Oh no! Not lay preaching once again!

[benedictgal]

Redemptionis Sacramentum makes an interesting point about seminarians:

[66.] The prohibition of the admission of laypersons to preach within the Mass applies also to seminarians, students of theological disciplines, and those who have assumed the function of those known as “pastoral assistants”; nor is there to be any exception for any other kind of layperson, or group, or community, or association.146

As for telling seminarians and transitional deacons apart, all you have to do is look at the vesture. If the “seminarian” is wearing a stole draped across his shoulder and/or a dalmatic, there is no mistaking the fact that he is an ordained deacon (irrespective of whether or not he is "transitional). If the man is merely wearing an alb, with no stole, then he is not to preach. The minister is supposed to be vested for the office he holds.

 

[EasterJoy]

As for telling seminarians and transitional deacons apart, all you have to do is look at the vesture. If the “seminarian” is wearing a stole draped across his shoulder and/or a dalmatic, there is no mistaking the fact that he is an ordained deacon (irrespective of whether or not he is "transitional). If the man is merely wearing an alb, with no stole, then he is not to preach. The minister is supposed to be vested for the office he holds.

Good point!

 

[benedictgal]

Good point!

Thanks. I should have said, draped diagonally from one shoulder. Either way, whoever is preaching should be vested for the office appropriate to the task, meaning a deacon should be wearing a stole (in the manner I described), at the very least, if not a dalmatic and a priest should be wearing his stole (if he is the concelebrant) and/or a chasuble, and the bishop, his chasuble, as well.

 

[NFrancis]

This has happened in my church once or twice. I was considering writing the Bishop but never did (I am only 18). The next Sunday he said that only the ordained can give a homily and the lay people can give a reflection. He also said a lot of people thanked him for allowing it. I really didn’t like it.

 

[Elizabeth502]

No, the priests are not of one mind on this.

I should have been more precise: the priests at this parish are of one mind; I know ahead of time that I will get nowhere approaching them. The pastor has to have approved it, as he was the one sitting in the sanctuary while this most recent lay preacher gave the complete homily.

There were also a couple of times in the past when a few people objected to something that was equally out of line, but no priest found any fault with the practice. It’s the mindset of this parish.

Sorry for the confusion.

 

[benedictgal]

I should have been more precise: the priests at this parish are of one mind; I know ahead of time that I will get nowhere approaching them. The pastor has to have approved it, as he was the one sitting in the sanctuary while this most recent lay preacher gave the complete homily.

There were also a couple of times in the past when a few people objected to something that was equally out of line, but no priest found any fault with the practice. It’s the mindset of this parish.

Sorry for the confusion.

Then, I am afraid that a letter to the bishop must be in order, then, because if all of the priests in the parish are a party to this, then, the bishop needs to know. What you are experiencing violates not only the GIRM, but, Redemptionis Sacramentum. Your bishop needs to be informed, in writing.

 

[EasterJoy]

This has happened in my church once or twice. I was considering writing the Bishop but never did (I am only 18). The next Sunday he said that only the ordained can give a homily and the lay people can give a reflection. He also said a lot of people thanked him for allowing it. I really didn’t like it.

There must still be a homily by the deacon or priest. Also, the layperson cannot give a reflection during the period of time reserved for the homily. The reflection cannot be something that would be mistaken for a homily. Otherwise, you’re serving up duck, calling it beef, and expecting people to buy the premise that because something isn’t exactly like chicken, it must not be poultry.

In other words, if you have the homilist giving his homily, and then later in the Mass a layperson gets up for two or three minutesand tells everyone about some urgent need in the mission field or for the maintence fund, or briefly tells about a retreat or an adult education class that is available, that is something different. Still, a quasi-homily may not be delivered by a layperson immediately after the real one. That isn’t kosher, and that should always be clear.

It is much preferable if such announcements can be made before, after, or totally outside Mass, but there are parishes where the target audience arrives late and leaves early. Still, the parish needs to guard from the appearance of lay homilists. There shouldn’t be a confusion about what is happening. The less that any necessary announcement or particularly worthwhile moment of reflection that requires the expertise of a layperson resembles a homily, the better.

You know, laypeople can preach all they like, just not during Mass. Are we so allergic to hearing meditations on the Gospel that we’ll only hear them at Mass? If there is not enough for lay preachers to do in the world, maybe it is the rest of the week that we need to try to change, not the Mass!

 

[Elizabeth502]

^ and just to be clear…

Neither of the recent situations I’ve reported (none really since last December even) could have been construed in the slightest as “reflections.” Not reflections. Substituted for the homily. Given at time of homily. Presiding priest sometimes introduced the speaker, but did not give anything himself approaching a homily.

Benedictgal, thanks for your response.

 

[peary]

I thought it was a fluke that during Advent, one of my two parishes I frequent had an absolutely abysmal lay preacher sans credentials and with zero direction or style to his “homily” (not a homily, but a name-dropping, spiritually vacant bragathon). Surprise! Yesterday it happened again, and my disappointment was magnified when the priest announced it joyfully as the “once-every-quarter event to look forward to.” Obviously, then lucky me missed the March lay “homily,” and I should stay away in September, because guaranteed there will be one then, too.

I wouldn’t mind if they were good homilies. They’re awful. Preaching is three things: an art, a skill, and a spiritual exercise, and neither general education nor theological education in themselves prepare one for preaching. Preaching is not a “talk,” nor is it a read “speech,” nor is it a paper delivered to an academic group. And even as talks or speeches or papers, the two homilies I’ve heard in the last 6 months have still been horrid even without the spiritual dimension. They were superficial; they lacked insight; and the delivery was appalling.

Gee, father, if you’re going to break the rules, train your lay preachers. Read the “homilies” first, then make these “preachers” rehearse them in front of you. If you’re not inspired, neither will the congregation be.

(No, these are not deacons or nuns – just regular lay people like you and me, but with pretensions and lack of awareness. Yes, a real treat “every quarter.”)

Lay people are NOT allowed to read the GOSPEL reading at Mass. They may read the psalms or epistles or verses from the Old testament scriptures, but they are not allowed to take the place of a priest. Lay people, as far as I know, are also not allowed to give the Homily. So, why is your parish doing what it is doing?