New World Translation - Jesuits

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I got this insert in my newspaper… It is basically saying that all translations have taken away from the Word of God except for the Authorized King James Version.

It goes on to accuse the Catholic Church for creating the New World Translation and proves it by saying that the 1950 edition forward lists Jose Maria Bover S.J. and H. Merk S.J. as the publishers.

I have a 1984 copy on my shelf but nobody is named in the forward. If you Google these names you just find a bunch of wacky fundy sites linking the Catholic Church to the Watchtower society.

Does anyone know if these two guys really existed and if so what did they have to do with the N.W.T.? (Hopefully not much, since it’s such a ridiculous translation.)

Thanks,
Vat2
 
Are you referring to this?

"V. New World Translation Errors

A. Manuscript Problems

The New World Translation is translated from Catholic manuscripts (Sinaiticus and Vaticanus) containing the Apocrypha.
  • changed by Origen and the Popes over the years to attack important doctrines. The following verses were cut out: Matt 17:21; 18:11; 23:14; Mk 7:16; 9:44,46; 11:26; 15:28; Lk 23:17; Jn 5:4; Act 8:37; 28:29; Rom 16:24.
  • Jesuit theologians were involved in the New World Translation: Jose Maria Bover S. J. and A. Merk S.J., found in the forward of the 1950 edition.
  • The King James translators rejected the Roman Catholic manuscripts and chose the Tex[t]us Receptus (no Apocrypha) for translation.
If the NWT is better because of better educated men to translate, then God left us in the dark until 1901, because the NWT is drastically different from all other translations."

rotoruabbc.homestead.com/Refutation~ns4.html

All it amounts to is, that the printed editions of the text of the NT by (among others) these two priests, were consulted by the people responsible for the 1950 NWT NT. Which is not exactly incriminating 🙂

For Padre Bover’s edition of the text of the NT - skypoint.com/~waltzmn/CriticalEds.html#Bover

on this page: skypoint.com/~waltzmn/CriticalEds.html

For Padre Merk’s edition: skypoint.com/~waltzmn/CriticalEds.html#Merk

The author is making the not uncommon mistake of criticising other versions for leaving out verses present in the AV/KJV; which is done, not because the text base of those versions is wrong, but because it is not the same text base as that of the AV. ##
 
I got this insert in my newspaper… It is basically saying that all translations have taken away from the Word of God except for the Authorized King James Version.

It goes on to accuse the Catholic Church for creating the New World Translation and proves it by saying that the 1950 edition forward lists Jose Maria Bover S.J. and H. Merk S.J. as the publishers.

I have a 1984 copy on my shelf but nobody is named in the forward. If you Google these names you just find a bunch of wacky fundy sites linking the Catholic Church to the Watchtower society.

Does anyone know if these two guys really existed and if so what did they have to do with the N.W.T.? (Hopefully not much, since it’s such a ridiculous translation.)

Thanks,
Vat2

Are you referring to this?​

"V. New World Translation Errors

A. Manuscript Problems

The New World Translation is translated from Catholic manuscripts (Sinaiticus and Vaticanus) containing the Apocrypha.
  • changed by Origen and the Popes over the years to attack important doctrines. The following verses were cut out: Matt 17:21; 18:11; 23:14; Mk 7:16; 9:44,46; 11:26; 15:28; Lk 23:17; Jn 5:4; Act 8:37; 28:29; Rom 16:24.
  • Jesuit theologians were involved in the New World Translation: Jose Maria Bover S. J. and A. Merk S.J., found in the forward of the 1950 edition.
  • The King James translators rejected the Roman Catholic manuscripts and chose the Tex[t]us Receptus (no Apocrypha) for translation.
If the NWT is better because of better educated men to translate, then God left us in the dark until 1901, because the NWT is drastically different from all other translations."

rotoruabbc.homestead.com/Refutation~ns4.html

All it amounts to is, that the printed editions of the text of the NT by (among others) these two priests, were consulted by the people responsible for the 1950 NWT NT. Which is not exactly incriminating 🙂

