nuns/family

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debraran

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Hi,
Having 2 daughters and 1 son, questions about being a priest/sister and looking for info online, etc. has been done on and off over the years. One thing I noticed in the formation of priests vs sisters, is even in the same order, nuns seem more restricted. They will say you get 1 week vacation to visit your family (maybe) but the priests seem to be able to travel and converse with family much more. Even in stricter orders where you receive a new name and learn to “die to yourself”, the men seem to have again, much more freedom in keeping connections with family. That seems to have been the case over the years but has gotten better lately because of the internet and wanting to reach out to more people. EWTN’s friars,for example, have strong connections with family and visit. The brothers/priests seem to travel more too, visiting Rome or other communites around the country
I guess our question is if both are active or comtemplative, why such a disparity and do sisters have an order that works with the poor for example, but you can also evangelize “on the road” too?
 
:rolleyes: I had a great aunt and a second cousin who were nuns.
I guess the business with sisters visiting family may have stemed in the past of the difficulty of travel and transporation,and the fact they are women.There may have been concerns about their safety traveling alone,while even though one is a priest,he is still a man and able to defend himself if he has too.

I have some old photos taken in Arkansas of my great aunt Sister Mary Generose,who was a School Sister of Notre Dame.
In a couple of the photos,it shows her and another sister of the community along with my great grandmother standing by a well,
and a couple of other places.My great aunt entered the motherhouse in Milwaukee,and she was stationed in that area.I guess the other sister acted as a traveling companion and went with Sister Generose for the visit.As far as I know,my great aunt just went there to visit,and was never stationed there by the order…The photos were taken in the twenties or early thirties, as my second cousin Alline is a little girl of maybe 9 or 10 in the photos.

Well,the Sisters of the Holy Family of California are catechists,and they often went around teaching the faith to migrant children and I’m sure spread the faith to anyone who asked about the Church. The Parish Visitors of Mary Immaculate
go door to door and visit families as do the Home Visitors of Mary.
Our Lady of Victory Missionary Sisters also act as catechists and spread the Word to others.
Any priest or nun has that oppurtunity to spread the Gospel
and the Catholic Faith by handing out pamphlets,etc.So yes, they can evangelize on the road.In fact i assume they have more of an obligation to do so than just us laymen and women.
 
debraran said:
but has gotten better lately.
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I don’t get this. Gotten better? Gotten better compaired to what? These are Orders. People, men or women CHOOSE to enter these things. Yes, it is a calling from God, or at least should be, but then this means God wants them to live this way.

Also, compairing women to men thing. They get this we should get it too. We are not the same. This should not have anything to do with anything.

Maybe I am taking this a bit ‘too personally’. I leave in February for my canidate year, then to Europe for the Seminary. It upsets my parents, it uspsets me. I won’t know when we will get to see each other again. It could be years. Plus my brothers and sisters (5 of us kids). This is a decision I have made with God, just as all others have made, both men and women. There is nothing getting better.
 
If you are honest about it, women usually are way more attached to their families than men are. Women often have very close relationships with their mothers and sisters; Women can spend hours on the phone every day talking to their mothers and sisters; you rarely ever see men do that. Most men, regardless of their job choices, subordinate their family (not wife & kids, I’m talking mother/father/siblings) second to their job.
My friend and I are in discernment and we both remarked that we thought it was kinda of unfair that priests don’t have to give up their families the way religious women do.
But then again, you see sooo many discussions on these boards about allowing priests to get married, etc. Well what about nuns? No one ever thinks about that. Yes, it is a giant sacrifice for a man to give up sex for the rest of his life but a woman is also sacrificing her deepest desire as well, motherhood.
 
