Non-christian religions: Satan's counterfeits or God's partial revelation to lead people from other cultures to the truth?

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Originally Posted by** Steven John **
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Throw into the mix the question “what is the definition of Non-Christian?” my understanding as one example is that Mormons consider themselves Christians but AOG sees them as a cult.
Bless you

Good question. I know some Protestants who view Catholics as non-Christians. As a non-Christian myself, of course that sounds absurd, but whatever.

Your friend
Sufjon
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I’ve run into that too. I just laugh at their ignorance of history.

Christ means *messiah *or anointed one of God, so I guess anyone who believes that of Jesus can, by the dictionary definition, be a “christian,” which would, ironically enough, include Muslims since they believe he was a great prophet, which could be another term for anointed!

I would argue that a true Christian is a Trinitarian Christian and one who accepts either the Nicene Creed or the Apostle’s Creed, or both. But I am bias…I am a Catholic, and was raised part of my life as a Lutheran.

-Chris
 
cmforte said:
I’ve run into that too. I just laugh at their ignorance of history.

But I am bias…I am a Catholic, and was raised part of my life as a Lutheran.

-Chris
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Hi Cmforte: I am a Hindu who spent 20 years as a Catholic, so the only Christian point of view I have first hand knowledge of would be that of a Catholic. All the while it was my understanding (and still is) that as a Catholic I was practicing Christianity. As you said, I think it’s a matter of having some knowledge of history.

Your friend
Sufjon
 
cmforte said:
I’ve run into that too. I just laugh at their ignorance of history.
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i often tell people the way they treat others reflects their god, or its the way the want you to treat them.

I just get saddened for your rudeness and true ignorance, this is a Non Catholic section of the forum, even people here from the catholic faith are at different places on their journey and are from all over the world.

It was a discussion so its good manners to ask some one what the mean when using a term ie the dictionary says
“1.One who professes belief in Jesus as Christ or follows the religion based on the life and teachings of Jesus.
2. One who lives according to the teachings of Jesus.”
Christ means *messiah *or anointed one of God, so I guess anyone who believes that of Jesus can, by the dictionary definition, be a “christian,” which would, ironically enough, include Muslims since they believe he was a great prophet, which could be another term for anointed!
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Consider a person may come from the dictionary and read or speak form the dictionary perspective then you would indeed be of the ignorant.
I would argue that a true Christian is a Trinitarian Christian and one who accepts either the Nicene Creed or the Apostle’s Creed, or both. But I am bias…I am a Catholic, and was raised part of my life as a Lutheran.
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Now best i know of Yahooshua (pbwh) would have done would me more like this last quote of just answering the question as you see it kindly and to be of helping and would not have stooped to calling people ignorant.
He would not have come of looking ignorant for knowledgeable he was of men, ignorant he was only of that G-d (Father) had not revealed to him.

Hope in this post you can find some blessing.

Pray well and stay well

“I will be who I will be,” you have free will so you choose who you see.
 
Steven_John said:
i often tell people the way they treat others reflects their god, or its the way the want you to treat them.

Then you should have been there to defend me when they attack me and my faith. I laugh because I know that discusing it with them is futile…they think I’m following the Antichrist and going to Hell unless I get “saved” and become a born-again christian (this is what they actually say), and nothing I say to them ever chages their mind. So all I can do is smile and walk away. Should I get violent instead?

I just get saddened for your rudeness and true ignorance, this is a Non Catholic section of the forum, even people here from the catholic faith are at different places on their journey and are from all over the world.

*I never specified CAF. I ran into it my in daily life. And how is that rude? It has been pointed out here many times that people who attack the RCC know little of its history. And besides that, I was informing the posters on how I react. I have the right to do so. When they say things as absurd like “Constantine was the first Pope,” or, “Simon Magus was really the first Pope and buried at The Vatican,” how do you expect me to react, but laugh? /*I]

It was a discussion so its good manners to ask some one what the mean when using a term ie the dictionary says
“1.One who professes belief in Jesus as Christ or follows the religion based on the life and teachings of Jesus.
2. One who lives according to the teachings of Jesus.”

Consider a person may come from the dictionary and read or speak form the dictionary perspective then you would indeed be of the ignorant.

*So a prophet is not chosen by God, then? That’s good. I’m thinking Muhammad here. And again, also look up the definition of the word *christ.**:*From

thefreedictionary.com/Christ* : Middle English Crist, from Old English Crst, from Latin Chrstus, from Greek Khrstos, from khrstos, anointed, verbal adj. of khrein, to anoint; see ghri- in Indo-European roots.]
n
  1. (Christian Religious Writings / Theology) Jesus of Nazareth (Jesus Christ), regarded by Christians as fulfilling Old Testament prophecies of the Messiah
  2. (Christian Religious Writings / Bible) the Messiah or ***anointed one of God ***as the subject of Old Testament prophecies
    And thefreedictionary.com/prophet: proph·et n.
  3. A person who speaks*** by divine inspiration ***or as the interpreter through whom the will of a god is expressed
Now best i know of Yahooshua (pbwh) would have done would me more like this last quote of just answering the question as you see it kindly and to be of helping and would not have stooped to calling people ignorant.

That isn’t His name.

*And It is my right to do so. What do you know of the history of the christian church in Rome? Or of the Early Church Fathers? . Have you investigated the archaeological and documentary evidence for it as I? (If so, good…however the anti-Catholics I’ve run into haven’t, they just take what ever their pastors or parents say as truth without question.) That is what I mean by ignorance of history. The word “ignorant” is not always a perjorative. *

He would not have come of looking ignorant for knowledgeable he was of men, ignorant he was only of that G-d (Father) had not revealed to him.