For Padre Bover’s edition of the text of the NT - skypoint.com/~waltzmn/CriticalEds.html#Bover

on this page: skypoint.com/~waltzmn/CriticalEds.html

For Padre Merk’s edition: skypoint.com/~waltzmn/CriticalEds.html#Merk

The author of the remarks about the “manuscript problems” is making the not uncommon mistake of criticising other versions for leaving out verses present in the AV/KJV; which is done, not because the text base of those versions is wrong, but because it is not the same text base as that of the AV. ##
 
As one of Jehovah’s Witnesses I can tell you that Catholics had nothing to do with the New World Translation. And as for KJ Version? It is not a very good translation in some respects. Especially for today. Many of the words and phrases used are not understood in today’s modern language. I would encourage you to use many different translations, including the KJV. The truth is in all of them and it is good to compare how the translaters put into english. As for the NWT being a ridiculous translation, Bible scholars around the world agree that it is a very accurate rendering of the orignal languages. It is not based on other translations. If you do real research on the NWT you will find just how accurate it is. It is different from other translations in that the translaters did not let relious beliefs water down what the original languages said. In fact some beliefs of Jehovah’s Witnesses were altered because some passages in earlier translations were found not to be accurate to the older manuscripts. So instead of making the Bible translation fit our beliefs, we corrected our beliefs based upon new information.
 
Bible scholars around the world agree that it is a very accurate rendering of the orignal languages
Is that a literal word-for-word rendering, or a more dynamic what-did-the-writer-instead-to-say translation? Not sure what “accurate” really means.
 
As one of Jehovah’s Witnesses I can tell you that Catholics had nothing to do with the New World Translation. And as for KJ Version? It is not a very good translation in some respects. Especially for today. Many of the words and phrases used are not understood in today’s modern language. I would encourage you to use many different translations, including the KJV. The truth is in all of them and it is good to compare how the translaters put into english. As for the NWT being a ridiculous translation, Bible scholars around the world agree that it is a very accurate rendering of the orignal languages. It is not based on other translations. If you do real research on the NWT you will find just how accurate it is. It is different from other translations in that the translaters did not let relious beliefs water down what the original languages said. In fact some beliefs of Jehovah’s Witnesses were altered because some passages in earlier translations were found not to be accurate to the older manuscripts. So instead of making the Bible translation fit our beliefs, we corrected our beliefs based upon new information.

It has been very unsatisfactory in some respects:​

  • Its rendering of John 1.1 has been justly criticised, by no less an authority than Bruce Metzger, who wrote an booklet explaining why the rendering “and the Word was a god…” is impossible; & why others were too. This is inaccurate rendering, even though the definite article is lacking before theos, “God”; its absence is not crucial to the meaning: as the translators themselves show by their practice elsewhere.
  • 19.21 in the Greek is an example of the same construction - so it ought, if 1.1 is being correctly rendered in the NWT, to read, “**a **King of the Jews”. Both constructions lack the article.
  • Why was para theou (John 1.6) not translated “from **a **god” ? - it has no article either.
  • Its rendering of Colossians 1.15-17 inserts the word “other”, in square brackets, four times, giving the impression that Paul is saying Christ is a creature. There is no textual evidence for this evenonce, let alone in all four cases; & no grammatical reason for it, & no justification for it in Paul’s doctrine of the Person of Christ. It has no business to be in the text at all.
  • Its rendering of John 14.26 - “that one will teach you all things”. The relative proun used is not the neuter ekeino, but the masculine ekeinos, “he”.
    This is a small sample of errors in the NWT - errors, not possible variants in text or meaning; which, with the manner in which the translated text is “Englished”, is the explanation for the overwhelming majority of the differences between one translation of the NT & another.
  1. Differences between translation of the NTs into English (other than the NWT) come from (e.g.):
  • difference of underlying text - in rare instances, such as that of George Lamsa’s translation, the text base is not Greek; the same applies to the Knox NT (1945)
    • so, most of 1 John 5.7 is unsupported in the textual tradition; which is why it is present in AV & versions from the Vulgate, but not in most of the modern ETs (it may be in one or two, such as the NKJV). The NWT, quite correctly, does not include it.
  • ambiguity in the Greek - forms of some words are identical with others: echete = “have ye !” & “ye have”; anōthen = “from above; over again”. So there is no one correct translation of “you must be born anōthen” (John 3.5); there is a choice. And this ambiguity may reflect John’s own intention as an author: Nicodemus understands Jesus as meaning one thing, the Christian will take him as meaning another
  • over-literal translation of features proper to Greek into English: as in AV-KJV “Whom do men say that I am?”, which translates Greek hon, “whom”, in a manner which is correct as to meaning, but incorrect as idiomatic English.
  • Sometimes there is doubt as to where a sentence ends, as in Ephesians.
  1. A text base, however good it may be, is no guarantee of the accuracy of the translators. None of these flaws are new discoveries - they were facts of the Greek text & its grammar 50 years ago, no less than they are now. Yet these errors appeared in the earlier editions of the NWT. Unless these & other errors have been corrected, the NWT today will be as faulty as it was before.
These & other differences from other translations of the NT are not based on variations in the reading of the text from the translation comes, they are not possible different meanings of the text - they are mistranslations.