I wish you well, I pray you have a holy, successful vocation. I believe though you will be able to communicate with your parents and siblings and later, be able to see them, depending where you are and what type of priest. Priests always seemed to have much more freedom, lots of trips, gifts, family stopping by the rectory or friary, nuns had visitors once a year behind a grail. They didn’t have much of a choice back then, many compromised and took the best of it. I’ve read many books by nuns, some still in communities, a few who left ater many years. The treatment some of them took by mean superiors I’m sure many men would never take or even think of doing. Men are different and they had different rules. I never understood why (and Mother Angelica talked of this too) some orders years ago (not all of course) had such cruel practices, making someone sit in an awkward pose for hours for walking the wrong way, eating dirt because they didn’t eat all their food…so many stories were so similar in certain orders and I just shook my head at the thought of a guy going through that. 'I don’t believe Jesus would like it done in his name either.I commend all sisters and think they are tougher in many ways than most women and men, I support certain orders as much as I can…I just think the unfairness in money, what they are given and respect at times, is not even.
 
turtle18 said:
If you are honest about it, women But then again, you see sooo many discussions on these boards about allowing priests to get married, etc. Well what about nuns? No one ever thinks about that. Yes, it is a giant sacrifice for a man to give up sex for the rest of his life but a woman is also sacrificing her deepest desire as well, motherhood.
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I agree with that …so many people act like giving up children and a family for a women isn’t a big deal or even sex, just for the men. So silly… that’s why a lot of priests married nuns when they left. I was surprised to find out a favorite priest of mine as a teen left 8years later to marry a nun and now they have as a fellow priest put it " a house full of altar boys" Sad in one way, nice in another since they both obviously weren’t in the right vocation.

I don’t think God ordains every order, some are very disfunctional and I think as Father Groeshel said in a recent talk, that’s why they end up failing and eventually not having many members. Being delibarately cruel,as some orders seemed to be at times, riding the line between obedience and nasitiness was just a human failing. But can you see Father Corapi staying in an order that made him eat dirt in front of his peers, berated him for burning toast? I don’t think so, men just wouldn’t do things like that. They use power differently. Luckily though, those orders are pretty much gone now.
 
I really admire you making enquiries to educate yourself on vocations in order to be informed and supportive of your children. My Mum was totally horrifed when I asked could I enter a convent - she was absolutely appalled.
At the moment in The Church parents and teenagers are a big focus for sure and as the source of future vocations.
With the various religious orders and the diocesan priesthoood, things can vary tremendously from one religious order to another and from one diocese to another. It can even be within the one religious order, that circumstances may vary in each actual foundation. Thus is it difficult to give a firm reply to your questions. I’d suggest you ring up your vocations director in your diocese and explain you are a mother and what your concerns are and ask her for her advice. If one of your children asks a question and you dont have the answer, you could always tell them this and that you will find out for them.
About the only other way I could think of, is to actually ring the religious order concerned …and put all your questions to them and as a mother of children asking questions.

God’s blessings on you and your family and with His Peace and Joy …Barb:)
 
I think you really need to distiguish carefully between types of orders. Contemplatives, whether men or women, do not usually travel much at all. Active orders may see more traveling and as the sister or brother/priest is out in the community working there is more of a chance to visit casually with family. Diocesean priest are completely different from any orders. They will have vacation time and the ability (and money) to travel more at will. So if you compare a diocesean priest to a contemplative nun you will find a bigger disperity.
That said, a vocation is not the same as a regular job. Those called to religious life need to realize that they are giving up everything for Christ. And that will include visits home for Thanksgiving. If your children find they cannot do that, then probably they are being called to a different vocation. One can still be a missionary, etc without being a religious sister or brother/priest.
 
The world in general was different ‘way back when’. Please don’t compare the ‘perks’ priests may currently enjoy with the life lead by a cloistered nun 100 years ago. Let your daughters see the beauty of a life devoted to Christ and don’t worry about past practices that are not happening today even in the most strict orders.
 
