Need Advice on a Heritical parish

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RomanumImperium said:
To Caesar .
Thank you very much for your responce…yes I am aware of the Classical Roman Mass (though have yet to attend one) my personnal belief is that the Tridentine Mass is of course the one true Mass of the Catholic Religion…however the Vatican saw fit to create a new one (God only Know what the Cardinals had been smoking that day)
and as someone who has grown up with the English translation of the new Mass it would be very hard for me to adapt to Latin (although i wouldnt dismiss doing this outright)
My only wish is that the Church had translated the Tridentine Mass into english instead of creating an new one outright. Though i have not been to one personaly i have seen pictures of the Tridentine Mass being celebrated on the internet…it looks stunning… the western counterpart to the the Eastern Divine Liturgy that i have become accutom to.

the closest thing ive seen to a Tridentine Mass is a “mass” Celebrated in “All Saints” anglo-Catholic Church here in brisbane…and i must say it puts the Catholic Church to shame. It even had the blessing with Holy water before “High Mass”

O and God Bless your vocation to the Priesthood…the Church needs more Traditional priests…i’ll offer up these michaelmas ember days for you and for others seeking Vocation into the Traditional orders of the Church.
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The Latin issue isnt so bad since at the Tridentine Mass the congregation follows along in a Missal book with the English translations.

Interestingly though, one priest I talked to recently said that the original intention of Vatican II was to allow Low Masses to have the Propers said in vernacular and the Ordinaries staying in Latin, with a High Mass remaining completely in Latin.
 
Looks like the Archbishop already knows.

From OnlineCatholics.com.au

"Bathersby censures St Mary’s Church
The Archbishop of Brisbane, John Bathersby, has told St Mary’s Catholic Church, South Brisbane, that it “no longer belongs to the Archdiocese or indeed the Catholic Church”, but stopped short of taking firm action against the parish…(More)
 
"We will speak of God as ‘Creator, Liberator and Sustainer’ as often as ‘Father, Son and Spirit’ because it is ritually inclusive.

Thank you Mr. Heretic, now please leave. 👍 👍
 
demerzel85 said:
Kyrie Eleison
Christe Eleison
Kyrie Eleison

Now this pales in comparison in what happens in my own diocese.
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Man, talk about, huh? This is just dumbfounding. I didn’t think stuff like this existed. The most I have to worry about is if we hold hands during the Our Father.
This is just crazy, it almost sounds like some kind of unitarian church or something. I guess I am lucky to never have walked into a place like this, ever. Of course, in south Louisiana, we are a pretty big traditionalist Catholic society.

Wow, thats all I can say, wow.:eek:
 
RomanumImperium said:
and not its no Neo-Catechumenal…at least it doesnt say so their news bullitan…however it does advertsise studding “Enneageam Panels” “Dances of Universal peace” and “Pet Mass” for your Cats and Dogs:(

doesnt strike me as really Catholic…and Im surprised that the Bishop has allowed this to continue.
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Is there an indult Traditional Latin Mass in Brisbane? You might be very pleased with that. Please don’t abandon the Catholic Church!
 
Dear Romanum,

Don’t leave the Catholic Church - you would risk your eternal salvation. Surely even if you had to walk for an hour to get to Mass it wouldn’t be too much trouble.

Perhaps you could go in to St Stephen’s Cathedral for Mass.

I just have to warn you that your ‘personal belief’ is itself HERESY:
RomanumImperium said:
my personnal belief is that the Tridentine Mass is of course the one true Mass of the Catholic Religion…however the Vatican saw fit to create a new one (God only Know what the Cardinals had been smoking that day)
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That, Romanum, is heresy.

