Minister of Sacrament of Marriage

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Matthew_Holford

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If two baptised persons marry in the Latin Catholic Church sui iuris, they are the ministers of the sacrament: they confer on one another the sacrament of marriage.

In the autocephalous Eastern Catholic Orthodox Churches the minister of the sacrament is the priest.

Who is the minister of the sacrament of marriage in the Eastern Catholic Churches sui iuris?
 
The priest is the minister of the Mystery of Holy Crowning in the Byzantine [Ruthenian] Catholic Church.
 
McPhelan said:
The priest is the minister of the Mystery of Holy Crowning in the Byzantine [Ruthenian] Catholic Church.
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The same is true in the rest of the East and Orient as well. That said, however, I’m not sure how the matter is considered among the Syro-Malabars.
 
McPhelan said:
The priest is the minister of the Mystery of Holy Crowning in the Byzantine [Ruthenian] Catholic Church.
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Is the Mystery of Holy Crowning the name of the marriage rite in the Ruthenian Catholic Church or is that term used by all the Eastern Churches?
 
malphono said:
The same is true in the rest of the East and Orient as well.
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In general parlance, we would use the words east and orient synonymously. Is there some canonical, theological, or other reason why you have used both words?
malphono said:
That said, however, I’m not sure how the matter is considered among the Syro-Malabars.
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Why might they consider the matter differently? Could they see the bridegroom and bride as the ministers as does the Latin Church?
 
In general we use the term Eastern referring to the Byzantine Churches, and Oriental, referring to the the Coptic, Syriac, ect. Churches (those with sister churches in the Oriental Communion).
 
One should note that the CCEO muddies the theology QUITE a bit in the name of economia…

It permits a couple to marry themselves before two lay witnesses when a priest is not going to be available, but the nuptial blessing has to be sought when a priest is next available.

Canon 832
  1. If one cannot have present or have access to a priest who is competent according to the norm of law without grave inconvenience, those intending to celebrate a true marriage can validly and licitly celebrate it before witnesses alone:
    (1) in danger of death;
    (2) outside the danger of death, as long as it is prudently foreseen that such circumstances will continue for a month.
  2. In either case, if another priest, even a non-Catholic one, is able to be present, inasmuch as it is possible he is to be called so that he can bless the marriage, without prejudice for the validity of a marriage in the presence only of the witnesses.
  3. If a marriage was celebrated in the presence only of witnesses, the spouses shall not neglect to receive the blessing of the marriage from a priest as soon as possible.
    intratext.com/IXT/ENG1199/_PN4.HTM
 
ByzCath said:
It is the name of the rite within the Byzantine Rite.
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May I assume, then, that different names are used by the Eastern Catholic Churches that follow the Alexandrian, Antiochian (West Syrian), Armenian, and the Chaldean (East Syrian) rites?
 
countertenor said:
In general we use the term Eastern referring to the Byzantine Churches, and Oriental, referring to the the Coptic, Syriac, ect. Churches (those with sister churches in the Oriental Communion).
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Thank you for that. I’m always glad to learn something new about our Eastern/Oriental brethren. I’d always thought that with the exception of the Italo-Albanians and Maronites the twenty-two Eastern Catholic Churches sui iuris had all returned to communion with Rome from the Orthodox Churches.

Can I understand from your reply that the Eastern Catholic Churches sui iuris which follow the Byzantine Rite are from the Eastern Orthodox Tradition and that the Eastern Catholic Churches sui iuris which follow the Alexandrian, Antiochian (West Syrian), Armenian, and the Chaldean (East Syrian) rites are from the Oriental Orthodox Tradition? Should we call these sui iuris churches Oriental Catholic Churches?
 
Yes, it is becoming more common among us to call the Churches sui juris that were Eastern/Byzantine Orthodox “Byzantine or Eastern Catholic” and the Churches that have sister Churches or traditions in/with the Oriental Orthodox, “Oriental Catholic.”
 
