NRSV and psalm 22:16

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Joel_Tunnah

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The NRSV (“catholic edition”) renders psalm 22:16 as:

My hands and feet have shriveled;

The footnote says “Meaning of Heb uncertain.”

They also failed to note that the septuagint, DSS, and Vulgate all translate it as They pierced my hands and feet. I haven’t read through this translation, but it seems like it’s cut from the same cloth as the non-christian NJB.
 
Yeah, it’s no doubt meant to water down the Messianic interpretation found in better translations, such as the RSV:

[16] Yea, dogs are round about me;
a company of evildoers encircle me;
they have pierced my hands and feet –

Sad, isn’t it when translators take it into their hands to “revise” the Bible? 😦
 
Can we make a list of all the verses that have been translated differently, to frustrate Catholic or Christian theology?
Genesis 1:2 - “Spirit of God”
Psalm 22:16 - “Pierced my hands and feet”
Isaiah 7:14 - “Virgin”
Click to expand...
Luke 1:28 - “Full of grace”
John 3:16 - “May not perish”
Click to expand...
 
Here are those verses, and a few others, in the NRSV:

Genesis 1:2
the earth was a formless void and darkness covered the face of the deep, while a wind from God swept over the face of the waters.

Isaiah 7:14
Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign. Look, the young woman is with child and shall bear a son, and shall name him Immanuel.

Psalm 1:1
Happy are those
who do not follow the advice of the wicked,
or take the path that sinners tread,
or sit in the seat of scoffers;

Psalm 22:16
My hands and feet have shriveled;

Psalm 23:6
Surely goodness and mercy shall follow me
all the days of my life,
and I shall dwell in the house of the Lord
my whole life long.

Luke 1:28
And he came to her and said, ‘Greetings, favoured one! The Lord is with you.’

I’m sure there are more.
 
Your lists are the reason I don’t read the NRSV or others that use the loosest translation possible. They’ve done untold damage to the faith of millions, sad to say.
 
Joel_Tunnah said:
I haven’t read through this translation, but it seems like it’s cut from the same cloth as the non-christian NJB.
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When you say the non-Christian NJB, do you mean the New Jerusalem Bible that was edited by Henry Wansbrough, member of the Pontifical Biblical Commission, and given an imprimatur by + Cardinal George Hume? Just checking.
 
Joel_Tunnah said:
The NRSV (“catholic edition”) renders psalm 22:16 as:

My hands and feet have shriveled;

The footnote says “Meaning of Heb uncertain.”

They also failed to note that the septuagint, DSS, and Vulgate all translate it as They pierced my hands and feet. I haven’t read through this translation, but it seems like it’s cut from the same cloth as the non-christian NJB.
Click to expand...
Funny you should bring this up.

We had a class in the Psalms here at the novitiate. It was taught by one of the members of my order who works in Rome at the Biblical Institute. He knows Aramaic and Hebrew. The Hebrew for this is unknown. They do not know the meaning of the Hebrew used here so they go with what is closest and shriveled is it. He even showed us the Hebrew and stated that there is no corresponding use of this Hebrew word anywhere else.

So while the NRSV might be bad, this is not one of those cases.

Even the Jerome Biblical Commentary points out that the Hebrew is unclear and that the use of pierced is conjectured and not literal.
 
mccorm45 said:
When you say the non-Christian NJB, do you mean the New Jerusalem Bible that was edited by Henry Wansbrough, member of the Pontifical Biblical Commission, and given an imprimatur by + Cardinal George Hume?
Click to expand...
Yes.
 
ByzCath said:
The Hebrew for this is unknown.
Click to expand...
The Hebrew in verse 16 is nonsensical because the Masoretic Text is corrupt in that verse - even several rabbinic sources agree on that - either through transmission problems copying the Hebrew characters, or through deliberate obscuring of the messiah prophecies.

This site seems to cover the topic well, but please post if you have any issues with his presentation of the facts:

christian-thinktank.com/ps22cheat.html
 
So far out of reading 8 different Transaltions I would have to say I like the JB and NJB
 
Joel_Tunnah said:
The Hebrew in verse 16 is nonsensical because the Masoretic Text is corrupt in that verse - even several rabbinic sources agree on that - either through transmission problems copying the Hebrew characters, or through deliberate obscuring of the messiah prophecies.

This site seems to cover the topic well, but please post if you have any issues with his presentation of the facts:

christian-thinktank.com/ps22cheat.html
Click to expand...
This is a very good theory but I stand by the one that I was given as it make more logical sense to me. That is that this is a phrase/word in Hebrew that we no longer know the meaning of and so it is obscure to us. I do not buy into that this is a copying problem or a deliberate obscuring of the messianic prophecies because there are no other cases of this occurring. As the Psalms have been copied a lot you would think that this would happen in more than just one case. Also if it a deliberate obscuring of the messianic prophecies then you would think that they would have chosen to obscure some of the others too.

I will also admit that I buy into the argument a bit more because I got it right from the mouth of a biblical scholar from the Biblical Institute in Rome and it also helps his case that he is from my order and province.
 
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