More Catholic than Catholics

[SenorSalsa]

Episcopalians can frustrate me some times…

I took a tour of my friend’s church the other day(he is the organist there), we toured the stained glass, including one of Mary crushing the Serpents head, looked in the loft where ranks of organ pipes are to be installed in the near future, the centered tabernacle, saw the smaller chapel, where at the 8 am sunday liturgy it is said ad orientem, as that is the only way possible(to which I asked and he confirmed that for the 40-50 people that attend, max capacity, none have ever complained of that posture). His hymnal contained many melodies adapted from the Gregorian Chant ones, and he was in preparation at the time to play the Veni Creator Spiritus in Latin.

Meanwhile at my church, we have “etched” glass, not stained glass, the tabernacle to the side, ad populum Masses, and complaints of even the Kyrie, the only non-english ever used at my Church, and our hymnal contains such gems as “Lord of the Dance”

 

[shuzo1189]

It is a sad state of Affairs. Just look at Our Lady of Angels Cathedral in L.A. or the Dishwater Agitat…St. Mary’s Cathedral in San Francisco.

Take heart in the FSSP and the growing trend of Orthodox/Traditional Young Priests. May I ask what state/country you reside in?

and as a further note, the Parish i attend which celebrates the OF always has the Ordinary Chanted with the OF being about 60/40 Latin English. It also has an Altar Rail etc, it has been described as a Reform of the Reform Parish aka Say the Red do the Black

 

[Eucharisted]

Would you like some cheese with your whine, sir?

If you wish to change things, tell the pastor what you don’t like. It is your right and your duty to ensure that God is glorified.

 

[Sarabande]

Episcopalians can frustrate me some times…

I took a tour of my friend’s church the other day(he is the organist there), we toured the stained glass, including one of Mary crushing the Serpents head, looked in the loft where ranks of organ pipes are to be installed in the near future, the centered tabernacle, saw the smaller chapel, where at the 8 am sunday liturgy it is said ad orientem, as that is the only way possible(to which I asked and he confirmed that for the 40-50 people that attend, max capacity, none have ever complained of that posture). His hymnal contained many melodies adapted from the Gregorian Chant ones, and he was in preparation at the time to play the Veni Creator Spiritus in Latin.

Meanwhile at my church, we have “etched” glass, not stained glass, the tabernacle to the side, ad populum Masses, and complaints of even the Kyrie, the only non-english ever used at my Church, and our hymnal contains such gems as “Lord of the Dance”

I know what you mean. I’ve been to many Episcopal/Anglican services (usually the high church ones) either as a hired musician or visiting. It used to frustrate my husband and I a lot to see them doing all this Catholic music (Palestrina, Allegri, Faure chants, etc.) as well as just being “more Catholic than Catholics” in other regards and experiencing what we did at most Catholic masses. We were like, what is going on here? Their services were always packed. It’s not like it was some sort of strange phenomenon. Fortunately, more Catholic churches are working to go back to this. I don’t have an answer to all of this, but I do feel for you.

 

[SenorSalsa]

I know what you mean. I’ve been to many Episcopal/Anglican services (usually the high church ones) either as a hired musician or visiting. It used to frustrate my husband and I a lot to see them doing all this Catholic music (Palestrina, Allegri, Faure chants, etc.) as well as just being “more Catholic than Catholics” in other regards and experiencing what we did at most Catholic masses. We were like, what is going on here? Their services were always packed. It’s not like it was some sort of strange phenomenon. Fortunately, more Catholic churches are working to go back to this. I don’t have an answer to all of this, but I do feel for you.

Yeah. You just look around and think, “you’re just so close”, they would be such a great group to bring back, and I think because of the choice to ordain women and homosexuals, that a break is coming some time in the future. its such a diverse group as far as beliefs go from the far right(very Catholic), where nearly everything is accepted but the Pope, and the far left(very Protestant), where problems are found with such things as the Eucharist and the priesthood.

I sincerely hope for their sake and for the Church’s that we can welcome them back soon

 

[shuzo1189]

To the OP: If you get a chance I would strongly suggest visiting St. John Cantius (cantius.org/), its a Church built in the Polish Cathedral style and frankly if you want Smells and Bells, there are Smells and Bells a plenty!

