mom.

 

[2ndGen]

So, since no one’s offered any evidence (scripturally or otherwise) that Mary “can’t” pray for us, it must mean that she can pray for us, right?

 

[episcogirl]

So, since no one’s offered any evidence (scripturally or otherwise) that Mary “can’t” pray for us, it must mean that she can pray for us, right?

Well, how about this. I can try to form a “logical” argument such as this:

I can ask any other human being on the face of the planet earth to pray for me. They might, they might not. Right? Like I could ask my good friend to pray for me. That is a valid request. Mary is a human being. Well, she was alive at one point, now she is alive but not here on earth. She must be one of the most loving people that God ever made. My request to Mary to pray for me must be at least as equal to (if not more than) my request to my good friend.

I’m awfully tired. This was my best shot at it, though. I know it’s a bit weak but it looks as if it is something even someone who doesn’t agree with all this Mary “stuff” could agree with.

 

[angelusm]

“Mary can’t heal you!”
“Mary can’t do anything for you!”
“Mary can’t pray for you!”

Ok, so Mary can’t do this,
but Peter could?
Paul could?
Benny Hinn can?

Why is it that we are taught that whoever believes in Jesus,
they would be able to heal people, EXCEPT Mary?

What excludes Mary
(besides post 16th century humanly derived doctrines)
from being “just” like the rest of us?

Mary can’t do these things that were promised to EVERY Believer?

Why not?

Wasn’t Mary the FIRST Christian and the FIRST Believer?

While some boast of having Jesus “in” them,
Mary is the only one who can literally say that she had Jesus “IN” her.

So why is it that this “handmaid of The Lord”
is the only human being who CAN’T pray for us?

CAN’T heal us in Jesus’ name?

CAN’T do anything for us?

So I could pray for you, I could heal you, I could intercede on your behalf,
me, a lowly sinner, but Mary, who was praised by The Archangel Gabriel as being “full of grace”, with whom God was with, the Mother of our Lord, The Blessed, can’t?

Why “can’t” Mary “can’t”?

Mary can’t heal you, she can do a lot for you, she can pray for you and God can heal you. Peter or Paul didn’t heal, it was their faith and their prayer, God healed people. Who “WE” are taught to believe that Mary can’t do anything for us? That’s what protestants say, bu that’s wrong. When protestants thank “Mary”, they immediately think about the Catholic Church. And all negative emotions and feelings thay have against the CC, they also turn against Mary. We can pray and should expects miracles, and we also should ask Mary to pray for us and miralles will also happen just like it happened many times in the past.

 

[paarsurrey]

So why is it that this “handmaid of The Lord”
is the only human being who CAN’T pray for us?

Hi

I think one should only pray to GodAllahYHWH directly and to no-one else. In stead of asking Mary praying for you, which she cannot do as she died naturally ; one should pray for her if one loves her.

This is what I believe

Thanks

 

[Nancy47]

The beautiful thing about opening up one’s heart to Mary is that it brings you closer to Jesus.

See? We work to fellowship with our fellow Christians of different denominations, why exclude the First Christian in history?

On top of all of that, if someone loved your mother, would that bring them closer to you? Imagine how much closer a person is to Jesus Christ is that loves His mother when one of His dieing wishes was that we all loved each other (including and “not” excluding His beloved Blessed Mother) as He loved us?

“How” did He love His mother?

“As” a mother.

If we obeyed His wish literally, we’d love her as our mother too because He is our brother and God our mutual Father.

Mary doesn’t take away from Jesus. She adds on to Jesus.

Like I’ve said before, while the anti-Marian is busy explaining to Jesus why he spent so much time belittling her role in Jesus’ life and in her sacrificing her only Son for us, I’ll be running to Mary for my big hug (even though she’ll probably give me a good talking to for being overly aggressive sometimes in defending her! LOL).

Then, she’ll call over the anti-Marian Christian to her and forgive him and give him a hug equally strong to the one she gave me, not putting any of her children above the other.

Very good post!

 

[Nancy47]

Mary can’t heal you, she can do a lot for you, she can pray for you and God can heal you. Peter or Paul didn’t heal, it was their faith and their prayer, God healed people. Who “WE” are taught to believe that Mary can’t do anything for us? That’s what protestants say, bu that’s wrong. When protestants thank “Mary”, they immediately think about the Catholic Church. And all negative emotions and feelings thay have against the CC, they also turn against Mary. We can pray and should expects miracles, and we also should ask Mary to pray for us and miralles will also happen just like it happened many times in the past.

