My son secretly baptized Catholic

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Mountee - My wife has been through painful experiences too numerous to detail here and it’s not my place to say whether The Man Upstairs condemns her ignoring me on purpose or not. I’m hoping for some sort of compromise where he goes Catholic one week and Mormon the next, but my wife simply does not tell me her intent now and I have to react after the fact.

Santi2 - My son is currently choosing whatever my wife is suggesting. If my wife suggested that he be baptized in a different church each month he’d do it currently.

Corki - 10,000+ posts?!?!
JRKH - 16,000 posts?!?!
(name removed by moderator) - 18,000+ posts?!?!

Thanks all and God bless.
I’m sorry this is going on in your life, I really am.

I have to ask though, Mormon teaching is that a child of 8 years or older is capable of choosing a Mormon baptism. Do you therefore think that a child of 8 years old or older is capable of choosing a Catholic baptism?
 
Toward the end of 2011 my wife started distancing herself from me and now speaks to me as little as possible. 😦 In May 2012 she apparently started looking into Catholicism based on clues I’d find in our house, but she never told me so. In mid-july she stopped attending church with our 10 year old son and I and started taking my son elsewhere. After some sleuthing I determined they were going to the local Catholic parish. No legal steps have been taken toward divorce so my wife and I are still joint custodians of my son. I called the Office of Religious education which confirmed that my son was enrolled in a class for the new school year. I contacted the parish asking that my son not be formally instructed without my consent. While waiting for a reply I was kindly sent my son’s baptism certificate in the mail. :mad: (The parish website states that older children are baptized at Easter after being trained accordingly, so I didn’t think a baptism was imminent.) So, do I have any recourse as far as “undoing” my son’s baptism? Is it proper for the parish to baptized without any say from the custodial father? Doesn’t Canon Law 851 apply here? (“the parents of a child who is to be baptised, and those who are to undertake the office of sponsers, are to be suitably instructed on the meaning of this sacrament and the obligations attaching to it.”) Is there any other Canon Law pertinent to this situation? Thanks in advance.
I get the strong feeling there is more to the story that the OP has not shared as of yet. Has the wife talked to him about converting, or at least searching? Is she a baptised Catholic who converted to marry? Are there signs she was not happy of comfortable in the LDS church?

There are times in life when our kids teach us what truth is, this may be one of those times for you. Sit down with your wife and son and discover why they have come to the faith. With an open mind, try to see their reasons and ask yourself some serious questions, such as, how important is your marriage? Is your denomination more important?

My words and question may anger you, but I hope they don’t, this is an important time in your life. The descision you make here will affect you and your family for the rest of your life, and possibly your eternal life; think it through with much prayer!!!
 
I’m sorry this is going on in your life, I really am.

I have to ask though, Mormon teaching is that a child of 8 years or older is capable of choosing a Mormon baptism. Do you therefore think that a child of 8 years old or older is capable of choosing a Catholic baptism?
The Catholic Church uses age 7 as the age of discretion but uses 14 for adult. Per Catholic canon law at age 14 one can choose for themselves what church to be baptised in.
 
RebeccaJ - I appreciate the sympathy. My son was raised in the LDS faith for 8 years before choosing to be baptized. He generally does not ask questions of a religious nature on his own, and certainly none about comparing different religious beliefs. I believe that all of us need to come to a religious decision on our own and it would be a mistake for a parent to keep a child from a broader religion exposure. However, in this case my son was attending LDS services through mid-July and then baptized Catholic August 18. My wife wants to erase me from her life and my son’s life. Assuming my wife chooses to divorce I’ll raise the issue of Parental Alienation Syndrome at the divorce hearing, in which children are brainwashed to always agree with one parent and shun the other. My son neither understands about the Catholic believe of no pre-existence, the Evangelical believe of professing Christ once and being saved, or any other numerous distinction among the various Christian sects. He is smart enough to know that The Man Upstairs would neither hold my son accountable for Adam’s transgression, nor accountable for a neighbor caught shoplifting, or any other sin my son had no part in. He knows the difference between right and wrong but he still needs parents who train him up in the way he should go.

Deacon Lapey - You are right that there is a whole lot more to this story than I could or intend to post. My wife was raised Catholic but converted to the LDS faith 12 years before we were married. Currently my wife only speaks to me when she wants me to fix something around the house, pay off the credit card bill, or discourage me from attending Mass with her and my son. (The parish priest said I was welcome to attend with my son, but hasn’t got back to me regarding how the baptism happened. My wife was very upset when I informed her of the priest’s permission to attend Mass and now attends difference parishes in order to keep me guessing.) My wife routinely states she intends to divorce me at some point. So, sitting down with my wife and discussing her change of heart won’t happen per her choice. I appreciate you adding your suggestions.