No translation can altogether escape the bias of its translators - but unless the theology responsible for these errors is corrected, it is hard to see how the same errors can be avoided in the future. ##
 
As one of Jehovah’s Witnesses I can tell you that Catholics had nothing to do with the New World Translation. And as for KJ Version? It is not a very good translation in some respects. Especially for today. Many of the words and phrases used are not understood in today’s modern language. I would encourage you to use many different translations, including the KJV. The truth is in all of them and it is good to compare how the translaters put into english. As for the NWT being a ridiculous translation, Bible scholars around the world agree that it is a very accurate rendering of the orignal languages. It is not based on other translations. If you do real research on the NWT you will find just how accurate it is. It is different from other translations in that the translaters did not let relious beliefs water down what the original languages said. In fact some beliefs of Jehovah’s Witnesses were altered because some passages in earlier translations were found not to be accurate to the older manuscripts. So instead of making the Bible translation fit our beliefs, we corrected our beliefs based upon new information.
I just finished doing the research you suggested with a Jehovah’s Witness I know. After we finished, we BOTH concluded the translation is probably one of the worst available. Which Bible scholars agreed that it is an accurate rendering?! That claim is simply false! Virtually every review I read, from almost every faith and historical perspective across the board, pointed to how badly (and in fact, biased) certain passages were rendered! There are some terrible mistranslations from the Greek that totally alter the Bible to suit JW doctirne. In fact, my acquaintance was so disturbed by his findings, that he is now considering conversion to the Catholic Church! 👍
 
I own a 1950 edition, here it the truth of the matter,

The 1950 Copyright cover page lists “Watch Tower Bible & Tract Society” as the publisher.
The **Greek Text **that we have used as the basis of our New World translation is the widely accepted Westcott and Hort text ( 1881 ), by reason of its admitted excellence. But, we have also taken into consideration other texts, including that prepared by D. Eberhard Nestle and that compied by the Spanish Jesuit scholar Jose Maria Bover and that by the other Jesuit scholar A. Merk.
Page 8 Forward, New World Translation of the Christian Greek Scriptures 1950 edition.

ROFL, The forward is only talking about the Greek texts they used. Nothing about Jesuit translators or about Jesuit publishers.
 
Wynngunn,

Hello and welcome to the Catholic Answers Forums. I hope you have a blessed and uplifting time here.

About fifteen years ago I had a series of Bible studies in my house with a pair of Jehovah’s Witnesses. One of the few specifics about the New World Translation that sticks in my mind is that it renders Jesus’ words at the Last Supper as “This means My Body” rather than “This is My Body.” My wife, who majored in classics (Greek and Latin) in college, looked up the Greek and said that it very plainly does not say “means.” In this way, at least, the New World Translation is considerably less accurate than other translations.
  • Liberian
 
Hello wynngunn . I’d like to say that it is good to see Witnesses posting on this forum. Before I begin, in the interest of honesty I should tell you; I have had some involvement with the Witnesses in the past.That’s all I’ll say, for reasons of anonymity. I would understand , although it would sadden me, if you chose not to respond to me.

I would like to respond to some of the things you said about the NWT.

You said - “I can tell you that Catholics had nothing to do with the New World Translation” . - I would like to discuss this, in terms of “directly”, or “indirectly”.

