Newman's Illative Sense

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Is this what makes us certain about various things and helps us know stuff via “reason alone”, that otherwise would be based on probabilities, according to Newman?

I guess I’m asking what he means by this.
 
Is this what makes us certain about various things and helps us know stuff via “reason alone”, that otherwise would be based on probabilities, according to Newman?

I guess I’m asking what he means by this.
Reason is based on something so called axiom which the latter is based on experience.
 
Is this what makes us certain about various things and helps us know stuff via “reason alone”, that otherwise would be based on probabilities, according to Newman?
Newman makes the case that there are different types of propositions, and each type has its own process that allows one to reach a conclusion and assent to the truth of its propositions. In mathematics, there are axioms which, when built up, create proofs of propositions. Through inference, in the sciences, we can come to certain conclusions about the truth of a proposition about nature. In our lives, however, we cannot whip out a book of mathematical axioms in order to answer the question “does God exist?”

Rather, we rely on a variety of (name removed by moderator)uts: experience, intellect, even God’s grace. By rationally combining these (name removed by moderator)uts, through our use of our illative sense, we are able to reach a conclusion that satisfies us and leads us to assent to a proposition.

This page provides a nice, succinct overview of what the ‘illative sense’ is…
 
The “illative sense” is a sort of holistic approach to God that transcends the purely rational approach. It is the approach that Pascal took when he said the “heart has reasons reason cannot know.”

Atheism rejects the illative approach and wants logical certainty bolstered by proof. This is never wholly adequate for the approach to God, and Maritain emphasized this when he said Christianity taught us that “love is more important than intelligence.”

This is why you will never find God just by reading Plato’s dialogues, but you will find Him by reading the Gospels, and especially by reading the Gospel of John. 👍
 
The “illative sense” is a sort of holistic approach to God that transcends the purely rational approach. It is the approach that Pascal took when he said the “heart has reasons reason cannot know.”
I’m not sure I would phrase it this way.

For Newman the Illative Sense is a purely rational approach: it is just not an approach based purely on formal logic. It is a form of implicit reasoning vs explicit reasoning (Oxford University Sermons =OUS], #13). He is nowhere near as romantic about it as Paschal; but it is a process that takes into account the whole man.

It’s much more akin to this. King Alonso, in The Tempest by Shakespeare, is agonizing over a difficult concrete decision. Several men are buzzing around him throwing out arguments that often conflict with him. Finally he blurts out, “You cram these words into mine ears against the stomach of my sense.” (act 2, sc. 1, lines 111-112) There were some men at Oxford in the nineteenth century who denied that one could both say that and be rational. Newman spent his life affirming that both can go together. He affirmed that one could hold salvific faith with the stomach of his sense knowing nothing of sophisticated logical argumentation, and that that would yet be a rational act.

Technically . . .

Newman attacked the liberals in the Oriel Common Room for their abuse of logic and reason in relation to faith in a three-fold way. (1) He observed that for accurate and correct reasoning one need not consciously employ logic. (2) He notes that the act of faith is not the only use of reason that may seem discursively inadequate. (3) Reasoning in everyday life largely concerns concrete matters and very often lacks the abstract concepts needed for formal logic. (OUS, 5:12; 11:24)

Newman asks: “How is an exercise of the mind [formal logic], which is for the most part occupied with notions, not things, competent to deal with things, except partially and indirectly.” (Grammar of Assent, 8,1,2)

He then goes on: “The conclusion in a real or concrete question is foreseen or predicted rather than actually attained; foreseen in the number and direction of accumulated premises, which all converge to it, and as a result of their combination, approach it more nearly than any assignable difference, yet do not touch it logically (though only not touching it,) on account of the nature of its subject matter, and the delicate and implicit character of at least part of the reasonings on which it depends. It is by the strength, variety, and multiplicity of premises, which are only probable, not by invincible syllogisms,–by objections overcome, by adverse theories neutralized, by difficulties gradually clearing up, by exceptions proving the rule, by unlooked-for correlations found with received truths, by suspense and delay in the process issuing in triumphant reactions,–by all these ways, and many others, it is that the practiced and experienced mind is able to make a sure divination that a conclusion is inevitable, or which his lines of reasoning do not actually put him in possession.” (Grammar of Assent, 8, 2, 3)
 