How does this pertain to our discussion?

Hope in this post you can find some blessing.

Pray well and stay well

“I will be who I will be,” you have free will so you choose who you see.

-Chris
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Will the real Christians please stand up?

Scripture: “The disciples were called Christians first at Antioch.” Jesus asked: “Why do you call me Lord and do not what I say?”

Scripture: Hebrews 11:24-27, “By faith Moses, when he was come to years, refused to be called he son of Pharaoh’s daughter; choosing rather to suffer affliction with the people of God, than to enjoy the pleasures of sin for a season; esteeming the reproach of Christ greater riches than the treasures in Egypt: for he had respect unto the recompence of the reward. By faith he forsook Egypt, not fearing the wrath of the king: for he endured, as seeing him who is invisible.”

Hebrews 11 would lead one to believe that there were OT Christians. Abel was a Christian: he offered innnocent blood for his sin–a type of Jesus, The Christ, who was to die on the tree at Calvary–the Just for the unjust. Cain was not a Christian–he tried to change the type of Christ to the fruits of his labor. This was unacceptable to God–still is. This made Cain so angry he killed his brother. The world is filled with the descendants of Cain. Seth, Abel’s replacement, has descendants too–they are probably not found in “Who is Who in Religion.” The Lord knows them that are His.

Then there are those in history who are called Christians; yet they appear to be killing other Christians??? What is that about???

Where are the real Christians? The pseudo-Christians seem to be making dense smoke screens.

The Lord knows them that are HIS.

Peace,

James Least
 
I have some thoughts from Blessed Pope John Paul II.

Pope John Paul II said in his encyclical “Redemptoris Missio”:

"…Peoples everywhere, open the doors to Christ! His Gospel in no way detracts from the human person’s freedom, from the respect that is owed to every culture and to whatever is good in each religion. By accepting Christ, you open yourselves to the definitive Word of God, to the One in whom God has made himself fully known and has shown us the path to himself…The Church opens the doors and becomes the house which all may enter, and in which all can feel at home, while keeping their own cultures and [religious] traditions, provided these are not contrary to the Gospel…Under the impulse of the Spirit, the Christian faith is decisively opened to the “nations”…

It is the Spirit who is the source of the drive to press on, not only geographically but also beyond the frontiers of race and religion, for a truly universal mission…The Spirit’s presence and activity affect not only the individuals but also society and history, peoples, cultures and religions. Indeed, the Spirit is at the origin of the noble ideals and undertakings which benefit humanity on its journey through history: “The Spirit of God with marvelous foresight directs the course of the ages and renews the face of the earth”. The risen Christ “is now at work in human hearts through the strength of his Spirit, not only instilling a desire for the world to come but also thereby animating, purifying and reinforcing the noble aspirations which drive the human family to make its life one that is more human and to direct the whole earth to this end.” Again, it is the Spirit who sows the “seeds of the Word” present in various customs and cultures, preparing them for full maturity in Christ.
  1. Thus the Spirit, who “blows where he wills” (cf. Jn 3:8), who “was already at work in the world before Christ was glorified,”[9] and who “has filled the world,…holds all things together [and] knows what is said” (Wis 1:7), leads us to broaden our vision in order to ponder his activity in every time and place.
I have repeatedly called this fact to mind, and it has guided me in my meetings with a wide variety of peoples. The Church’s relationship with other religions is dictated by a twofold respect: “Respect for man in his quest for answers to the deepest questions of his life, and respect for the action of the Spirit in man.” The interreligious meeting held in Assisi was meant to confirm my conviction that “every authentic prayer is prompted by the Holy Spirit, who is mysteriously present in every human heart.”…Every form of the Spirit’s presence is to be welcomed with respect and gratitude, but the discernment of this presence is the responsibility of the Church, to which Christ gave his Spirit in order to guide her into all the truth…"
 
John Woolman wrote…

"The end of words (even of Christ’s own directions in the days of His flesh) is to turn men to the holy life and power from whence the words came.

There is a principle which is pure, placed in the human mind, which in different places and ages hath had different names. It is, however, pure and proceeds from God. It is deep and inward, confined to no forms of religion nor excluded from any, where the heart stands in perfect sincerity. In whomsoever this takes root and grows, of what nation soever they become brethren in the best sense of the expression. "
 
Publisher said:
John Woolman wrote…

"The end of words (even of Christ’s own directions in the days of His flesh) is to turn men to the holy life and power from whence the words came.

There is a principle which is pure, placed in the human mind, which in different places and ages hath had different names. It is, however, pure and proceeds from God. It is deep and inward, confined to no forms of religion nor excluded from any, where the heart stands in perfect sincerity. In whomsoever this takes root and grows, of what nation soever they become brethren in the best sense of the expression. "
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That is beautiful Publisher, truly beautiful. Thank you for this brother! 👍
 
Bran_Stark said:
Yes. Definitely both.

God and the Devil play against each other with with human pawns, and each one tries to use the other fellow’s pieces for his own ends.
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This thought borders on Manichiesm where God and Satan are equal. The God of good and the God of Evil. Do you believe that you may want to reframe this…

We are pawns if we allow ourselves to be pawns. We have free will. God allows us to choose our will and when we do we subject ourselves to the will of Satan. We can choose to do God’s will. You may want to read Veritatis Splendor. It was written for all Christians.

vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/encyclicals/documents/hf_jp-ii_enc_06081993_veritatis-splendor_en.html
 
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