Need anti-marcionism material

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I asked a similar question some time ago, and I would like to add to it.

I understand that God is God, and He can do whatever he wants, but I still have trouble understanding and defending this point.

How could God in the Old Testament be a God that commanded the destruction of entire peoples turn into the God that revealed himself as a God of love in the New Testament?

Also, how could God give the 5th Commandment, but then order the Israelites into war?

In other words, why does the Old Testament have so many “ugly” actions happen that are commanded by God in it, which can appear completely opposite of the revealed God in the New Testament?

Finally, how was Marcion of Sinope defeated doctrinally?

Thanks,
fish90
 
Finally, how was Marcion of Sinope defeated doctrinally?
I would answer this last question first.

Marcion was a dualist: he believed that the God of the Old Testament - the Demiurge that created the material world according to him - was an inferior, somewhat vengeful and jealous tribal Jewish deity, whose law represents legalistic reciprocal justice and who punishes mankind for its sins through suffering and death. Contrastingly, the God that Jesus professed is an altogether different and more superior being, a universal God of compassion and love who looks upon humanity with benevolence and mercy.

Because Marcion believed that the world was created by the Demiurge, he held it to be evil (in this he was in alignment with gnostic thought). Hence, he was also a Docetist: he was of the idea that Jesus never really became a flesh-and-blood human but just appeared to have a material body. Unlike gnostic sects however, who generally believed that every human being is born with a small piece of the ‘divine spark’ lodged within his/her spirit, Marcion held the idea that the Heavenly Father was an utterly alien God; he had no part in making the physical world, nor any connection with it. He really only agreed to help mankind out of His mercy.

Marcion proposed a Scriptual canon of his own, which consisted of only eleven books grouped into two sections: the Evangelikon, a sort of truncated version of the Gospel of Luke, and the Apostolikon, a selection of ten letters by St. Paul, who Marcion considered the correct interpreter and transmitter of Jesus’ teachings. Both sections were purged of elements relating to Jesus’ birth and childhood, Judaism (Marcion was pretty much anti-Jewish, as you can see), and material which challenged his beliefs.

Take for example Jesus’ prayer: “I give you thanks, Father, Lord of heaven and earth” is changed to “I give thanks, Father, Lord of heaven” (since God never had any affinity with the earth, Marcion cut it off); “O foolish and hard of heart to believe in all that the prophets have spoken,” is changed into, “O foolish and hard of heart to believe in all that I have told you” (because the prophets were acting under the orders of the OT God); the accusation that the chief priests lay against Jesus, “We found this one subverting our nation” (receives the addition: “and destroying the law and the prophets” (which makes Jesus anti-Jewish like Marcion!)

Some orthodox writers have taken on Marcion, one of them being Tertullian: he makes reference to Marcion in several of his works, such as De Carne Christi (On the Flesh of Christ), De Resurrectione Carnis (On the Resurrection of the Flesh), De Anima (On the Soul) and devotes a five-book work specifically targeted against Marcion: Adversus Marcionem (Against Marcion). Aside from him, St. Justin Martyr also makes a reference to the Marcionites in his First Apology and St. Irenaeus refers to Marcion, however, again and again in his Against Heresies (especially in Books 3 and 4). Rather than repeat it all here, I’d rather you read them for yourself.
 
How might the destruction of entire peoples be considered an act of a loving God? The innocent among the destroyed, preserved by a loving God from falling into the wicked ways of their fellows, will rise again at the end of the world to receive everlasting happiness. And, the wicked among the destroyed, kept by a loving God from doing further wickedness, will rise again at the end of the world to receive a more lenient everlasting punishment than they might otherwise.
 
Also, how could God give the 5th Commandment, but then order the Israelites into war?
Ah, “Thou shalt not murder.”
The Hebrew word used in Exodus 20 - and which only appears in the OT 46 times, is רצה raṣaḥ (also transliterated ratzach, ratsach, ratzakh, etc.) It originally referred to killing one person in retaliation for killing someone else; ultimately the word came to mean any killing motivated by animosity. Raṣaḥ is used only a few times in the OT; there is another, more general word for ‘to kill’: הרג harag.