Vico - Do you have a reference to canon law or elsewhere regarding spritual adulthood at age 14 and the choices the Catholic Church allows at that age without parental permission? And also do you now what the Catholic Church does not allow before age 14? Thank you for posting this information.

I’m trying to keep a “malice toward none” attitude in this difficult matter.
 
… Vico - Do you have a reference to canon law or elsewhere regarding spritual adulthood at age 14 and the choices the Catholic Church allows at that age without parental permission? And also do you now what the Catholic Church does not allow before age 14? Thank you for posting this information. …
The Latin Church norms for reception of sacraments is baptism at birth, and penance, confirmation, and eucharist at the age of discretion, age 7 (this is the restored order). Also anointing of the sick becomes possible at the age of discretion.

CIC Can. 97
§1 A person who has completed the eighteenth year of age, has attained majority; below this age, a person is a minor.
§2 A minor who has not completed the seventh year of age is called an infant and is considered incapable of personal responsibility; on completion of the seventh year, however, the minor is presumed to have the use of reason.

Can. 98
§1 A person who has attained majority has the full exercise of his or her rights.
§2 In the exercise of rights a minor remains subject to parents or guardians, except for those matters in which by divine or by canon law minors are exempt from such authority. In regard to the appointment of guardians and the determination of their powers, the provisions of civil law are to be observed, unless it is otherwise provided in canon law or unless, in specific cases and for a just reason, the diocesan Bishop has decided that the matter is to be catered for by the appointment of another guardian.

Can. 99 Whoever habitually lacks the use of reason is considered as incapable of personal responsibility and is regarded as an infant.

Can. 105 §1 A minor necessarily retains the domicile or quasi-domicile of the person to whose authority the minor is subject. A minor who is no longer an infant can acquire a quasi-domicile of his or her own and, if lawfully emancipated in accordance with the civil law, a domicile also.

Can. 111
§1 Through the reception of baptism a child becomes a member of the latin Church if the parents belong to that Church or, should one of them not belong to it, if they have both by common consent chosen that the child be baptised in the latin Church: if that common consent is lacking, the child becomes a member of the ritual Church to which the father belongs.
§2 Any candidate for baptism who has completed the fourteenth year of age may freely choose to be baptised either in the latin Church or in another autonomous ritual Church; in which case the person belongs to the Church which he or she has chosen.

Can. 112 §1 After the reception of baptism, the following become members of another autonomous ritual Church:
1° those who have obtained permission from the Apostolic See;
2° a spouse who, on entering marriage or during its course, has declared that he or she is transferring to the autonomous ritual
Church of the other spouse; on the dissolution of the marriage, however, that person may freely return to the latin Church;
3° the children of those mentioned in nn. 1 and 2 who have not completed their fourteenth year, and likewise in a mixed marriage the children of a catholic party who has lawfully transferred to another ritual Church; on completion of their fourteenth year, however, they may return to the latin Church.
§2 The practice, however long standing, of receiving the sacraments according to the rite of an autonomous ritual Church, does not bring with it membership of that Church.

Usually No Confirmation Before The Age of Reason

Can. 889
§1 Every baptised person who is not confirmed, and only such a person, is capable of receiving confirmation.
§2 Apart from the danger of death, to receive confirmation lawfully a person who has the use of reason must be suitably instructed, properly disposed and able to renew the baptismal promises.
Can. 891 The sacrament of confirmation is to be conferred on the faithful at about the age of discretion, unless the Episcopal Conference has decided on a different age, or there is a danger of death or, in the judgement of the minister, a grave reason suggests otherwise.

Baptism of Adults (at least age 14)

Can. 865
§1 To be admitted to baptism, an adult must have manifested the intention to receive baptism, must be adequately instructed in the truths of the faith and in the duties of a christian, and tested in the christian life over the course of the catechumenate. The person must moreover be urged to have sorrow for personal sins.
§2 An adult in danger of death may be baptised if, with some knowledge of the principal truths of the faith, he or she has in some manner manifested the intention to receive baptism and promises to observe the requirements of the christian religion.

Can. 866 Unless there is a grave reason to the contrary, immediately after receiving baptism an adult is to be confirmed, to participate in the celebration of the Eucharist and to receive holy communion.

Baptism of Infants (before age 7)

Can. 867
§1 Parents are obliged to see that their infants are baptised within the first few weeks. As soon as possible after the birth, indeed even before it, they are to approach the parish priest to ask for the sacrament for their child, and to be themselves duly prepared for it.
§2 If the infant is in danger of death, it is to be baptised without any delay.
 