Matthew_Holford said:
Thank you for that. I’m always glad to learn something new about our Eastern/Oriental brethren. I’d always thought that with the exception of the Italo-Albanians and Maronites the twenty-two Eastern Catholic Churches sui iuris had all returned to communion with Rome from the Orthodox Churches.

Can I understand from your reply that the Eastern Catholic Churches sui iuris which follow the Byzantine Rite are from the Eastern Orthodox Tradition and that the Eastern Catholic Churches sui iuris which follow the Alexandrian, Antiochian (West Syrian), Armenian, and the Chaldean (East Syrian) rites are from the Oriental Orthodox Tradition? Should we call these sui iuris churches Oriental Catholic Churches?
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Byzcath.org also uses the Eastern Catholic/ Oriental Catholic designations.

FYI, Chaldeans are not technically from the Oriental Orthodox Tradition, but from the Assyrian Church of the East. I’ve asked Chaldean Catholic members here on CAF, and they said “Oriental Catholics” is an acceptable designation for them.

Blessings,
Marduk
 
mardukm said:
Byzcath.org also uses the Eastern Catholic/ Oriental Catholic designations.

FYI, Chaldeans are not technically from the Oriental Orthodox Tradition, but from the Assyrian Church of the East. I’ve asked Chaldean Catholic members here on CAF, and they said “Oriental Catholics” is an acceptable designation for them.

Blessings,
Marduk
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So there are twenty-two eastern Churches in communion with the See of Rome. They follow five liturgical rites: 1. Alexandrian, 2. Antiochian, 3. Armenian, 4. Byzantine, and 5. Chaldean.

Now, in order to avoid insult or error, and without using technically correct canonical, theological, etc. terms the following would be a reasonable layman’s summary:

The sui iuris Eastern Churches that use the Alexandrian, Antiochian, or Armenian rites are Oriental Catholic Churches similar in praxis to the Oriental Orthodox Churches, the sui iuris Eastern Churches that use the Byzantine Rite are Eastern Catholic Churches similar in praxis to the Eastern Orthodox Churches, and that the two sui iuris Churches that follow the Chaldean Rite are similar in praxis to the Holy Apostolic Catholic Assyrian Church of the East.

So, we call the Alexandrian, Antiochian, and Armenian rite churches are referred to Oriental Catholic Churches; the Byzantine Rite churches are referred to Eastern Catholic Churches; how should one refer to our Chaldean brethren?
 
Matthew_Holford said:
So there are twenty-two eastern Churches in communion with the See of Rome. They follow five liturgical rites: 1. Alexandrian, 2. Antiochian, 3. Armenian, 4. Byzantine, and 5. Chaldean.

Now, in order to avoid insult or error, and without using technically correct canonical, theological, etc. terms the following would be a reasonable layman’s summary:

The sui iuris Eastern Churches that use the Alexandrian, Antiochian, or Armenian rites are Oriental Catholic Churches similar in praxis to the Oriental Orthodox Churches, the sui iuris Eastern Churches that use the Byzantine Rite are Eastern Catholic Churches similar in praxis to the Eastern Orthodox Churches, and that the two sui iuris Churches that follow the Chaldean Rite are similar in praxis to the Holy Apostolic Catholic Assyrian Church of the East.

So, we call the Alexandrian, Antiochian, and Armenian rite churches are referred to Oriental Catholic Churches; the Byzantine Rite churches are referred to Eastern Catholic Churches; how should one refer to our Chaldean brethren?
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Chaldean Catholics.🙂 As stated in my previous post, the Chaldean members here accept the “Oriental Catholic” designation. That makes sense because they are very similar to the Syrian Tradition which is part of the Oriental family.

Blessings,
Marduk
 
mardukm said:
Chaldean Catholics.🙂 As stated in my previous post, the Chaldean members here accept the “Oriental Catholic” designation. That makes sense because they are very similar to the Syrian Tradition which is part of the Oriental family.