Not all Protestants regard Mary(the Holy Mother) that way…Some of us put her in High Esteem, as a caring, Loving Mother…who is watching over us, and protects us and our children…We also respect the Catholic Church and look to them for guidance…we just have a few differences

 

[flameburns623]

“Mary can’t heal you!”
“Mary can’t do anything for you!”
“Mary can’t pray for you!”

OK, so Mary can’t do this,
but Peter could?
Paul could?
Benny Hinn can?

Why is it that we are taught that whoever believes in Jesus,
they would be able to heal people, EXCEPT Mary?

What excludes Mary
(besides post 16th century humanly derived doctrines)
from being “just” like the rest of us?

Mary can’t do these things that were promised to EVERY Believer?

Why not?

Wasn’t Mary the FIRST Christian and the FIRST Believer?

While some boast of having Jesus “in” them,
Mary is the only one who can literally say that she had Jesus “IN” her.

So why is it that this “handmaid of The Lord”
is the only human being who CAN’T pray for us?

CAN’T heal us in Jesus’ name?

CAN’T do anything for us?

So I could pray for you, I could heal you, I could intercede on your behalf,
me, a lowly sinner, but Mary, who was praised by The Archangel Gabriel as being “full of grace”, with whom God was with, the Mother of our Lord, The Blessed, can’t?

Why “can’t” Mary “can’t”?

Because Mary–and Peter–and Paul–and the various departed Saints, canonized or otherwise, have passed out of this realm of existence. They can’t hear you. They cannot act upon nor influence this realm of existence directly. They are not even aware any longer of this realm of existence: their awareness is focused entirely upon the Beatific Vision, so far as we can tell. We can be sure they do in fact pray for us here on Earth, but they do NOT pray for us based upon any ‘prayers’ directed their way by we on Earth. They don’t have any way of knowing that human beings on Earth are ‘praying to’ them. They have no way of knowing the content of any of those prayers. There is no mail service, no phone service, no e-mail between Earth and Heaven, and Heaven and Earth are far apart and wholly distinct one from another.

Which raises yet another issue from a Protestant point-of-view: prayer is, properly understood within Christian theology, worship. And worship can never be properly addressed to any being other than God Almighty: Father, Son, or Holy Spirit. That is why no Godly being in the Scriptures–neither human being nor angel–ever permits any person to kneel to or to pray to them. Objectively, Roman Catholics and Eastern Orthodox commit a serious sin every time they kneel before any image with the intention of doing homage to that image or to any non-Divine person it represents. Objectively, Roman Catholics commit a serious sin every time they ‘pray’ to anyone other than God. I believe and hope that God winks at the ignorance of Roman Catholics in what they do, but it is one of the things that is seriously wrong within Catholic practice and theology.

While she dwelt in a tabernacle of flesh and blood, Mary perhaps could have done any of those miraculous things that the Apostles did, though there are no reliable recorded record of such things attributed to her. But she has left her corpse a-mouldering in the earth, “Dormition” or “Assumption” notwithstanding, and she is now awaiting a new Heaven and a new Earth where her corruptible shall put on an incorruptible body, just as all the Redeemed shall do.

 

[Goth_Catholic]

Because Mary–and Peter–and Paul–and the various departed Saints, canonized or otherwise, have passed out of this realm of existence. They can’t hear you. They cannot act upon nor influence this realm of existence directly. They are not even aware any longer of this realm of existence: their awareness is focused entirely upon the Beatific Vision, so far as we can tell. We can be sure they do in fact pray for us here on Earth, but they do NOT pray for us based upon any ‘prayers’ directed their way by we on Earth. They don’t have any way of knowing that human beings on Earth are ‘praying to’ them. They have no way of knowing the content of any of those prayers. There is no mail service, no phone service, no e-mail between Earth and Heaven, and Heaven and Earth are far apart and wholly distinct one from another.