Thanks for the advice, but I’m not really worried about most of that today. Only one daughter has an interest and it would be in an order like Fr. Groechel’s in NYC that work with the poor and are pretty open about their schedule and what they do and don’t do. She loves the simplicity and giving of themselves. Contemplative orders are wonderful, but my daughters are somewhat claustophobic and I couldn’t picture that:D
I know you can’t compare from years ago to now, but some of these were 60’s to 70’s, and then they started to die away. There are a few more “secretive” ones, the Passionates I think that are more “old school” but if that is not your taste, you wont go there.
I also realize parish priests get more freedom but it seems so do friars and other priests in different orders. They talk about seeing countries in Europe, going to this holy site or that, I rarely hear about nuns having the money or time to go. You hear of priest retreats but not “nun retreats”. They need renewel too!😉
Whatever my daughters decide to do, I just hope they stay the nice, moral young ladies they are now…that today, is a feat in itself!
 
I have noticed this.

I think it really depends on what your vocation is. Men have contemplative communities that do not see their family much. Just a couple months or so ago there was a post on here from a dad whose son entered a Benedictine community. He was a little sad about not getting to see his son very often. Not many contemplative communities see their families often. It is just their vocation to be away from the world and wholly given over and attached to God. It reminds me of St. Teresa of Avila. While she was at the Incarnation she would receive lots of visitors. They would talk all of the time. She had all of this comfort. There was just so much going on it was a distraction from prayer and the penitential life she was being called to live as a Carmelite. When she founded St. Joseph’s they were not allowed visitors, or at least not allowed them often. They were truly able to live their calling out. The PCPA nuns have a cloistered vocation and thus their family visits are limited. The MFVA friars do not live a cloistered life and travel when it is necessary to serve the sisters, help ewtn with a particular show, and to visit their families. I wouldn’t think they see their families more then once or twice a year.

I am discerning the contemplative cloistered life. Although I love my family, Jesus calls us to not look behind us… to just follow Him. It seems cruel perhaps, but there is honestly no way to live that vocation when you are getting phone calls all of the time, family visits weekly or even monthly, and writing a bunch of letters. I love my family and leaving them will be the hardest thing I will ever have to do, but to be with God in that special way, to give my life over to him to suffer, pray, and love… family can be a distraction and even a stumbling block. That is the hard truth.

And I have noticed that even in some female active orders during the novitiate they cannot visit any family or even receive letters. And even later they are limited on visits. Perhaps, as someone said before, girls just are closer to their families. This can be a stumbling block. One is renouncing the world to go follow Christ but also wanting to turn around and “bury their father”. It just does not work. Their heart cannot be totally attached to Christ when it is totally attached to their family.

As someone else said: they wanted to go. I also wanted to add that all religious communities get retreats if not at least once or even twice a year. Usually long retreats too. They will have a priest come in and speak with them. I have read of retreats being given for Carmelite communities, the Norbertines, and in Mother Teresa’s letters she talks of retreats. And I have seen a number of active sisters being given the opprotunity to make pilgrimages. I know the Nashville Dominicans made a pilgrimage (they seem to travel a lot), the SMMEs, and even a couple Norbertines made a pilgrimage to Belguim when the Mother Superior went to an international meeting there. Often times though you will not find any cloistered nuns making pilgrimages or trips, especially those with a strict enclosure (Poor Clares, Carmelites, etc.) I would not think they would want too anyway. Carmelites of the 1990 Constitution never leave the enclosure. Those of the 1991 Constitution do once every three or five years for meetings. Personally, knowing this, I would rather join a Carmel following the 1990 Constitution. The nuns are not being deprived of some joy. It is something they wish. It is their vocation. Most might be miserable having to go on trips and things.