Blessings,
Marduk
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OK, thanks!

Would you please explain based on these discussions what your profile status “Orthodox in Communion with Rome (Copt)” means?
 
Matthew_Holford said:
OK, thanks!

Would you please explain based on these discussions what your profile status “Orthodox in Communion with Rome (Copt)” means?
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It means that when I joined the Catholic communion, I did not join it by way of rejecting anything from my Coptic Tradition. I joined Catholicism only by way of rejecting all the misconceptions I had about the Catholic Church and Catholic teachings (about the Pope, the Immaculate Conception, Purgatory, filioque, etc., etc., etc.)

Blessings,
Marduk
 
mardukm said:
It means that when I joined the Catholic communion, I did not join it by way of rejecting anything from my Coptic Tradition. I joined Catholicism only by way of rejecting all the misconceptions I had about the Catholic Church and Catholic teachings (about the Pope, the Immaculate Conception, Purgatory, filioque, etc., etc., etc.)

Blessings,
Marduk
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Thanks!

That wasn’t what my question was asking but I think you may have realised this. I really meant to which Church you belong. I appreciate your privacy not to tell me, of course. When you say you came from the Coptic Tradition I am unable to discern, as I am still acquainting myself with Eastern terminology, whether you are a member of a Chaldean Rite Church. Although from your previous comments you refer to the Chaldeans as if you are not one. I therefore suspect you may belong to an Oriental Catholic Church.

Outside Catholicism, are Copts and Oriental Orthodox the same Churches; are the Copts one part of the Oriental Orthodox Churches; are the Copts and Oriental Orthodox separate Churches?
 
Matthew_Holford said:
Thanks!

That wasn’t what my question was asking but I think you may have realised this. I really meant to which Church you belong. I appreciate your privacy not to tell me, of course. When you say you came from the Coptic Tradition I am unable to discern, as I am still acquainting myself with Eastern terminology, whether you are a member of a Chaldean Rite Church. Although from your previous comments you refer to the Chaldeans as if you are not one. I therefore suspect you may belong to an Oriental Catholic Church.

Outside Catholicism, are Copts and Oriental Orthodox the same Churches; are the Copts one part of the Oriental Orthodox Churches; are the Copts and Oriental Orthodox separate Churches?
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Coptics are part of the Coptic Church which uses the Alexandrian Rite
Chaldeans are of the Chaldean Church which uses the Chaldean Rite
 
Matthew_Holford said:
Thanks!

That wasn’t what my question was asking but I think you may have realised this. I really meant to which Church you belong. I appreciate your privacy not to tell me, of course. When you say you came from the Coptic Tradition I am unable to discern, as I am still acquainting myself with Eastern terminology, whether you are a member of a Chaldean Rite Church. Although from your previous comments you refer to the Chaldeans as if you are not one. I therefore suspect you may belong to an Oriental Catholic Church.

Outside Catholicism, are Copts and Oriental Orthodox the same Churches; are the Copts one part of the Oriental Orthodox Churches; are the Copts and Oriental Orthodox separate Churches?
Click to expand...
The Oriental Orthodox, as a communion of churches, are identifiable by their communion with the Coptic Orthodox Pope (Patriarch), at present His Holiness Shenouda III.

And Marduk is a Coptic Catholic, at least so long as he doesn’t opt to change his enrollment.

When one comes into union on a personal basis, one enters the Catholic Communion in the Sui Iuris church that is closest to one’s original Church. Since all the Oriental Orthodox churches have Catholic counterparts…

Coptic Orthodox: Coptic Catholic
Eritrean Orthodox: Ethiopian Catholic
Ethiopian Orthodox: Ethiopian Catholic
Syriac Orthodox: Syrian Catholic
Armenian Apostolic Orthodox: Armenian Catholic
Malankara Orthodox: Syro-Malankar Catholic
 
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