… Vico - Do you have a reference to canon law or elsewhere regarding spritual adulthood at age 14 and the choices the Catholic Church allows at that age without parental permission? And also do you now what the Catholic Church does not allow before age 14? Thank you for posting this information. …
Eucharist Requires Some Maturity

Can. 913
§1 For holy communion to be administered to children, it is required that they have sufficient knowledge and be accurately prepared, so that according to their capacity they understand what the mystery of Christ means, and are able to receive the Body of the Lord with faith and devotion.
§2 The blessed Eucharist may, however, be administered to children in danger of death if they can distinguish the Body of Christ from ordinary food and receive communion with reverence.

Penance Requires Proper Disposition (assumes age of discretion)

Can. 987
In order that the faithful may receive the saving remedy of the sacrament of penance, they must be so disposed that, repudiating the sins they have committed and having the purpose of amending their lives, they turn back to God.
Can. 989
All the faithful who have reached the age of discretion are bound faithfully to confess their grave sins at least once a year.

No Anointing of the Sick Before The Age of Reason:
Can. 1004
§1 The anointing of the sick can be administered to any member of the faithful who, having reached the use of reason, begins to be in danger of death by reason of illness or old age.

Matrimony

Can. 1057
§1 A marriage is brought into being by the lawfully manifested consent of persons who are legally capable. This consent cannot be supplied by any human power.
Can. 1083
§1 A man cannot validly enter marriage before the completion of his sixteenth year of age, nor a woman before the completion of her fourteenth year.
 
I can understand your frustration completely. I was married to an LDS man (in the Catholic Church) for ten years. Our children were being raised Catholic with exposure to LDS functions. When we divorced, he secretly had the children baptised in the LDS church. I found out years later. His bishop and most of the ward knew me and knew my beliefs and that the children were Catholics. I was furious at such an underhanded act, but have come to expect such at the hand of Mormons around here.

Still, I can empathize with your feelings.
 
No, it doesn’t. I found out during my genealogical research that my great-grandmother and great-great grandparents were “baptized” by some Mormon somewhere without my family’s consent. I’m still really angry about that.
Some of my ancestors were as well, possibly including some nuns. But I don’t see any reason to waste my time & energy being angry about it, because there’s no way it could have harmed them. They were baptized, raised, and died Catholic, and Catholic they still are.
 
RebeccaJ - I appreciate the sympathy. My son was raised in the LDS faith for 8 years before choosing to be baptized. He generally does not ask questions of a religious nature on his own, and certainly none about comparing different religious beliefs. I believe that all of us need to come to a religious decision on our own and it would be a mistake for a parent to keep a child from a broader religion exposure. However, in this case my son was attending LDS services through mid-July and then baptized Catholic August 18.
Mormons do not give their children a broad, compartive, religious education before having them baptized. Your son sounds like any 10 year old.
My son neither understands about the Catholic believe of no pre-existence, the Evangelical believe of professing Christ once and being saved, or any other numerous distinction among the various Christian sects.
Does he understand Catholic teaching?
He is smart enough to know that The Man Upstairs would neither hold my son accountable for Adam’s transgression, nor accountable for a neighbor caught shoplifting, or any other sin my son had no part in.
Catholics don’t either. This reflects what Mormonism has taught you about what Catholics believe, rather than what we actually teach.
He knows the difference between right and wrong but he still needs parents who train him up in the way he should go.
Of course. It sounds like you and your wife are not in agreement as to which way to train him.
 
The Catholic Church uses age 7 as the age of discretion but uses 14 for adult. Per Catholic canon law at age 14 one can choose for themselves what church to be baptised in.
Yes, thank you. I understand. I ask from the Mormon POV, and wondering if the OP has a double standard or is just looking for legalistic definitions.

At any rate, we baptize our children long before they are 7 years old. The OP said his son is currently in CCD, which means he is not yet confirmed.
 
I am so sorry for the pain in your family. Even if your son has chosen Catholicism for himself IMHO you still should have been allowed to participate by being present to this decision. God bless you for your non-hostility.
 
Vico - Thank you very much for posts 55 and 56.
Just one thing: I’m pretty sure that the term “autonomous ritual Church” in Can. 111 §1 refers to the various rites in union with Rome, of which there are more than 20. Two examples are the Maronite Catholic Church and the Chaldean Catholic Church. It would not be understood to include the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, or any other non-Catholic community.

I am truly sorry for your difficulty. You and your family are in my prayers.
 
Yes, thank you. I understand. I ask from the Mormon POV, and wondering if the OP has a double standard or is just looking for legalistic definitions.

At any rate, we baptize our children long before they are 7 years old. The OP said his son is currently in CCD, which means he is not yet confirmed.
Thank you, Rebecca, for explaining. I didn’t help with this question. He was baptised at age 10. I read of various dioceses have Confirmation from age 7 to 16. For example, in Phoenix the restored order is used. In the Diocese of Phoenix, the children are prepared for First Reconciliation in grade 2, and for Confirmation and First Eucharist in grade 3. I suppose if he was ther he could be confirmed at age 11, a year later, after preparation.
 
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