A
awfulthings9
Guest
Earlier this week I mentioned that a couple of Mormon missionaries had contacted me and I agreed to meet with them yesterday. I asked those on the message board for advice, so I thought I’d give an update on how the conversation went, in case it helps anyone else. First off, after a brief prayer (I led) and five minute conversation about my newly finished basement, I brought up my most important question: in the book EXECUTIONER’S SONG, author Norman Mailer makes a couple references to “Mormon-style creme pies”. Do Mormon’s have a special creme pie they’re not telling the rest of us about, I asked. Niether knew, but promised to check into it.
Next, I explained that I was a firm Catholic, but was open enough to hear first-hand about their faith. Elder Hoight invited me to tell about my journey, and remembering how many on this board emphasized the subjective nature of Morman religious conviction, I centered my discussion around the fact that I had always been frustrated with people who chose a religion because it “felt right”, bringing up the Heaven’s Gate Cult folks, who “felt” the right thing to do was to commit suicide during an eclipse. I explained how nice it was to be able to refer back to the earlier Christians - some from the first century - and see how their writings were actually Catholic, but told them that I was aware of their theory of the great apostasy. Elder Hoight agree that the “true” church had to be either Catholic or Mormon. It didn’t seem like Elder Ven liked that. He didn’t say as much and seemed to sense my game-plan.
I let them give their testimony for twenty minutes or so and then started playing devil’s advocate, but I made sure to preface every question with “I’m not trying to antagonize you, please understand”, or “I don’t mean to be difficult, but exploring another faith makes me ask questions like that.” I was overly apologetic as I questioned them, because I knew they would leave if I seemed to be just attempting to convert them.
Some of our discussion (more politely worded) included:
How do we know Joseph Smith was anymore authentic than, say, Mary Baker Eddy or Jim Jones or David Koresh? How could we be sure? We get a feeling inside from the spirit, they answered. I reminded them that the Heaven’s Gate Cult people probably went by the same evidence.
They pointed out that you can test your faith by living as a Mormon for a few months and see how it feels. I pointed out that a Catholic scholar, Blaise Paschal (sp?) had proposed a similar concept.
How come, I asked, despite Matthew 16:18, Christ’s teaching fell apart within a few years, but a less anticipate and miraculous prophet like Smith couple establish one that has lasted so long. Elder Ven got a little irritated here and insisted that he didn’t just “make up” everything in BOM. I assured him I wasn’t saying that, and Elder Hoight gave me the “you will know them by their fruits” argument, and pointed out how true that must be when I look at the changes in my life since becoming a Catholic.
I talked about the historical evidence for so much in the Bible and asked if their are any Mormon historical digs (from the great battles) my wife and I could visit as we travel in the states. They didn’t know of any, but would check into it.
Finally I invited them to a Catholic Mass so they could better understand Catholics to help with their missions, but they are forbidden from doing so.
Finally I sent them off, reminding them about the creme pie.
While I don’t know if I made any progress, at least they were with me for over an hour than with someone more vunerable.
God Bless you all for your help. Merry Christmas.
Next, I explained that I was a firm Catholic, but was open enough to hear first-hand about their faith. Elder Hoight invited me to tell about my journey, and remembering how many on this board emphasized the subjective nature of Morman religious conviction, I centered my discussion around the fact that I had always been frustrated with people who chose a religion because it “felt right”, bringing up the Heaven’s Gate Cult folks, who “felt” the right thing to do was to commit suicide during an eclipse. I explained how nice it was to be able to refer back to the earlier Christians - some from the first century - and see how their writings were actually Catholic, but told them that I was aware of their theory of the great apostasy. Elder Hoight agree that the “true” church had to be either Catholic or Mormon. It didn’t seem like Elder Ven liked that. He didn’t say as much and seemed to sense my game-plan.
I let them give their testimony for twenty minutes or so and then started playing devil’s advocate, but I made sure to preface every question with “I’m not trying to antagonize you, please understand”, or “I don’t mean to be difficult, but exploring another faith makes me ask questions like that.” I was overly apologetic as I questioned them, because I knew they would leave if I seemed to be just attempting to convert them.
Some of our discussion (more politely worded) included:
How do we know Joseph Smith was anymore authentic than, say, Mary Baker Eddy or Jim Jones or David Koresh? How could we be sure? We get a feeling inside from the spirit, they answered. I reminded them that the Heaven’s Gate Cult people probably went by the same evidence.
They pointed out that you can test your faith by living as a Mormon for a few months and see how it feels. I pointed out that a Catholic scholar, Blaise Paschal (sp?) had proposed a similar concept.
How come, I asked, despite Matthew 16:18, Christ’s teaching fell apart within a few years, but a less anticipate and miraculous prophet like Smith couple establish one that has lasted so long. Elder Ven got a little irritated here and insisted that he didn’t just “make up” everything in BOM. I assured him I wasn’t saying that, and Elder Hoight gave me the “you will know them by their fruits” argument, and pointed out how true that must be when I look at the changes in my life since becoming a Catholic.
I talked about the historical evidence for so much in the Bible and asked if their are any Mormon historical digs (from the great battles) my wife and I could visit as we travel in the states. They didn’t know of any, but would check into it.
Finally I invited them to a Catholic Mass so they could better understand Catholics to help with their missions, but they are forbidden from doing so.
Finally I sent them off, reminding them about the creme pie.
While I don’t know if I made any progress, at least they were with me for over an hour than with someone more vunerable.
God Bless you all for your help. Merry Christmas.
