Medjugorje visionaries speaking at parishes

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I know that the Medjugorje phenomenon itself is a banned topic, so hopefully this thread won’t vear off there. I have been asked by a member of my Scripture Study class whether it is okay to go and hear/see one of the visionaries, Ivan Dragicevic. He is in fact scheduled to speak at a parish in our diocese - and apparently, speaks (and perhaps experiences his reported visions) in parishes all over the country. Do local ordinaries review these kinds of things, and how does that mesh with the authority of the local in Bosnia?

I’m inclined to suggest that the woman in my class, who is quite devout but very, very impressionable and rather weak in her doctrinal education, not take her family to see him. But - wonder what others may think?
 
NHInsider said:
I k. I have been asked by a member of my Scripture Study class whether it is okay to go and hear/see one of the visionaries, Ivan Dragicevic. He is in fact scheduled to speak at a parish in our diocese - and apparently, speaks (and perhaps experiences his reported visions) in parishes all over the country. Do local ordinaries review these kinds of things, and how does that mesh with the authority of the local in Bosnia?

I
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in answer to this specific question, no Catholic parish can host a speaker, event, retreat, conference, presentation, healing service or any other such event without the express permission of the bishop. You should call the diocese to find out if the event has approval and advise others on that basis.
 
NHInsider said:
I know that the Medjugorje phenomenon itself is a banned topic, so hopefully this thread won’t vear off there. I have been asked by a member of my Scripture Study class whether it is okay to go and hear/see one of the visionaries, Ivan Dragicevic. He is in fact scheduled to speak at a parish in our diocese - and apparently, speaks (and perhaps experiences his reported visions) in parishes all over the country. Do local ordinaries review these kinds of things, and how does that mesh with the authority of the local in Bosnia?

I’m inclined to suggest that the woman in my class, who is quite devout but very, very impressionable and rather weak in her doctrinal education, not take her family to see him. But - wonder what others may think?
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In deference and with respect to the local Bishop where Medj is located, I would not attend this. I would advise your friend to not do so also.

As the previous poster said, call your diocese, hopefully they know would be informed of this if they did not know beforehand.
 
I’ve attended Marian Conferences i STL and have heard several people who’ve been to Medjugorje. We all have free will to coin from Al Anon “take what you want & leave the rest”

I enjoyed the speakers.
 
cradlecatholic5 said:
I’ve attended Marian Conferences i STL and have heard several people who’ve been to Medjugorje. We all have free will to coin from Al Anon “take what you want & leave the rest”

I enjoyed the speakers.
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It’s certainly one thing to hear a speaker that has been to Medjugorje, but it’s something entirely different to listen to one of the seers. I would think there would be little doubt as to what the seer would talk about, what sort of message would be delivered and what kind of interpretation would be given to these messages and the surrounding events.

Out of respect for the local bishop in Medjugorje I would avoid something like this. I understand the Vatican is still looking into this issue, but the local bishop’s rulings have not been overturned or superseeded at this point. Discretion should be observed lest one be seen as tacitly supporting this seer’s message or actions.

ChadS
 
repeat: this is not a matter of personal opinion it is a matter of obedience
if your local bishop has not approved the event you cannot attend
 
mitabrev said:
Very well said
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Very well said!

I attend my parish of St.Mary’s Cathedral in Perth, Western Australia and a few months ago, Ivan, one of the seers from Medjugorje gave a long talk, as well as received & delivered a message from an apparition of Mary that he experienced on the day. Prior to this, the packed Cathedral recited the Rosary. It in a way saddens me why people so strongly question or disregard this as an actual miracle that has been occurring for nearly the last 30 years. If you look at the messages and their content, they are messages of peace, love, prayer and conversion. I don’t doubt one bit that this is in fact Mary delivering messages for a world that is forgetting about GOD. I understand that we must discern anything and anyone who represents God by their fruit…however, where is Satan’s deception in prayer, fasting, repentance, conversion, love, peace…it makes me wonder that if it is in fact Satan then he must have converted himself…

On top of this, even Christ was questioned whether he is casting out devils with the help of Satan…

22Then a demon-possessed man who was blind and mute was brought to Jesus, and He healed him, so that the mute man spoke and saw. 23All the crowds were amazed, and were saying, “This man cannot be the Son of David, can he?” 24But when the Pharisees heard this, they said, “This man casts out demons only by Beelzebul the ruler of the demons.”

25And knowing their thoughts Jesus said to them, “Any kingdom divided against itself is laid waste; and any city or house divided against itself will not stand. 26“If Satan casts out Satan, he is divided against himself; how then will his kingdom stand? 27“If I by Beelzebul cast out demons, by whom do your sons cast them out? For this reason they will be your judges. 28“But if I cast out demons by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God has come upon you. 29“Or how can anyone enter the strong man’s house and carry off his property, unless he first binds the strong man? And then he will plunder his house.

Regarding the Vatican’s stance of the matter, look at the prime example of St. Faustina…her message was banned in the 1950s, and now she is one of our greatest Saints.

I agree that we should discern…however in things that are obviously from God our FAITH should be that of a child!

God Bless
 
janszki said:
Very well said!

