Origins of the Catholic Church

  • Thread starter Thread starter FuzzyBunny116
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
F

FuzzyBunny116

Guest
How exactly did the Church start? I understand Peter was the first Pope. What I want to know is how long did it take for the name Catholic Church to come around; when did people say that we’re “Catholic” as opposed to “Christian?” (That sounds so anti-catholic) I keep seeing from anti-catholic sources that it came about around the time of the Edict of Milan, but I remember seeing a quote from Ignatious saying something to the extent of “Wherever Christ is, there is the Catholic Church” around 110. Did they mean “catholic” or “Catholic?” I realize it was capitalized but perhaps translations could have done that somehow :x How did the Pope’s office actually come about? Was it whoever was the Bishop of Rome is automatically the head? Thanks.
 
Thank you for the link. But is there anything talking aboutt he evolution of the Bishop of Rome to Pope?
 
Thank you for the link. But is there anything talking aboutt he evolution of the Bishop of Rome to Pope?
Click to expand...
Actually, I think it was the other way around. Jesus made Peter the earthly head of His Church (i.e. the Pope, although the word didn’t come about for some time after that–it comes from the Greek Pappa) and then Peter ended up as the *episcopos *or overseer (i.e. Bishop) of the Church in Rome.

Correct me if I’m wrong, guys.

-ACEGC
 
40.png
FuzzyBunny116:
How exactly did the Church start? I understand Peter was the first Pope. What I want to know is how long did it take for the name Catholic Church to come around; .
Click to expand...
according to the Acts of the Apostles it was at Antioch that the label Catholic was first applied to the Church. The Church was started by Jesus Christ and anointed by the Holy Spirit at Pentecost. Peter was confirmed as the first head of the Church by Christ Himself, and is already taking that role at Pentecost. There is only one Church founded by Christ and the Catholic Church is it. All others are founded by men.
 
40.png
FuzzyBunny116:
Thank you for the link. But is there anything talking aboutt he evolution of the Bishop of Rome to Pope?
Click to expand...
Obviously, you’re familiar with the Primacy of Peter and the authority which God gave him (and the college of bishops), so I’m trying to figure out what you’re really asking…

If i’m not mistaken, at heart you’re asking “Why Rome?” The answer is because it shows forth the Glory of God! Rome was completely pagan and was the center of the civilized world, yet within a couple of centuries some lowly christians, meeting in caves, conquered the empire without bloodshed!

So, to answer this question (“Why Rome?”), I would answer simply that there was no better place to demonstrate the truly awe inspiring power of God. Knowing this, God eventually sent Peter to Rome, where Peter chose a successor, and it kinda’ stuck that the Bishop of Rome would be Pope. We could move the Pope to Detroit, but Rome is so full of christian heritage that it would make no sense. Make sense?

Did anyone then recognize Rome as the center of the Church? Here’s another link that may help:
catholic.com/thisrock/1993/9304frs.asp
Was Peter in Rome?
catholic.com/thisrock/1997/9701frs.asp

Any other questions, please ask!
May God guide you and bless you,
RyanL
 
I just checked your profile and saw that your 16th b-day is comming up this fall…it’s wonderful to see someone your age interested in the Faith! Keep it up!

RyanL
 
Thanks! But what the heck is your problem? Did you have to remind me that I’m getting ollddddd now? What I meant was, I see references often to Peter as the Bishop of Rome in the Bible, but never as the title “Pope”. I was asking, is it since Peter is the head of the Church, and the Bishop of Rome, were the the Bishops of Rome after him just automatically considered the Pope/head out of tradition, and sometime the name of “Pope” just came about?
 
As for the origins of the Papacy and the Bishopric of Rome, that’s more or less what it was–Peter was Bishop of Rome and the head of the Church, after he died, Linus became Bishop of Rome, then Cletus, then Clement, and so on (until the present successor Benedict XVI).

The title Pope comes from the Greek *pappa *or *pappas *(I’m not too sure…I think I’ve seen it both ways…) which means just what it sounds like–papa. It was an affectionate title that came about in the decades and centuries after Peter was declared by Christ to be the earthly head of the Church. That’s why it’s not mentioned Scripturally, as it didn’t come about for a good while afterward. One of the arguments (and a rather weak one, at that) against the Papacy and the Primacy of Peter is that since the word Pope is not applied to Peter in the Bible, Peter wasn’t the Pope. The thing is, the office existed for a while before the word came into common usage. When we say Peter was the Pope, we are applying a title to him that didn’t come about until some time after the office that he held was given the title.