 

[mullenpm]

SenorSalsa, did I read you correctly?

**“I think because of the choice to ordain women and homosexuals, that a break is coming some time in the future.” **

Are you actually saying that the Catholic Church should ordain women and homosexuals?

The road to more reverence in the Church is certainly not to go down that road.:nope:

:knight1:

 

[JustaServant]

SenorSalsa, did I read you correctly?

**“I think because of the choice to ordain women and homosexuals, that a break is coming some time in the future.” **

Are you actually saying that the Catholic Church should ordain women and homosexuals?

The road to more reverence in the Church is certainly not to go down that road.:nope:

:knight1:

I think she is refering to the Episcopal church. The ‘break’ among Episcopals has already occured several times. I highly doubt liberal Episcopals would have any interest in becoming Catholic. The more orthodox wing are already doing that.

 

[Sarabande]

Yeah. You just look around and think, “you’re just so close”, they would be such a great group to bring back, and I think because of the choice to ordain women and homosexuals, that a break is coming some time in the future. its such a diverse group as far as beliefs go from the far right(very Catholic), where nearly everything is accepted but the Pope, and the far left(very Protestant), where problems are found with such things as the Eucharist and the priesthood.

I sincerely hope for their sake and for the Church’s that we can welcome them back soon

I know, it is very diverse and from what our Episcopal/Anglican friends tell us, there is a lot of problems going on right now. We sometimes tease an Episcopal friend of ours about just coming back over because his church is just so close. Then he’ll tease us back saying that if they did, they’re afraid that their liturgy might become a hoot-n-nanny mass and much less reverent than what they have now. Yes, he is just teasing us because he knows how much we can’t stand hoot-n-nanny masses and just want to goad us on like we goad him on, but it does hit us in the gut because we know how true that is in some instances.

I did experience something interesting when I was studying in London. My first week there I searched for a Catholic church within walking distance of my flat. I thought I found one because it had “Catholic” in the name of the church. So I attended the mass, which was very reverent, very spiritual, very beautiful and packed. The difference was that everyone received the Eucharist kneeling at the altar rail, which at the time I thought was strange, but also thought that they perhaps did things differently in other countries (I was 20 and it was my first time ever abroad).

After the mass, the greeters at the parish saw that I was a new face and invited me for tea and other refreshments after the mass. Wanting to meet new people, I went and enjoyed a very nice time. But then I found out that the parish actually wasn’t a Catholic parish. It was my first time that I heard the word Anglo-Catholic. What was very interesting, though, is that the pastor and the others there told me that although they were technically supposed to be under the Church of England, they were actually starting to follow under the Pope. Basically, the break was beginning at that church and they were apparently a more conservative parish which was not happy with what was happening with the Anglican Church. I wish I could remember the name of the parish because I’d like to know if they eventually made the complete break. What was also very nice about them is that when they realized that I was Catholic, they were very kind and one of them offered to take me to the actual Roman Catholic parish nearby so that I could attend mass there. Anyway, I found that whole experience interesting and it was my first time seeing that there was an actual problem and split going on with the Anglican/Episcopal Church.

 

[withwind]

If one wants nice things for his church, donate more. It isn’t cheap to have a nice church.

 

[Sarabande]

If one wants nice things for his church, donate more. It isn’t cheap to have a nice church.

In some cases, it has nothing to do with having enough money for a nice church. I’ve attended mass for years in a little farming parish which didn’t have much money, but have very reverent masses and lovely little churches which were kept up well. You don’t need much money for thing like that.

On the other end of the spectrum, there is a very wealthy parish near where I live now. I also grew up in a wealthy parish where they have a lot of financial support. They pay good money to their music ministers, yet they have cheese. I know working as a music minister, it’s not always the fault of the music minister and sometimes it is either the parishioners or the pastor who insists on the cheese. They rule with their money sometimes. It happened at my old parish.

So, it is not always money that can change those things for the better. It can sometimes be for the worst. Believe me, if I wasn’t a musician and made lots of money, I’d be giving tons of it for the betterment of the liturgy and spiritual development. For now, I give my talents. At our parish (which is the cathedral), we’ve had anonymous donors give to fix our parish - thousands and thousands worth. They did it to get rid of the 1970s/80s monstrosities and replace them with wonderful side altars. We’re all very grateful for that.