My friend is planning on Invitro Fertilization

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I have a very Catholic friend who can not have kids naturally. She wants and is hoping to save up for Invitro. I told her that the Church views it as wrong. She says it is okay in certain cases. I told and showed her why it isnt right ever. Any suggestions on helping or encouraging her to adopt? I pray for her, of course. But sometimes I think I’m being selfish because I dont want her to do this. I just think that we as Christians should help each other on the path to God. What should I do when she does get this done? How should I act without judging her??Please help me!
 
Maybe she honestly thinks the Church says its ok in certain cases. Ask her where she got this information from (maybe you can explain why it isn’t a reliable source) and show her actual Church documents where it talks about this. Here is what it says in the catechism:

2377 Techniques involving only the married couple (homologous artificial insemination and fertilization) are perhaps less reprehensible, yet remain morally unacceptable. They dissociate the sexual act from the procreative act. The act which brings the child into existence is no longer an act by which two persons give themselves to one another, but one that “entrusts the life and identity of the embryo into the power of doctors and biologists and establishes the domination of technology over the origin and destiny of the human person. Such a relationship of domination is in itself contrary to the dignity and equality that must be common to parents and children.” 168 “Under the moral aspect procreation is deprived of its proper perfection when it is not willed as the fruit of the conjugal act, that is to say, of the specific act of the spouses’ union … Only respect for the link between the meanings of the conjugal act and respect for the unity of the human being make possible procreation in conformity with the dignity of the person.” 169

2378 A child is not something owed to one, but is a gift. The “supreme gift of marriage” is a human person. A child may not be considered a piece of property, an idea to which an alleged “right to a child” would lead. **In this area, only the child possesses genuine rights: the right “to be the fruit of the specific act of the conjugal love of his parents,” and “the right to be respected as a person from the moment of his conception.” ** 170

2379 The Gospel shows that physical sterility is not an absolute evil. Spouses who still suffer from infertility after exhausting legitimate medical procedures should unite themselves with the Lord’s Cross, the source of all spiritual fecundity. They can give expression to their generosity by adopting abandoned children or performing demanding services for others. "
 
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lifeisbeautiful:
Maybe she honestly thinks the Church says its ok in certain cases. Ask her where she got this information from (maybe you can explain why it isn’t a reliable source) and show her actual Church documents where it talks about this. Here is what it says in the catechism:

2377 Techniques involving only the married couple (homologous artificial insemination and fertilization) are perhaps less reprehensible, yet remain morally unacceptable. They dissociate the sexual act from the procreative act. The act which brings the child into existence is no longer an act by which two persons give themselves to one another, but one that “entrusts the life and identity of the embryo into the power of doctors and biologists and establishes the domination of technology over the origin and destiny of the human person. Such a relationship of domination is in itself contrary to the dignity and equality that must be common to parents and children.” 168 “Under the moral aspect procreation is deprived of its proper perfection when it is not willed as the fruit of the conjugal act, that is to say, of the specific act of the spouses’ union … Only respect for the link between the meanings of the conjugal act and respect for the unity of the human being make possible procreation in conformity with the dignity of the person.” 169

2378 A child is not something owed to one, but is a gift. The “supreme gift of marriage” is a human person. A child may not be considered a piece of property, an idea to which an alleged “right to a child” would lead. **In this area, only the child possesses genuine rights: the right “to be the fruit of the specific act of the conjugal love of his parents,” and “the right to be respected as a person from the moment of his conception.” ** 170

2379 The Gospel shows that physical sterility is not an absolute evil. Spouses who still suffer from infertility after exhausting legitimate medical procedures should unite themselves with the Lord’s Cross, the source of all spiritual fecundity. They can give expression to their generosity by adopting abandoned children or performing demanding services for others. "
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Excellent advice and perhaps the couple would be open to visiting this website that may be of help?
http://www.popepaulvi.com/about1.htm
Paul VI Institute
 
I’ve told her what you have stated. She bursted out into tears. I felt bad. I told her that I was sorry and to research it on her own. She said she has. I told her to ask a priest or a lay person. I havent brought it up since. But I know they are saving up money to do it. What really upsets me is that she is a cantor at a Mass. Now what happens when people ask her how she got pregnant, after they knew she was infertile? They are going to think IVF is acceptable because she is a cantor, someone who is supposed to lead us in song for God. My whole thing is , how do you act towards someone after they’ve done this??
 
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crazyage3:
I’ve told her what you have stated. She bursted out into tears. I felt bad. I told her that I was sorry and to research it on her own. She said she has. I told her to ask a priest or a lay person. I havent brought it up since. But I know they are saving up money to do it. What really upsets me is that she is a cantor at a Mass. Now what happens when people ask her how she got pregnant, after they knew she was infertile? They are going to think IVF is acceptable because she is a cantor, someone who is supposed to lead us in song for God. My whole thing is , how do you act towards someone after they’ve done this??
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Act with love and charity. The person is misinformed and hopefully she will be open to Church teaching.

She should view this site:popepaulvi.com/about1.htm it is very helpful to folks in her situation.
 