If that doesn’t make sense, which it probably doesn’t, I’ll try to clarify it in a followup, or you can check out the section of www.catholic.com about the Papacy…there are several good articles there.

May the Holy Spirit guide and protect Mother Church and her leader, Benedict XVI, through all trials and attacks.

-ACEGC
 
I thought Clemet was next up after Peter? I always thought he was considered the second Pope…
 
40.png
FuzzyBunny116:
How exactly did the Church start? I understand Peter was the first Pope. What I want to know is how long did it take for the name Catholic Church to come around; when did people say that we’re “Catholic” as opposed to “Christian?” (That sounds so anti-catholic) I keep seeing from anti-catholic sources that it came about around the time of the Edict of Milan, but I remember seeing a quote from Ignatious saying something to the extent of “Wherever Christ is, there is the Catholic Church” around 110. Did they mean “catholic” or “Catholic?” I realize it was capitalized but perhaps translations could have done that somehow :x How did the Pope’s office actually come about? Was it whoever was the Bishop of Rome is automatically the head? Thanks.
Click to expand...
There is no way to know if St. Ignatius of Antioch was the first to term the word “Catholic,” but we do know from reading his letters that the **reason **why he used that word was to separate Christians who adhered to the teaching of the apostles, and their authorized successors, from those who called themselves Christian, but who were following the advice of heretics.

The office of the Pope could be said to have started this way…
  1. Therefore thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church. And I shall (future tense) give thee the keys of the kingdom of Heaven.
  2. Peter, does thou love me? …feed my lambs, feed my sheep, feed my lambs." (Thrice commissioned to be “Chief Shepard” of the flock.)
  3. All power in Heaven and earth is given to me. (Just before the Lord ascends into Heaven; at which time Peter is given the keys to become the vicar of Christ in the Lord’s physical absence.)
This is when the office could be said to have started. The words Pope, Vatican etc., will come later.

Thal59
 
40.png
puzzleannie:
according to the Acts of the Apostles it was at Antioch that the label Catholic was first applied to the Church.
Click to expand...
Could you give me the verse on this?
 
Ah well, guess I was wrong on the Clement thing. Also, when and who composed the Bible? And by who, I mean do we have any names? It seems like if we did, and could p(name removed by moderator)oint them to agreeing in Catholic beliefs (Real Presence, Marian beliefs, etc) with their letters, I’d be much easier to convince Protestants.
 
Ah many thanks. I’ll think about it. I was recently at a Catholic bookstore and searched for the like but I didn’t find anything.
 
Be careful, because there are some Protestant books out there that twist scholarship and history to support taking 7 books out of the bible. If you do get a book on this, please only get this one.

RyanL
 
The oldest surviving example of the Church being called Catholic is in one of the letters from the Bishop of Antioch, St Ignatius writes this on his way to being martyred in Rome.

He wrote a letter to the Smyrnaeans, here is the portion of the letter which says this. I believe it is classified as Chapter 8.

"You must all follow the lead of the bishop, as Jesus Christ followed that of the Father; follow the presbytery as you would the Apostles; reverence the deacons as you would God’s commandment. Let no one do
anything touching the Church, apart from the bishop. Let that celebration of the Eucharist be considered valid which is held under the bishop or anyone to whom he has committed it. Where the bishop appears, there let the people be, just as where Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church. "

I really recommend reading Early Christian writings, ECF’s, in their complete form and getting a nice balanced view. I frequently see out of context quotes and it is useful to look up the original writings and read them.

Scylla
 
40.png
FuzzyBunny116:
How exactly did the Church start? I understand Peter was the first Pope. What I want to know is how long did it take for the name Catholic Church to come around; when did people say that we’re “Catholic” as opposed to “Christian?” (That sounds so anti-catholic) I keep seeing from anti-catholic sources that it came about around the time of the Edict of Milan, but I remember seeing a quote from Ignatious saying something to the extent of “Wherever Christ is, there is the Catholic Church” around 110. Did they mean “catholic” or “Catholic?” I realize it was capitalized but perhaps translations could have done that somehow :x How did the Pope’s office actually come about? Was it whoever was the Bishop of Rome is automatically the head? Thanks.
Click to expand...
also st polycarp 155 ad. Prior to gregory the grt. all bishops were known as papa or pope
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top