Occasion of sin?

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thistle said:
NO. I was asking a question.

I’m saying its overacting saying I would rather die then commit a mortal sin and it would go against the teachings of Christ. As I said in an earlier post Christ did not tell his Apostles to go out to sinners and tell them to kill themselves. They are to repent and try not to sin again.
Everyone who uses the I would rather die than sin expression is still here and will commit mortal sins in future so we should act sensibly. Hate sin but if we sin go to Confession and stop all this threatening suicide nonsense.
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Just thought I’d note, the phrase “I’d rather die than commit a mortal sin” isn’t threatening suicide… its saying that they would refuse to commit a mortal sin even if it meant someone else killed them for it, its a profession that they are willing to be martyrs for Christ if need be. I’m not really sure why you would find that a problematic expression. Its certainly the expression of a very admirable attitude to have. And even if they do, in the future, fail, that doesn’t negate the goodness of their strong determination to avoid mortal sin that they have today.
 
I am new to this, but I would run away from sin. I would not put myself in a situation where I would be aroused by someone who is not my wife. I would also, pray and work on no longer desiring sin. those sins so many of us tend to hang on to because we are attached to them. I believe that is a requirement to receive a plenary indulgence, which is my understanding, is why so few people ever attain a plenary indulgence because it is so difficult.
That’s what is so great about becoming catholic. We have the sacraments that help us not sin. I am in RCIA and cannot participate fully yet, but just knowing that I will, has helped me immensely not sin. I have not sinned so little in my entire life, and I cannot even participate yet! That’s awesome! My goal is to become a saint and to fullfill God’s desires for my life. God has already worked so many miracles for me sense in RCIA, and I do not say that lightly.
 
thistle said:
NO. I was asking a question.

I’m saying its overacting saying I would rather die then commit a mortal sin and it would go against the teachings of Christ. As I said in an earlier post Christ did not tell his Apostles to go out to sinners and tell them to kill themselves. They are to repent and try not to sin again.
Everyone who uses the I would rather die than sin expression is still here and will commit mortal sins in future so we should act sensibly. Hate sin but if we sin go to Confession and stop all this threatening suicide nonsense.
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I get what you are saying but, who was “threatening suicide”? You equate saying “I would rather die than commit a Mortal sin” To threatening to commit suicide? If so, you are the one overreacting. There are people who chose death over sin in our Church history. They literally chose to die than sin. Just because someone might fail and sin, does not mean they don’t intend, to the best of their ability, to avoid mortal sin at all costs, even to the death. I get what you are saying, but I get what the OP is saying too. But your “I am assuming you never have sinned before, because you are alive” reasoning was really faulty.
 
thewanderer said:
No. Thats not whats being said in this thread. What people are saying is that if you are so strongly tempted to lust when in the proximity of people you are attracted to that you will probably give in and commit a mortal sin then you should try to avoid being near them. Not because being near someone you are attracted to is wrong, but because in your particular situation being near them is likely to end up with you committing a mortal sin. Does that make more sense?
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Yeah alot more,i was gonna say i gotta go back to the dumb class again
 
LaughingBoy1503 said:
I get what you are saying but, who was “threatening suicide”? You equate saying “I would rather die than commit a Mortal sin” To threatening to commit suicide? If so, you are the one overreacting. There are people who chose death over sin in our Church history. They literally chose to die than sin. Just because someone might fail and sin, does not mean they don’t intend, to the best of their ability, to avoid mortal sin at all costs, even to the death. I get what you are saying, but I get what the OP is saying too. But your “I am assuming you never have sinned before, because you are alive” reasoning was really faulty.
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You are right. I could have chosen my words more carefully but you know what I mean.
 
thistle said:
You are right. I could have chosen my words more carefully but you know what I mean.
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Well… I would like to clarify I think that I get why you think saying “I would rather die than sin” is overacting. I don’t get why you think it would be against Christ’s teachings to feel that way. Not trying to put you on the spot, just wanted to clarify what I think I understand.
 
Thanks for your responses. Indeed I am not seeking suicide but hating sin. I will continue to go to confession and pick up my cross when I fall but every time I make a firm purpose of amendment In confession I am resolutely detesting sin and preferring death to it. I still fall into venial sin but when I am fully conscious I try to avoid sin at all cost!
 
thistle said:
As he said he would rather die than commit a mortal sin but he’s still alive and admits he has committed mortal sins how about you? I assume you have never committed a mortal sin if you would rather die than do that??
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If the original poster has said that he has committed mortal sin in the past, then we can believe that he has fallen into mortal sin in the past. I assume that he is not committing mortal sin in the present, since he has a such a strong desire to die rather than commit mortal sin. God bless you.
 
Dear Thistle, when the saints say that they would rather die than commit mortal sin they are not saying that they would rather kill themselves than commit mortal sin, for their life is not theirs to take and their taking it would be a mortal sin. What they mean is that they would rather God take their life before they ever commit a mortal sin, or before they commit another mortal sin. This is what John of Woking meant by saying that he would rather die than commit mortal sin; there is no contradiction in what he says and with his being alive. Even if out of weakness he were to fall into another mortal sin that would not mean that he was not being sincere in saying he would rather die than commit mortal sin – it simply would mean that with original sin and his personal weaknesses he still falls short of his desires, and fails. God bless you.
 
John_of_Woking said:
Question: would if be permissible to take a lift home with a work colleague. There is** zero chance of sin** but the possibility of accidental groinal response. It would save me a lot of time and mean I can spend more time with my family.

Basically the question is are you allowed to do something where there is the possibility of sexual arousal? Never consent I add. I would rather die than sin. I find arousal is often the case with watching films aswell. I detest the arousal but don’t want to live in fear of erections.
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The conversation seems to have gotten a little off topic to me and I would like to go back to the original question (no offense to anyone).

The question is Occasion of sin? and then is followed by “zero chance of sin”. By very definition it cannot be an occasion of sin if there is no chance for sin. “Accidental groinal response” is an involuntary physical reaction that involves no consent of will. Arousal and attraction are in no way sinful.

If you knew this work colleague was going to sexually proposition you, or come onto you, or tempt you…and you thought it was likely you would not be able to resist the temptation…then it would be an occasion of sin.

But again if there is “zero chance of sin” it cannot be an occasion of sin.
 
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