I think it is great that you have provided your friend with the teachings of the Church. Now that you have done this, I wouldn’t needle her. She must obey her conscience, not yours. I would continue to be a caring and compassionate friend to her, as you obviously have been. If she does decide to go through IVF, I would let her be the one to answer peoples questions. You do not need to let others at church know the confidential information that she has shared with you.

At this point, the best thing to do would to treat her with love and kindness and pray for her.
 
Just wondering whether this friend was seeking your advice or you were taking it upon yourself to “inform” her? If she isn’t asking for your (name removed by moderator)ut…stay out of it. If she asked and you gave her information she didn’t want to hear–all you can do is back off and let her make her own decision/mistakes. You have no power to make the decision for her.
 
Island Oak:
Just wondering whether this friend was seeking your advice or you were taking it upon yourself to “inform” her? If she isn’t asking for your (name removed by moderator)ut…stay out of it. If she asked and you gave her information she didn’t want to hear–all you can do is back off and let her make her own decision/mistakes. You have no power to make the decision for her.
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It came up in conversation one day. I asked if she knows if it is okay with the church to do. SHe said she has done much research and that it was okay in her case. I told her i didnt think so and than looked it up in one of my books. If ever anyone states that something is okay within the Catholic church when it isnt, I let them know and why. If I dont know myself, I look it up. I didnt just butt in believe me. We were talking and she was mis-informed by research.
 
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dulcissima:
I think it is great that you have provided your friend with the teachings of the Church. Now that you have done this, I wouldn’t needle her. She must obey her conscience, not yours. I would continue to be a caring and compassionate friend to her, as you obviously have been. If she does decide to go through IVF, I would let her be the one to answer peoples questions. You do not need to let others at church know the confidential information that she has shared with you.

At this point, the best thing to do would to treat her with love and kindness and pray for her.
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Of course I would not tell people that! Well, my husband and mother maybe…but not Church! I dont even go to her parish anymore. Not to mention, I live far away from it! My whole thing was if people ask how because they know she was infertile, she’ll tell them. Others who arent fully educated will think it is alright because she is the leader in song to God. Do you understand what I’m trying to say? I have a hard time explaining things! Hopefully you’all get it!
 
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Excellent advice and perhaps the couple would be open to visiting this website that may be of help?
http://www.popepaulvi.com/about1.htm
Paul VI Institute
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I do Napro and Creighton model from there. It is awesome. Thank God for this research and technology!! Unfortunatly, this wont help her! She has no fallopian tubes or right ovary. She only has a small piece of her left one. I feel so bad for her but she’d make a great adoptive mother!
 
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crazyage3:
I do Napro and Creighton model from there. It is awesome. Thank God for this research and technology!! Unfortunatly, this wont help her! She has no fallopian tubes or right ovary. She only has a small piece of her left one. I feel so bad for her but she’d make a great adoptive mother!
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She can still speak with them to get some insight.
 
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She can still speak with them to get some insight.
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I’ve emailed that site to a bunch of people(including her) who are Catholic and have female problems. I entitled it “female problems”… Thank you by the way!!
 
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crazyage3:
I’ve emailed that site to a bunch of people(including her) who are Catholic and have female problems. I entitled it “female problems”… Thank you by the way!!
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You are very welcome and I appreciate your concern for her and your zeal for accepting Church teachings. I pray all goes well for all involved.
 
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Gwyn:
You may want to show your friend this
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=74717

and also second the popepaulvi.com/about1.htm
advice.
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Thank you gwyn! You think that it could be done with her? That would make much more sense to do. That way you arent getting the sperm through masturbation and no embryos are involved. My friend doesnt have fallopian tubes though. YOu think docs can remove an egg and surgecially create an embryo? Have you been doing Napro for your condition?
 
Gwyn’s link was a good one, depending upon the nature of her “female problems” as you call them.

Slightly off topic, but very related because this might be an alternative for the woman in question, does anyone know of the Church’s stance on adopting “snowflake babies.”

Basically, there are countless embryos already fertilized that were conceived (in vitro) by couples seeking fertility treatment. The parents of these babies may or may not have decided to carry these children (as you probably know, many embryos are produced during a single IVF). A small number of groups has started these snowflake adoptions. These agencies receive permission from the biological parents to put the embryo up for adoption. A couple who for whatever reason cannot conceive may adopt the child and the mother will carry him or her in her own womb. Presumably if the mother can support an IVF pregnancy, she should also be able to support an “adopted” IVF pregnancy. The difference here is that life has already been created, so the couple has not taken part in any immoral act.

The argument against snowflake babies on the basis of not wanting to condone IVF doesn’t hold up for me because that is like saying we cannot adopt children of single mothers because we don’t want to condone their having had sex before marriage. Isn’t it always better once life has been created to bring the child into the world even if the circumstances are less than ideal?
 
You might not want to re-open this with your friend, but I have a (non-Catholic) friend who used IVF to become pregnant. She and her husband asked that only three eggs be fertilized and all were implanted. Then, they and their church prayed for all three children; sadly, two did not make it. My point is that the negative effects could be mitigated (avoid “unused” embryos - I don’t like the phrasing but I can’t think of another word).
 
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