Permanent Deacons and Traditional Catholicism

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18 000? That’s incredible. That’s more than some rural dioceses. How many weekend masses- even if it’s a dozen you would have such vast crowds. Your diocese must truly be blessed with vocations to the diaconate to have so many in your parish. As mentioned earlier, our archdiocese only “restored” the permanent diaconate within the last few years- our cathedral has 8-9 priests in residence at any given time but only one Deacon. The idea of multiple deacons per priest makes a lot of sense to me but I’ve never experienced it.
We have six weekend Masses, one of which is in Spanish. And the place is usually standing room only for about two or three of the Masses depending on the time of year. Our deacons help with liturgical planning, like processing weddings and funerals, as well as doing a good bit of the marriage prep. They also do sick visits (that don’t require anointing, of course) and catechesis, among many other things. We have a good corps of deacons in our parish and in our Diocese, and they do good work. It really helps us out. So traditionalist or not, good resources are good resources.

-Fr ACEGC
 
Most traditionalist Catholics take into account the current pastoral realities and needs. They don’t live in the past. For instance, where I live, the people who go to the EF Mass talk, and are far more active in, prolife, than Catholics who were going the TLF in the 1950s. The permanent diaconate is a help that was not available in the 1950s. It is available, and obviously much needed, now.
 
I’ve never been fond of the permanent diaconate, even before I became a traditionalist. It seems many traditional Catholics don’t like them because they aren’t celibate.
Isn’t it an oxymoron to become a traditionalist
 
Most traditionalist Catholics take into account the current pastoral realities and needs. They don’t live in the past. For instance, where I live, the people who go to the EF Mass talk, and are far more active in, prolife, than Catholics who were going the TLF in the 1950s. The permanent diaconate is a help that was not available in the 1950s. It is available, and obviously much needed, now.
Abortion wasn’t a hot political issue in the 1950’s, not many were involved as abortion was generally outlawed, especially elective abortions.
 
Seriously, if people have a problem with permanent deacons, then they have problems with St. Stephen, St. Phillip the Deacon, St. Lawrence, and… St. Francis (and St. Francis was a permanent deacon at a time when the permanent diaconate had pretty much disappeared)!
And St. Patrick, he was the son of a Deacon.
I, Patrick, a sinner, a most simple countryman, the least of all the faithful and most contemptible to many, had as my father, the deacon Calpurnius
Confessions - St. Patrick
 
And St. Patrick, he was the son of a Deacon.
Actually he was the father of 2 saints; St Patrick and his sister St Darerca. Through St Darerca, he had 3 grandsons that were also saints and deacons. I beleive she also had several sons that became sainted bishops and also a few daughters that were also saints. I don’t remember off the top of my head, but that humble deacon was the progenitor of something like 14 or 16 saints.
 
I’m still not following. How come someone cannot become a traditionalist?
I said isn’t it an oxymoron! That’s all. Simply that no comment on your choice of religious practice just a comment on English language
 
I said isn’t it an oxymoron! That’s all. Simply that no comment on your choice of religious practice just a comment on English language
Oh no, I’m not mad or anything. I’m just trying to understand how it’s an oxymoron. 😃 Sorry if it’s obvious, it was a busy day today so I might be a bit slow.
 
Someone once opined that the death knell of a church was. " we have always done it this way"

In my childhood etc we never thought re celibacy etc; sexuality etc was never part of the conversation. How things have changed. We were far more innocent than now.
 
I would like to add one bit to the conversation.

I was recently speaking to a few members of a religious order in my Diocese that exclusively use the Extraordinary Form, as well as their chaplain. I didn’t know what to expect when the subject came up, so I was surprised to hear that one of the sister’s father was a permanent deacon.

In this conversation, it became apparent that few members had any issue with permanent deacons per se, but that the greater issue was with how permanent deacons were formed, or how they ministered.

In the Extraordinary Form, the role of the deacon is similar to that of a deacon in the Byzantine tradition—the deacons role is in assisting the priest. In this way, the deacon would not minister liturgically as an individual, but always do so in the presence of a priest while acting as his assistant. This is especially prevalent in the Byzantine tradition, in which a deacon is not even suppose to vest without a priest’s blessing.

In this way, my interlocutors were very fond of the idea of a permanent deacon—Fr. Chaplain even opined how wonderful it would be if they had one there, that way he could offer Missæ Solemnes more often.

A shift occurred when the office of deacon was brought into the Ordinary Form. Whereas previously it appears that the deacon was an assistant, in the rituals related to the Ordinary Form a deacon can assume a presidential role (presiding at Baptisms, Vespers, Marriages, et c).
I’m unsure of how this principle relates to the Extraordinary Form of the Roman Rite—Although it seems that a deacon certainly could Baptize and witness Marriages, I’m not sure if a deacon ever would before the 1970’s. Additionally, a cursory glance at a few rubrical texts don’t mention any possibility of a deacon presiding at the Liturgy of the Hours.
The idea of a deacon presiding at anything is very much foreign to Byzantine liturgical thought, and I’ve needed to explain this to several curious Orthodox priest-friends. From my understanding, some Churches have allowed deacons to preside at the Liturgy of the Presanctified, but this is hotly debated.

Finally, to interject my own opinion on the matter: I very much like the idea of a deacon assisting the priest in Sacramental situations—I think it better manifests the hierarchical nature of Christ’s Church. Better yet, let another deacon, or a subdeacon, also assist to show forth a Trinitarian symbolism. That having been said, I also quite like the idea of a deacon being able to assume a presidential role at something like Vespers. It allows for a community to pray liturgically when a priest is not available.
 
There were married deacons in New Testament times. Oh and there were even female deacons during early years of the Church. Shock horror. I believe the Pope will be looking into this soon.
 
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