Original sin and all of creation

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roseproject

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Does original sin only affect us humans, or does it affect all of creation? If so, how is it affected?
Also, if this is the case, why would the sin of one species (man) affect the fate of other species (animals and other natural things)?

Lastly, what does “all of creation is waiting for redemption” mean?

Thanks in advance 🙂
 
I found some scripture passages on the topic…

"And to Adam he said, “Because you have listened to the voice of your wife and have eaten of the tree of which I commanded you, ‘You shall not eat of it,’ cursed is the ground because of you; in pain you shall eat of it all the days of your life; thorns and thistles it shall bring forth for you; and you shall eat the plants of the field. By the sweat of your face you shall eat bread, till you return to the ground, for out of it you were taken; for you are dust, and to dust you shall return.” ~Genesis 3:17

“For the creation waits with eager longing for the revealing of the sons of God. For the creation was subjected to futility, not willingly, but because of him who subjected it, in hope that the creation itself will be set free from its bondage to corruption and obtain the freedom of the glory of the children of God. For we know that the whole creation has been groaning together in the pains of childbirth until now.”~Romans 8:19-22

They talk not only about man being in a fallen state, but all of creation. Why is this?
 
Hi roseproject!

You bring up a topic that yields long, drawn-out discussions on the forum. The short answer:
  1. If you sense that God takes offense, and a debt is formed when man is disobedient, and that man’s condition is a punishment that ensued from such offense, then death is part of that punishment. The rest of creation was not in the “image of God” as is man, which was destined for immortality.
  2. If you sense that God does not take offense, then original sin can be described as the condition of genetic, psychological capacity for sinful behavior as well as alienation from our connection to God due to our enslavement (“bondage” in Romans) to our natural appetites (status, wealth, addiction, etc.) and our holding of grudges. In this view, God remains connected (in love) with us, but we are separated from our own love of God.
There are many other variations, but the main point of the doctrine of original sin is the human aspect, not the effect on the rest of creation.
 
OneSheep said:
Hi roseproject!

You bring up a topic that yields long, drawn-out discussions on the forum. The short answer:
  1. If you sense that God takes offense, and a debt is formed when man is disobedient, and that man’s condition is a punishment that ensued from such offense, then death is part of that punishment. The rest of creation was not in the “image of God” as is man, which was destined for immortality.
  2. If you sense that God does not take offense, then original sin can be described as the condition of genetic, psychological capacity for sinful behavior as well as alienation from our connection to God due to our enslavement (“bondage” in Romans) to our natural appetites (status, wealth, addiction, etc.) and our holding of grudges. In this view, God remains connected (in love) with us, but we are separated from our own love of God.
There are many other variations, but the main point of the doctrine of original sin is the human aspect, not the effect on the rest of creation.
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So, you’re saying that the fact that animals, plants, etc. are subject to death and decay has nothing to do with original sin? Was the rest of creation already subject to this before the fall?
 
I dont know about others, but personally Ive always wondered why Jesus dying on the cross was apparently ‘severe’ enough in terms of suffering for Jesus himself to literally die for ALL of our sins, even people who had not yet been born, but was not enough to take original sin away…???

I mean, what would Jesus have to have done to include original sin with all other sin?
 
roseproject said:
So, you’re saying that the fact that animals, plants, etc. are subject to death and decay has nothing to do with original sin? Was the rest of creation already subject to this before the fall?
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I think cfauster’s link in post 6 is a good answer.

Biologically speaking, species diversity is extremely important for survival. As conditions change, those that are not genetically adapted do not survive. If individuals of a species do not die, then they dominate the resources, and their offspring cannot survive. To ask “why death?” is to ask “why birth?”.

In order to build, something has to be destroyed, right?

I know, that is a rather mechanistic answer, but it is Creation, and God is within all of it.

God Bless your day, roseproject.🙂
 
roseproject said:
Does original sin only affect us humans, or does it affect all of creation? If so, how is it affected?
Also, if this is the case, why would the sin of one species (man) affect the fate of other species (animals and other natural things)?

Lastly, what does “all of creation is waiting for redemption” mean?

Thanks in advance 🙂
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The sin was commited by Adam and Eve so that sin affected them but not other humans or beings. God has created universe and world before Adam did that fault. So anyway God would exam humanbeing on the world but not in Heavens. That sin was a reason to do that. Nobody is sinful because of other’s sins. Many prophets were (indeed that man was crucified was not Jesus but someone was seen like Jesus) persecuted like Jesus but we cannot say that they were suffered for our sins. Human come to world as sinless and pure.
 
hasantas said:
Nobody is sinful because of other’s sins. Many prophets were (indeed that man was crucified was not Jesus but someone was seen like Jesus) persecuted like Jesus but we cannot say that they were suffered for our sins. Human come to world as sinless and pure.
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We were not “guilty” for the sin in the sense that you put. Mortal sin is not treated as a personal sin for the rest of humanity, but as something inherited from our first parents, kind of like a “spiritual deformity” of sorts.

As I understand it, since Adam and Eve were our first parents, whatever son or daughter they would beget would become affected by this sin since this new human being came from their bodies originally. You can’t pour clean water from a muddy bowl.

Also, this sin is different because Adam and Eve were not subject to ignorance like we are. They knew what they were doing (at least, for the most part). By making a turn away from God, they went against this human nature of their’s. They changed their nature from tending to the good, to tending to the evil and godless ways, because they turned from Him. This is how this sin is different.
 
roseproject said:
Lastly, what does “all of creation is waiting for redemption” mean?

Thanks in advance 🙂
Click to expand...
The motherland of all souls is the next world. All souls in worldly body is like to be in prison because of physical limitations. But in next world there is no physical limitation for bodies and souls.

The other interpretation maybe that all creation is waiting(need) for Mercy and Grace of God in the next world.
 
roseproject said:
We were not “guilty” for the sin in the sense that you put. Mortal sin is not treated as a personal sin for the rest of humanity, but as something inherited from our first parents, kind of like a “spiritual deformity” of sorts.

As I understand it, since Adam and Eve were our first parents, whatever son or daughter they would beget would become affected by this sin since this new human being came from their bodies originally. You can’t pour clean water from a muddy bowl.

Also, this sin is different because Adam and Eve were not subject to ignorance like we are. They knew what they were doing (at least, for the most part). By making a turn away from God, they went against this human nature of their’s. They changed their nature from tending to the good, to tending to the evil and godless ways, because they turned from Him. This is how this sin is different.
Click to expand...
I think Adam and Eve did not change their nature to commit sin but their nature were fond of sin. But it need for a reason to emerge and Satan was the reason. God know human is fond of sin and God want human to forswear. Adam did that and God forgave Adam.

Human did not get heritage sin of Adam but human got heritage disposition fond of and capacity of sin. Human may commit sin but right away human need to forswear and plead for mercy.
 
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