Directly - The fact is, that neither you nor I know who was directly responsible for translating the New World Translation, because the WT Society has chosen to keep the names of the translators secret. We can take an educated guess as to who it was, but in the end that’s all it is - an educated guess. Now, I agree with 99.9999 % certainty that no Catholic was on the commitee that translated the NWT - but the fact remains, that if someone absolutely insisted that a Catholic was on that commitee, we would be hard pressed to prove that it wasn’t true. That’s the shortcoming of not releasing the names of the translators. There has been all kind of speculation about who was on that commitee, and what their qualifications were or were not. Just to make a point, I would good-naturedly suggest to you to provide a quote from WT literature that even says that the translators were Jehovah’s Witnesses.

Indirectly - While we can reasonably agree that no Catholic directly translated the NWT, I would suggest to you that Catholics were very much responsible for it, in an indirect way. The manuscripts of the Bible that we now have come from the Catholic Church. I invite you, if you haven’t already, to further research the history of the existing manuscripts of the New Testament, and by whom, and under what circumstances, they were produced and preserved. Here’s a quote from the WT publication, “All Scripture is Inspired of God and Beneficial”, p. 317, para 16, 1990 ed. “The New Bible Dictionary reports 274 uncial manuscripts of the Christian Greek Scriptures, and these date from the fourth century C.E. to the tenth century C.E. … Because of their early date and general accuracy, the uncial manuscripts were extensively used by the New World Translation Commitee in making careful renderings of the Greek text.” Again, I would invite you to look into who produced and preserved those manuscripts.

For example, looking at the list of sources for the footnotes in the 1984 New World Translation Reference Edition, on page 9, I see “B - Vatican ms. 1200. Gr., fourth cent C.E., Vatican City, Rome, H.S., G.S.” A quick glance shows that it is referenced, for example, in the NWT Reference Edition in the footnotes at John 1:18 and John 4:9. This is the well known and highly valuable Vatican manuscript that is used in such standard reference works as the United Bible Society’s “Greek New Testament”. How is it that God would use the entity that the Witnesses consider to be “the man of lawlessness… the son of destruction” (2 Thess 2:3) to produce, protect, and make available to others, the manuscripts of the Bible?

Along these lines, I highly recommend to you the book “Where We Got The Bible - Our Debt to the Catholic Church” by Henry G. Graham.

Again, I would like to say that it is good to see Witnesses who are willing to discuss and defend their faith posting on this forum, and I hope to see more of you here.
 
…As for the NWT being a ridiculous translation, Bible scholars around the world agree that it is a very accurate rendering of the orignal languages. It is not based on other translations. If you do real research on the NWT you will find just how accurate it is. It is different from other translations in that the translaters did not let relious beliefs water down what the original languages said. In fact some beliefs of Jehovah’s Witnesses were altered because some passages in earlier translations were found not to be accurate to the older manuscripts. So instead of making the Bible translation fit our beliefs, we corrected our beliefs based upon new information.
“Bible scholars around the world agree…” Name them and give the documents where they make this claim, and also give any afiliations. An unsuported claim is just that. On the contrary, the consensus of scholarly response is ithe NWT is NOT a translation, rather it is an egregiously bad transliteration from one or several english translations. The scholarly (including quite secular scholars) dismissal of the NWT is easily found with a 15 minute Google search.

JW founder Charles Taze Russell claimed in court to be an expert in biblical langueges. When presented with a Greek New Testament he was forced to admit he didn’t even recognize the Greek alphabet, and also admited he was ignorant of Hebrew and Latin, in contradiction to his prior claim. (BTW, Russell is the origin of the JW belief that John 1:1 means"a god" --If the the JW changed their beliefs in accordance to their “translation” why not this one?)

The late Frederick Franz had a similar experiece;in a Scottish court he was convicted for perjury for claiming to be an “expert” in scriptural Hebrew–and was utterly unable to translate a simple Hebrew phrase. Franz is widely believed (from the testimony of his nephew) to be the primary “translator” of the NWT, having only academicaly studied 2 years of MODERN Greek and self-studying Hebrew (which didn’t do him much good in Scotland) The other three “translators” had NO background in scriptural languages.
 