The Franciscan Sisters of the Renewal are a beautiful community. I’ll say a prayer for your daughter. 🙂
 
Sr_Sally said:
The world in general was different ‘way back when’. Please don’t compare the ‘perks’ priests may currently enjoy with the life lead by a cloistered nun 100 years ago. Let your daughters see the beauty of a life devoted to Christ and don’t worry about past practices that are not happening today even in the most strict orders.
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Also, religious make a vow of Poverty for one. The diocesan priesthood do not make an actual vow of Poverty which does give them more scope to “move around”. Most priests, well the ones I have known anyway, live in simplicity and a certain frugality and strive for a poverty that is spiritual: humility

Blesings Peace and Joy - Barb:)
 
This is an old post but relevant today. The truth is that things are different for women. I know i will be attacked for saying this but the rules that many orders put in place that restrict family contact are simply man made or woman made rules that have nothing to do with following Jesus and in fact are quite different how Jesus did things, Mary at foot of cross, born into family, went out to people, started ministry at 30 not 18. The rules are a reaction and about control and that is probably why 2/3 sisters eventually leave their order. Having said all that there are some women’s religious orders that are more pro family like Sisters of Apostles of the Interior Life where they say (are there other orders like this one?)

**The family we come from is very important to us. We are grateful to our parents for the gift of life and we honor and respect them, even if our vocation takes us away from a frequent interaction with them. We keep in touch with our parents and siblings and their families on a regular basis through phone calls, Skype, emails, and visits (also during the time of formation). We are attentive to the needs of each specific family and we discern with the superior how to make ourselves present to our family when special circumstances arise. Every year each of us AVI is granted a period of three weeks to spend with our family at home.
**
debraran said:
Hi,
Having 2 daughters and 1 son, questions about being a priest/sister and looking for info online, etc. has been done on and off over the years. One thing I noticed in the formation of priests vs sisters, is even in the same order, nuns seem more restricted. They will say you get 1 week vacation to visit your family (maybe) but the priests seem to be able to travel and converse with family much more. Even in stricter orders where you receive a new name and learn to “die to yourself”, the men seem to have again, much more freedom in keeping connections with family. That seems to have been the case over the years but has gotten better lately because of the internet and wanting to reach out to more people. EWTN’s friars,for example, have strong connections with family and visit. The brothers/priests seem to travel more too, visiting Rome or other communites around the country
I guess our question is if both are active or comtemplative, why such a disparity and do sisters have an order that works with the poor for example, but you can also evangelize “on the road” too?
Click to expand...
 
The point of religious life is to have undivided devotion to God and to live a life of extreme (heavenly) sanctity on earth. This is why religious give up having families- it the duty of married people to focus on their families. They can’t give God all of their attention, they need to take care of their families too. In the same way, religious need to have space from the families they were born into so that God can be their focus. Their apostolate is secondary to this.

The point of the priesthood is to sanctify the faithful. Thus priests need to spend time with people, providing them with the sacraments, preaching, etc. Their own personal time with the Lord comes secondary.

Thus, the amount of time spent with family is not a sexist manmade norm. It is a natural occurrence flowing from the definition of these vocations.
 
PHSshamrock said:
manmade norm. It is a natural occurrence flowing from the definition of these vocations.
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Yikes, that is exactly what the now deceased and disgraced leader of Legionaries of Christ,Fr Maciel said when asked about the restrictions on family visits for the LC and Regnum Christi.

Look, It is not intellectually honest (at least in the case of sisters/nuns and convents) to say it is not a man made norm.To pretend otherwise simply denies the facts. Jesus didn’t establish any convents (for that reason becoming a nun is not a sacrament) Nor did his immediate apostles, nor their successors, nor Mary, while there were women who dedicated themselves to Jesus they lived at home with families. There simply weren’t any convents for first 300 or so years of the church.

If it was a natural occurrence you wouldn’t need vows of obedience,protocol,rules, and physical restrictions that would make Scientology proud.

To say you need to so completely detach from the very families that gave you life by restricting visit to maybe one week a year and censoring mail is at the very best an efficient idea but not a pro family position. In the days before Vatican II many sisters orders wouldn’t have the compassion to visit for the funeral of your mother to console your family but you would send a Mass card. I believe many cloistered still don’t. So call it a good idea or bad but lets not be dishonest and pretend it is anything but man made.
 
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