Because, as Pope Paul VI said:
“The reform [of the Liturgy] which is about to be brought into being is therefore a response to an authoritative mandate from the Church. It is an act of obedience. It is an act of coherence of the Church with herself. It is a step forward for her authentic tradition. It is a demonstration of fidelity and vitality, to which we all must give prompt assent.” (General Audience, November 19, 1969)
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Consider also:
Pope Pius XII, Mediator Dei, 1947:
58. …the Sovereign Pontiff alone enjoys the right to recognize and establish any practice touching the worship of God, to introduce and approve new rites, as also to modify those he judges to require modification.
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Council of Trent, Session 21, Chapter II: ‘It furthermore declares that this power has ever been in the Church: that, in the dispensation of the sacraments, their substance being untouched, it may ordain, or change, what things soever it may judge most expedient, for the profit of those who receive, or for the veneration of the said sacraments, according to the difference of circumstances, times, and places.’
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If you really are a papist at heart, you will give the submission of your mind and will to the authority of Christ’s Church, especially regarding the liturgy that the Church prescribes.

Concerning those who reject (on their own authority) the new Liturgy (which was introduced by the Church’s Divine authority):
Pope Pius X: “Do not allow yourselves to be deceived by the cunning statements of those who persistently claim to wish to be with the Church, to love the Church, to fight so that people do not leave Her…But judge them by their works. If they despise the shepherds of the Church and even the Pope, if they attempt all means of evading their authority in order to elude their directives and judgements…, then about which Church do these men mean to speak? Certainly not about that established on the foundations of the apostles and prophets, with Jesus Christ Himself as the cornerstone.” (Papal Speech, 1909)
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Pope Pius IX: “those who are obstinate toward the authority and definitions of the…Church, and who persistently separate themselves from the unity of the Church, and from the Roman Pontiff,…cannot obtain eternal salvation.” (Quanto Conficiamur Moerore, 1863)
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Cardinal John Henry Newman: “I say with Cardinal Bellarmine whether the Pope be infallible or not in any pronouncement, anyhow he is to be obeyed. No good can come from disobedience. His facts and his warnings may be all wrong; his deliberations may have been biased. He may have been misled. Imperiousness and craft, tyranny and cruelty, may be patent in the conduct of his advisers and instruments. But when he speaks formally and authoritatively he speaks as our Lord would have him speak, and all those imperfections and sins of individuals are overruled for that result which our Lord intends (just as the action of the wicked and of enemies to the Church are overruled) and therefore the Pope’s word stands, and a blessing goes with obedience to it, and no blessing with disobedience.” (The Oratory, Nov. 10, 1867)
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(emphasis added])

God bless you, and I will keep you in my prayers.
 
Run away, run away mate…the guys there have used novel and blasphemous names for the Holy Trinity…they are apparently truely dweadful…
 
Melanie, your place seems to be good and traditional, you might want to PM poor old Imperium and tell him whereabouts he can go to get away from the travesty he’s described.
 
I noted what you said about not having enough money to get to a church further away. What I would recommend is calling another parish office and ask if there is anyone close by who may be willing to give your a ride. I had this problem with a church I was attending when in Canada and it was very late at night (Easter Vigil Mass), very cold and the buses would have stopped running by the time the Mass finished. I emailed the Parish priest and he was able to think of several people he could ask to help me out. Just give them a call, you may find someone very sympathetic to your situation.
 
Romanum, I have to apologise for saying -
Trevelyan said:
I just have to warn you that your ‘personal belief’ is itself HERESY…That, Romanum, is heresy.
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You see, I used to be a traditionalist, until I realised that many traditionalists held heretical beliefs about the authority of the Church, the Pope and church Councils (and thus refuse to submit to the decisions of the Pope and the Vatican Council).

I made a rash judgement and my words were too strong. But you are verging on the heretical mindset of many traditionalists. So beware of it (consider again the quotes which I gave above).
 
Trevelyan said:
Romanum, I have to apologise for saying -

You see, I used to be a traditionalist, until I realised that many traditionalists held heretical beliefs about the authority of the Church, the Pope and church Councils (and thus refuse to submit to the decisions of the Pope and the Vatican Council).