He then goes on: “The conclusion in a real or concrete question is foreseen or predicted rather than actually attained; foreseen in the number and direction of accumulated premises, which all converge to it, and as a result of their combination, approach it more nearly than any assignable difference, yet do not touch it logically (though only not touching it,) on account of the nature of its subject matter, and the delicate and implicit character of at least part of the reasonings on which it depends. It is by the strength, variety, and multiplicity of premises, which are only probable, not by invincible syllogisms,–by objections overcome, by adverse theories neutralized, by difficulties gradually clearing up, by exceptions proving the rule, by unlooked-for correlations found with received truths, by suspense and delay in the process issuing in triumphant reactions,–by all these ways, and many others, it is that the practiced and experienced mind is able to make a sure divination that a conclusion is inevitable, or which his lines of reasoning do not actually put him in possession.” (Grammar of Assent, 8, 2, 3)
I think this is not very far from Pascal’s way of looking at the convergence of faith and reason. Pascal was an interesting blend of rationalist and romantic. He certainly was not a romantic pure and simple. But his prose does soar, and when it really soars, it soars higher than Newman’s. 🤷

Pascal raised the bar for literary eloquence in his day, and because he was such a brilliant rationalist, his prose taken as a whole surpasses even that of Macaulay, who by comparison was sometimes dull if not downright silly.
 
I think this is not very far from Pascal’s way of looking at the convergence of faith and reason. Pascal was an interesting blend of rationalist and romantic. He certainly was not a romantic pure and simple. But his prose does soar, and when it really soars, it soars higher than Newman’s. 🤷

Pascal raised the bar for literary eloquence in his day, and because he was such a brilliant rationalist, his prose taken as a whole surpasses even that of Macaulay, who by comparison was sometimes dull if not downright silly.
That makes sense. But I think it is important to recognize that for Newman the Illative Sense occurs in other areas of life besides faith, and that it while it transcends formal logic it does not transcend reason. It is truly a rational act.

As far as prose goes Newman is a Victorian writer not a romantic. Not being fluent in French I cannot assess Pascal’s style in comparison to Newman’s. However Newman is considered a master stylist.

“John Henry Newman was the most highly gifted of the Victorians. He possessed both a subtle mind and a sensitive imagination. He was at once a thinker and an artist. He could use language to record the most inward ‘modes of being,’ whether his own or other men’s, and he could use it with a subtle rhetorical force to move and persuade. He was a great man and a great writer.” [Hazleton Spencer, Walter E. Houghton, Herbert Barrows, eds., *British Literature, 2nd ed., 2 vols. (Boston: D. C. Heath and Company, 1963), vol. 2, p. 489.]

A lot of it has to do with temperament. I felt immediately as keen a kinship with Newman and Chesterton as I did with Aquinas.
 
A lot of it has to do with temperament. I felt immediately as keen a kinship with Newman and Chesterton as I did with Aquinas.
No writer is perfect, so I’ve never felt an immediate kinship with anyone.

Writers grow on me, and a learn from them what I can, then move on.

The only writers I keep coming back to for great insights are Chesterton and Pascal.

More often Chesterton than Pascal. Largely because Chesterton wrote so much more and his best thoughts have been organized by anthologists in such volumes as The Quotable Chesterton and More Quotable Chesterton.

My favorite book by Chesterton is The Everlasting Man. The Man Who Was Thursday is a close second favorite.

The Quotable Newman is also a very good read for anyone who needs a short-cut to the best of Newman.
 
No writer is perfect, so I’ve never felt an immediate kinship with anyone.

Writers grow on me, and a learn from them what I can, then move on.

The only writers I keep coming back to for great insights are Chesterton and Pascal.

More often Chesterton than Pascal. Largely because Chesterton wrote so much more and his best thoughts have been organized by anthologists in such volumes as The Quotable Chesterton and More Quotable Chesterton.

My favorite book by Chesterton is The Everlasting Man. The Man Who Was Thursday is a close second favorite.

The Quotable Newman is also a very good read for anyone who needs a short-cut to the best of Newman.
Good conversation!

“No writer is perfect, so I’ve never felt an immediate kinship with anyone.” You forgot to add the smiley.
 
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