In long passages in Numbers 35, Deuteronomy 19, and Joshua 20-21, for instance, raṣaḥ is used to describe the act of someone who has committed what we might call nowadays manslaughter. In most of the contexts where it does appear, it is used to refer to any killing that is done in the manner of a predatory animal; i.e. 1) as an angry reaction to stimulus; or 2) lying in wait, as a predator waits for its prey. Thus we have no difficulty or contradiction with this, or with places where God declares judgment of death upon men, since the Israelites were not doing things like recklessly slaughtering people for no particularly good reason (that would fall under the rubric of raṣaḥ!), but were waging wars of conquest.

Now what about Leviticus 24:17? “And when a man strikes any life/soul of mankind, dying he must die.” The word here is נכה nakah, ‘to strike’, ‘to hit’ or ‘to smite’. By itself it does not mean “to kill” but is given that definition by context alone. For instance, it is a word that is used in the sense of striking (Genesis 19:11), defeating or conquering (Genesis 14:5, 7).

Would warfare fall under the ban? I quote from the site I linked to a couple of paragraphs ago:

War. It is here that some difference of opinion arises, and anti-war protesters have at times used this command. In light of the above delineations it appears that such objectors could be right, if a war is pursued under certain conditions.

Iraq’s invasion of Kuwait would constitute a premeditated act; but our reply war in the Gulf was seen as a matter of liberation and defense, and the war in Iraq was framed as a war of defense against terrorist elements.

While making no statement on that issue, a war waged for such a purpose clearly does not come under the rubric of ratsach, nor would America’s War of Independence, nor World War I and II as a whole (though of course individual acts of ratsach may still occur). Animals do not fight for their freedom from tyranny, and they fight to defend themselves, which is neither done in passion nor is it premeditated.
 
How might the destruction of entire peoples be considered an act of a loving God? The innocent among the destroyed, preserved by a loving God from falling into the wicked ways of their fellows, will rise again at the end of the world to receive everlasting happiness. And, the wicked among the destroyed, kept by a loving God from doing further wickedness, will rise again at the end of the world to receive a more lenient everlasting punishment than they might otherwise.
I must ask; were these people blessed for they were disallowed the capacity to sin, when they were killed?
 
I asked a similar question some time ago, and I would like to add to it.

I understand that God is God, and He can do whatever he wants, but I still have trouble understanding and defending this point.

How could God in the Old Testament be a God that commanded the destruction of entire peoples turn into the God that revealed himself as a God of love in the New Testament?

Also, how could God give the 5th Commandment, but then order the Israelites into war?

In other words, why does the Old Testament have so many “ugly” actions happen that are commanded by God in it, which can appear completely opposite of the revealed God in the New Testament?

Finally, how was Marcion of Sinope defeated doctrinally?

Thanks,
fish90
The morally ugly parts of the Old Testament represented a different, but evolving conception of God, than the God of Jesus. Marcion though it was two different Gods- but we say iy is more like two different pictures of the same God (one a immature and incomplete picture- the OT, and the Gospels give us a better picture).
 
The morally ugly parts of the Old Testament represented a different, but evolving conception of God, than the God of Jesus. Marcion though it was two different Gods- but we say iy is more like two different pictures of the same God (one a immature and incomplete picture- the OT, and the Gospels give us a better picture).
But, God commanded certain events to be done that can be questionable to people. I mention this to point out a difference, because a command from God would, in my opinion, be an opportunity for the authors to not make a mistake.

Would the best way for me to understand this is that you must look deeper and see God’s goodness? One example would be from a previous poster who posted something to the effect that the instances of death in the bible were done so that the wicked would be punished less severely.

However, why, for example, were South Americans or Asians not chosen?
 
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