Dr. Goodspeed The grammar is regrettable . . . .
Dr. J. R. Mantey (who is quoted on pages 1158-1159) of the Witnesses own Kingdom Interlinear TransIation): "A shocking mistranslation. “Obsolete and incorrect.” It is neither scholarly nor reasonable to translate John 1 :1 "The Word was a god.’
Dr. Bruce M. Metzger “A frightful mistranslation.” “Erroneous” and “pernicious” “Irepre-hensible” , " If the Jehovah’s Witnesses take this translation seriously, they are polytheists."
Dr. Samuel J. Mikolaski of Zurich, Switzerland: "This anarthrous construction does not mean what the indefinite article “a’” means in English. It is monstrous to translate the phrase “the Word was a god.”
Dr. Paul L. Kaufman of Portland, Oregon: "The Jehovah’s Witnesses people evidence an abysmal ignorance of the basic tenets of Greek grammar In their mistranslation of John 1 :1 "
Dr. Charles L. Feinberg of La Mirada, California: “I can assure you that the rend-ering which the Jehovah’s Witnesses give John 1 :l is not held by any reputable Greek scholar” .
Dr. James L. Boyer of Winona Lake, Indiana: “I have never heard of , or read of any Greek Scholar who would agree to the interpretation of this verse insisted upon by the Jehovah’s Witnesses . . . I have never encountered one of them who had any knowledge of the Greek language.”
Dr. William Barclay of the University of Glasgow , Scotland: “The deliberate distortion of truth by this sect is seen in their New testament translations John 1:1 is translated: “. . the Word was a god,” a translation which is grammatically impossible. . . . It is abundantly clear that a sect which can translate the New Testament like that is intellectually dishonest.”
Dr. F. F. Bruce of the University of Manchester, England: “Much is made by Arian amateur grammarians of the omission of the definite article with “God” in the phrase “And the Word was God.” Such an omission is common with nouns in a predicative construction. . . . “a god” would be totally indefensible”.
Dr . Ernest C. Colwell of the University of Chicago; “A definite predicate nominative has the article when it follows the verb; it does not have the article when it precedes the verb. . . this statement cannot be regarded as strange in the prologue of the gospel which reaches its climax in the confession of Thomas. “My Lord and my God.”-John 20; 28.”.
Dr. Philip B. Harner of Heidelberg College: “The verb preceding an anarthrous predicate, would probably mean that the Iogos was “a god” or a divine being of some kind, belonging to the general category of theos but as a distinct being from ho theos. In the form that John actually uses, the word “theos” is placed at the beginning for emphasis.”
Dr. J. Johnson of California State University, Long Beach: “No Justification whatsoever for translating theos en ho logos as “the Word was a god.” There is no syntactical parallel to Acts 23:6 where there is a statement in indirect discourse; John 1: l is direct. . . I am neither a Christian nor a trinitarian.”
Dr. Eugene A. Nida, head of Translations Department, American Bible Society: “With regard to John. 1 .1 , there is of course a complication simply because the New World Translation was apparently done by persons who did not take seriously the syntax of the Greek.”
Dr. B. F. Westcott (whose Greek text not the English part is used in the Kingdom InterIinear Translation): “The predicate (God) stands emphatically first, as in iv. 24. It is necessarily without the article. . . . No idea of inferiority of nature is suggested by the form of expression, which simply affirms the true deity of the Word. . . . in the third clause “the Word” is declared to be “GOD.” and so included in the unity of the Godhead.”
Dr. J. J. Griesbach (whose Greek text, not the English parts used in the Emphatic Diaglott ):
“So numerous, and clear are the arguments and testimonies of Scriptures in favor of the true Deity of Christ, that I can hardly imagine how, upon the admission of the Divine authority of Scripture, and with regard to fair rules of interpretation, this doctrine can by any man be called in doubt. Especially the passage, John 1: 1-3, is so clear and so superior to all exception, that by no daring efforts of either commentators or critics can it be snatched out of the hands of the defenders of the truth”.
macgregorministries.org/jehovahs_witnesses/most_dangerous_book.html

apologeticsindex.org/j01.html

google.com/search?q=What+Scholars+think+New+World+Translation++Goodspeed&hl=en&lr=&safe=off&start=0&sa=N
 
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