I attend my parish of St.Mary’s Cathedral in Perth, Western Australia and a few months ago, Ivan, one of the seers from Medjugorje gave a long talk, as well as received & delivered a message from an apparition of Mary that he experienced on the day. Prior to this, the packed Cathedral recited the Rosary. It in a way saddens me why people so strongly question or disregard this as an actual miracle that has been occurring for nearly the last 30 years. If you look at the messages and their content, they are messages of peace, love, prayer and conversion. I don’t doubt one bit that this is in fact Mary delivering messages for a world that is forgetting about GOD. I understand that we must discern anything and anyone who represents God by their fruit…however, where is Satan’s deception in prayer, fasting, repentance, conversion, love, peace…it makes me wonder that if it is in fact Satan then he must have converted himself…

On top of this, even Christ was questioned whether he is casting out devils with the help of Satan…

22Then a demon-possessed man who was blind and mute was brought to Jesus, and He healed him, so that the mute man spoke and saw. 23All the crowds were amazed, and were saying, “This man cannot be the Son of David, can he?” 24But when the Pharisees heard this, they said, “This man casts out demons only by Beelzebul the ruler of the demons.”

25And knowing their thoughts Jesus said to them, “Any kingdom divided against itself is laid waste; and any city or house divided against itself will not stand. 26“If Satan casts out Satan, he is divided against himself; how then will his kingdom stand? 27“If I by Beelzebul cast out demons, by whom do your sons cast them out? For this reason they will be your judges. 28“But if I cast out demons by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God has come upon you. 29“Or how can anyone enter the strong man’s house and carry off his property, unless he first binds the strong man? And then he will plunder his house.

Regarding the Vatican’s stance of the matter, look at the prime example of St. Faustina…her message was banned in the 1950s, and now she is one of our greatest Saints.

I agree that we should discern…however in things that are obviously from God our FAITH should be that of a child!

God Bless
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Amen!

God Bless
 
janszki said:
Very well said!

I attend my parish of St.Mary’s Cathedral in Perth, Western Australia and a few months ago, Ivan, one of the seers from Medjugorje gave a long talk, as well as received & delivered a message from an apparition of Mary that he experienced on the day. Prior to this, the packed Cathedral recited the Rosary. It in a way saddens me why people so strongly question or disregard this as an actual miracle that has been occurring for nearly the last 30 years. If you look at the messages and their content, they are messages of peace, love, prayer and conversion. I don’t doubt one bit that this is in fact Mary delivering messages for a world that is forgetting about GOD. I understand that we must discern anything and anyone who represents God by their fruit…however, where is Satan’s deception in prayer, fasting, repentance, conversion, love, peace…it makes me wonder that if it is in fact Satan then he must have converted himself…

On top of this, even Christ was questioned whether he is casting out devils with the help of Satan…

22Then a demon-possessed man who was blind and mute was brought to Jesus, and He healed him, so that the mute man spoke and saw. 23All the crowds were amazed, and were saying, “This man cannot be the Son of David, can he?” 24But when the Pharisees heard this, they said, “This man casts out demons only by Beelzebul the ruler of the demons.”

25And knowing their thoughts Jesus said to them, “Any kingdom divided against itself is laid waste; and any city or house divided against itself will not stand. 26“If Satan casts out Satan, he is divided against himself; how then will his kingdom stand? 27“If I by Beelzebul cast out demons, by whom do your sons cast them out? For this reason they will be your judges. 28“But if I cast out demons by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God has come upon you. 29“Or how can anyone enter the strong man’s house and carry off his property, unless he first binds the strong man? And then he will plunder his house.

Regarding the Vatican’s stance of the matter, look at the prime example of St. Faustina…her message was banned in the 1950s, and now she is one of our greatest Saints.

I agree that we should discern…however in things that are obviously from God our FAITH should be that of a child!

God Bless
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So all the other irregularities in their stories as well as the disobedience of religious to their order and the bishop as well as the bishop’s finding that it can’t be determined that the event is supernatural – all of those don’t bother you or cause you concern?

ChadS
 
janszki said:
I agree that we should discern…however in things that are obviously from God our FAITH should be that of a child!

God Bless
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One of the signs of an authentic Marian apparition is that they are very brief visits. Not something that goes on for years and years.
 
ChadS said:
So all the other irregularities in their stories…
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You may be referring to the taped recordings made by the local Bishop during the Rigorous cross examinations of the visionaries when they were still young children, who went to the Vatican with his commission, which in turn were found to contain cuts, deleted segments, doctoring, spliced conversations, as well as being undecipherable in at least 148 instances. The Vatican then sent him back to Mostar and dissolved his commission.
ChadS said:
as well as the bishop’s finding that it can’t be determined that the event is supernatural
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The Vatican is currently examining over 500 reported Miraculous healings copiously documented by the Franciscans at St. James Parish as well as the Bureau of the Verification of Extraordinary Healings.

The proper thing to do is refrain from interfering with the Holy Office, and allow the Vatican to conduct its investigation, which it is taking very seriously. One of the visionaries Ivanka Ivankovic Elez was recently called to a three-hour session in Rome with the commission, which was composed of twenty members. Ivanka said the questioning went well and had an optimistic impression afterwards. Jesus does not want us to cast stones, it is in the Vatican’s hands.
vsedriver said:
One of the signs of an authentic Marian apparition is that they are very brief visits. Not something that goes on for years and years.
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There have been Marian apparitions approved by the Roman Catholic Church which occurred for similar and longer time periods than those alleged at Medjugorje. Saint Hildegard of Bingen, Germany received visions for almost seventy years. The apparitions of Our Lady of Laus, France occurred for 54 years. The apparitions to Saint Bridget of Sweden lasted more than twenty five years. According to the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith (CDF), the “length of apparitions” is not a factor in determining the authenticity of alleged apparitions. The Church does not set arbitrary standards for judging alleged apparitions, but instead has specific criteria that it follows.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Normae_Congregationis

God Bless
 
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