Masturbation within marriage -- unitive and procreative?

[Anselma]

2352 By masturbation is to be understood the deliberate stimulation of the genital organs in order to derive sexual pleasure. "Both the Magisterium of the Church, in the course of a constant tradition, and the moral sense of the faithful have been in no doubt and have firmly maintained that masturbation is an intrinsically and gravely disordered action."138 “The deliberate use of the sexual faculty, for whatever reason, outside of marriage is essentially contrary to its purpose.” For here sexual pleasure is sought outside of "the sexual relationship which is demanded by the moral order and in which the total meaning of mutual self-giving and human procreation in the context of true love is achieved."139

So here’s the deal. I’m having trouble reconciling the above with the whole JPII argument that women should be having orgasms (within marriage and with their husbands obviously). The vast majority of women require direct clitoral stimulation to orgasm, yet the above quote seems to come from the position that masturbation is something that occurs when intercourse is not available. What about masturbation as a part of intercourse as an aid to both the unitive and procreative purpose? No offense to the Catechism or JPII, but they’re not really covering the issue, but merely repeating that sex outside of marriage is wrong.

Any guidance on this issue would be appreciated!

 

[Anselma]

I have also just found this from Vincent Genovesi, a professor at St. Josephs:

According to the Church’s traditional teaching, it is neither unnatural, perverted, nor immoral for couples to seek sexual stimulation and arousal by means of oral (…) intercourse, but such activity should not be continued to the point of orgasm… Sexual climax, however, is to occur only after vaginal penetration… On another matter of marital sexuality, some wives may need reassurance. Should it happen that she fails to achieve sexual fulfillment in the act of sexual intercourse, a woman is morally permitted, according to the Church’s teaching, to seek and achieve orgasm by other means.

So is this correct?: both oral stimulation and genital stimulation are okay depending on the intent and circumstance.

Thanks again!

 

[tafan]

It is oftern the first sentence that causes the confusion in paragraph 2352 “2352 By masturbation is to be understood the deliberate stimulation of the genital organs in order to derive sexual pleasure”. Now, if you stop reading at that point, it would seem like even sexual intercourse itself falls under this definition. But surely the Church is not calling sex between a husband and wife masturbation.

So read on: " The deliberate use of the sexual faculty, for whatever reason, outside of marriage is essentially contrary to its purpose." For here sexual pleasure is sought outside of “the sexual relationship which is demanded by the moral order and in which the total meaning of mutual self-giving and human procreation in the context of true love is achieved”

In it is all about sexual pleasure outside of the marriage act.

I think the terminology and phrasing of the catechism is unfortunate. In the old days, the moral theologians often used the term Onanism, and that was a more precise term. It also happened to be a broader term, since it include contraception.

Actually, paragraph 2352 also should be interrepted to include contraception. Because when usign contraception, even sex is “the deliberate stimulation of the genital organs in order to derive sexual pleasure” and nothing else.

 

[Anselma]

Because when using contraception, even sex is “the deliberate stimulation of the genital organs in order to derive sexual pleasure” and nothing else.

Whoah. You just blew my mind with that one! I’ve never thought about it like that before. And yes, the wording is unfortunate because, as I said previously, I don’t think it really covers the issue and makes it clear to people.

 

[WingsOfEagles]

Are you talking about “touching” each other? I think that falls under foreplay…

 

[Nate13]

A male orgasm is directly pointed towards procreation in its nature and if it is sought outside of normal intercourse it is in contradiction of human nature. A female orgasm is not directly pointed towards procreation. A female orgasm is only pointed towards procreation in the same sense that all sexual pleasure is, in that it helps to bond a married couple together as “one body”. This indirectly relates to the procreative meaning of sex in that the purpose of bonding a married couple together is so they are there to provide for the child the sexual act may possibly bring into being.

This is why the Church has taught that the husband helping his wife to orgasm whether manually or orally is in conformity with the nature of man.