I made a rash judgement and my words were too strong. But you are verging on the heretical mindset of many traditionalists. So beware of it (consider again the quotes which I gave above).
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Careful which traditionalists you label as schismatic or heretical.

I am a traditionalist, but I am not schismatic, Sedevacantist or heretical. I am a Catholic who prefers the Traditional Roman Rite, over the Novus Ordo Missae. The Traditional Mass is allowed by the Church- in fact many new religious orders (and some old ones) that are in full communion with the Holy See celebrate the Traditional Mass. They are not heretics. In fact, before his election as Supreme Pontiff, then-Cardinal Ratzinger was supported and encouraged the celebration of the Traditional Mass-

http://www.fssp.org/album/VS1990W/pratzinger 1990 02.jpg
http://www.fssp.org/album/VS1990W/pratzinger 1990 03.jpg
http://www.fssp.org/album/VS1990W/pratzinger 1990 12.jpg
http://www.fssp.org/album/VS1990W/pratzinger 1990 10.jpg

Is our Pope a heretic? I think not!

Now, I support the validity of the Novus Ordo Missae, however that does not stop me from saying that it lacks much of what the Tridentine Mass has- a partial cause for the current state of the Church. Nor is the Novus Ordo part of the Second Vatican Council- it was created after the Council.
 
Caesar,
I never said that you or the Pope were heretics, in fact I didn’t specify any traditionalists at all, and I certainly didn’t say that all traditionalists are heretics.

I said that “many traditionalists hold heretical beliefs about the authority of the Church, the Pope and church Councils (and thus refuse to submit to the decisions of the Pope and the Vatican Council).” And I know that to be true.
 
Caesar said:
Careful which traditionalists you label as schismatic or heretical.

I am a traditionalist, but I am not schismatic, Sedevacantist or heretical. I am a Catholic who prefers the Traditional Roman Rite, over the Novus Ordo Missae. The Traditional Mass is allowed by the Church- in fact many new religious orders (and some old ones) that are in full communion with the Holy See celebrate the Traditional Mass. They are not heretics. In fact, before his election as Supreme Pontiff, then-Cardinal Ratzinger was supported and encouraged the celebration of the Traditional Mass-

http://www.fssp.org/album/VS1990W/pratzinger 1990 02.jpg
http://www.fssp.org/album/VS1990W/pratzinger 1990 03.jpg
http://www.fssp.org/album/VS1990W/pratzinger 1990 12.jpg
http://www.fssp.org/album/VS1990W/pratzinger 1990 10.jpg

Is our Pope a heretic? I think not!

Now, I support the validity of the Novus Ordo Missae, however that does not stop me from saying that it lacks much of what the Tridentine Mass has- a partial cause for the current state of the Church. Nor is the Novus Ordo part of the Second Vatican Council- it was created after the Council.
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To state that the Pauline Mass is “very Protestant” (as you did in another thread) smacks of heresy inasmuch as Protestantism is heretical and the Church anathematizes those who state that any discipline she imposes might lead the faithful to impiety (Council of Trent). I’m not saying you ARE a heretic or schismatic, merely that that is an attitude that verges dangerously close and you might want to look at it. It is, I believe, shared by known schismatics such as the SSPX.

Lovely pictures. One Mass does not a policy make. How many times has the Holy Father celebrated the TLM since he assumed office?
 
Trevelyan said:
I said that “many traditionalists hold heretical beliefs about the authority of the Church, the Pope and church Councils (and thus refuse to submit to the decisions of the Pope and the Vatican Council).” And I know that to be true.
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Well it shouldnt be ‘many traditionalists…’. More accurately it should be ‘some traditionalists…’. This is simply because no one has any idea about the exact figures. Yes, some SSPX Chapel attendees, hold beliefs about the Catholic Church that are basically heretical or bordering on it, but no one know if that ‘some’ is actually ‘many’.
 
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