“An angel came and stood at the altar with a golden censer; and he was given much incense to mingle with the prayers of all the saints upon the golden altar before the throne; and the smoke of the incense rose with the prayers of the saints from the hand of the angel before God” (Rev. 8:3-4)."Just because Mary–and Peter–and Paul–and the various departed Saints, canonized or otherwise, have passed out of this realm of existence. doesn’t mean they can’t hear you. They can act upon and influence this realm of existence by going through Christ. They are aware of this realm of existence. We can be sure they do in fact pray for us here on Earth,and they do pray for us based upon prayers directed their way by us on Earth. They have a way of knowing that human beings on Earth are praying to them and of knowing the content of all of those prayers. Heaven and Earth are far apart and wholly distinct one from another, but Heaven is not blind to the workings of Earth.
Which raises yet another issue from a Protestant point-of-view: prayer is, properly understood within Christian theology, worship. And worship can never be properly addressed to any being other than God Almighty: Father, Son, or Holy Spirit. That is why no Godly being in the Scriptures–neither human being nor angel–ever permits any person to kneel to or to pray to them.
Which raises the issue from a Catholic point-of-view: prayer is,properly understood within Christian theology, asking. And asking can be properly addressed to any being, not just God Almighty: Father, Son or Holy Spirit. That is why Godly beings in the Scriptures tell every person to pray for themselves and for each other.
Objectively, Roman Catholics and Eastern Orthodox commit a serious sin every time they kneel before any image with the intention of doing homage to that image or to any non-Divine person it represents. Objectively, Roman Catholics commit a serious sin every time they ‘pray’ to anyone other than God. I believe and hope that God winks at the ignorance of Roman Catholics in what they do, but it is one of the things that is seriously wrong within Catholic practice and theology.
Objectively, Protestants commit a serious sin every time they ignore Our Lady and the saints with the intention of avoiding them because of flawed thinking. Objectively, Protestants commit a serious sin every time they “mock” prayer to Our Lady and the saints. I belive and hope God winks at the ignorance of Protestants in what they do, but it is one of the things that is seriously wrong within Protestant practice and theology.
While she dwelt in a tabernacle of flesh and blood, Mary perhaps could have done any of those miraculous things that the Apostles did, though there are no reliable recorded record of such things attributed to her. But she has left her corpse a-mouldering in the earth, “Dormition” or “Assumption” notwithstanding, and she is now awaiting a new Heaven and a new Earth where her corruptible shall put on an incorruptible body, just as all the Redeemed shall do.

She dwells in a tabernacle of flesh and blood, Mary has done all of the miraculous things that the Apostles did, as evident at Fatima and Lourdes to name a few. Her body and soul were never seperated, at her death her Son commanded angels to bring her body and soul into Heaven where she was crowned Queen because her Son could not see his mother’s body, which carried him for nine months, become corrupted.

There. I corrected everything wrong with your post. No thank yous are needed.

 

[hosemonkey]

Because Mary–and Peter–and Paul–and the various departed Saints, canonized or otherwise, have passed out of this realm of existence. They can’t hear you. They cannot act upon nor influence this realm of existence directly. They are not even aware any longer of this realm of existence: their awareness is focused entirely upon the Beatific Vision, so far as we can tell. We can be sure they do in fact pray for us here on Earth, but they do NOT pray for us based upon any ‘prayers’ directed their way by we on Earth. They don’t have any way of knowing that human beings on Earth are ‘praying to’ them. They have no way of knowing the content of any of those prayers. There is no mail service, no phone service, no e-mail between Earth and Heaven, and Heaven and Earth are far apart and wholly distinct one from another.

Which raises yet another issue from a Protestant point-of-view: prayer is, properly understood within Christian theology, worship. And worship can never be properly addressed to any being other than God Almighty: Father, Son, or Holy Spirit. That is why no Godly being in the Scriptures–neither human being nor angel–ever permits any person to kneel to or to pray to them. Objectively, Roman Catholics and Eastern Orthodox commit a serious sin every time they kneel before any image with the intention of doing homage to that image or to any non-Divine person it represents. Objectively, Roman Catholics commit a serious sin every time they ‘pray’ to anyone other than God. I believe and hope that God winks at the ignorance of Roman Catholics in what they do, but it is one of the things that is seriously wrong within Catholic practice and theology.

While she dwelt in a tabernacle of flesh and blood, Mary perhaps could have done any of those miraculous things that the Apostles did, though there are no reliable recorded record of such things attributed to her. But she has left her corpse a-mouldering in the earth, “Dormition” or “Assumption” notwithstanding, and she is now awaiting a new Heaven and a new Earth where her corruptible shall put on an incorruptible body, just as all the Redeemed shall do.

Where then, is the tomb of the Blessed Mother?