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Methodology
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In some of the Quotes that I received two of them say that the Popes received their power from the Ceasers. Would you please dispense your thoughts on this to me?
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Tom
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My thoughts are more questions than comments. Since these are not official Catholic Church documents, but the common opinion of individuals, why exactly would they need to be rebuked? The author of the first article, was once a Catholic Priest who was eventually “ suspended from his priestly functions” by the Archbishop of Paris. The article was not written as a history paper. What was the context they were written? Actually “superior papal authority" is derived directly from Scripture, and is part of the Tradition of the Catholic Church.In some of the Quotes that I received two of them say that the Popes received their power from the Ceasers. Would you please dispense your thoughts on this to me?
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Church_Militant
Guest
Odd…not one single Catholic reference to this supposedly historic document? Google search.
The other one is only referenced from SDA sites which I know for a fact are not good at historical accuracy, refusing to even admit that the “Donation of Constantine” is in fact a well known historical forgery. Yet they persist in using it to try to bash the Catholic Church.
These two documents you have excerpted appear to have no more substance than any other of their errant offerings.
The authors appear to have been Catholic but the texts…if one can locate them whcih I see no likelihood are neither dogmatic nor doctrinal.
In perusing the worthless SDA site of Michael Scheifler’s Bible Light Homepage I have found that he’ll post alleged scans of these documents in Latin or other languages and then offer his own translation out of all context. The local phone book is more accurate…
Your profile says “Protestant”. Are you perhaps SDA?
Pax Domini sit semper vobiscum,
The other one is only referenced from SDA sites which I know for a fact are not good at historical accuracy, refusing to even admit that the “Donation of Constantine” is in fact a well known historical forgery. Yet they persist in using it to try to bash the Catholic Church.
These two documents you have excerpted appear to have no more substance than any other of their errant offerings.
The authors appear to have been Catholic but the texts…if one can locate them whcih I see no likelihood are neither dogmatic nor doctrinal.
In perusing the worthless SDA site of Michael Scheifler’s Bible Light Homepage I have found that he’ll post alleged scans of these documents in Latin or other languages and then offer his own translation out of all context. The local phone book is more accurate…
Your profile says “Protestant”. Are you perhaps SDA?
Pax Domini sit semper vobiscum,
T
Todd_Easton
Guest
The primacy of the Church of Rome and of its bishop, the pope, was acknowleged and practiced long before Emperor Constantine issued the Edict of Milan and ended the persucution of Christians in A.D. 313:
Visitors from Rome were among the first to hear the gospel proclaimed by the Apostles, Acts 2:10.
St. Paul, in his Letter to the Romans, acknowledges that the Roman Christian’s “faith is proclaimed in all the world,” and he hopes to visit them that his faith might be encouraged by theirs, as well as theirs by his, Romans 1:8, 12.
St. Ignatius of Antioch, in his Letter to the Church of Rome, written about A.D. 110, acknowledges that the Church of Rome, to whom the Apostles “Peter and Paul” had issued commandments, “hold the presidency of love.” (chap. 1, 4)
St. Irenaeus of Lyon, in his work Against Heresies, written about A.D. 189, acknowldeges that “all Church must agree, that is, all the faithful in the whole world,” with the Church of Rome because of its “superior origin,” being “founded and organized … by the two most glorious Apostles, Peter and Paul.” (book 3, chap. 3)
Pope St. Victor, about A.D. 190, acting very pope-like, unilaterally excommunicated, or was prepared to unilaterally excommunicate, all the Churches of Asia Minor over the issue of when the date of Easter should be celebrated, the so-called Quartodeciman controversy. And, he only withdrew his excommunication, or threat of excommunication, because of various pleas for tolerance that he subsequently received. (St. Polycrates of Ephesus, Letter to Victor of Rome; Eusebius, Church History, book 5, chap. 24)
The heretic Tertullian, in his treatise On Mosesty, written about A.D. 220, sarcastically refers to the bishop of Rome, perhaps Pope St. Victor, as “the bishop of bishops,” for acting very pope-like and unilaterally decreeing that repentant Christian adulterers and fornicators could be received back into the Church, by reason that his Church was “akin to Peter” and therefore he succeeded to the power to bind and loosen granted by Christ to Peter in Matthew 16:18. (chap. 1, 21)
Visitors from Rome were among the first to hear the gospel proclaimed by the Apostles, Acts 2:10.
St. Paul, in his Letter to the Romans, acknowledges that the Roman Christian’s “faith is proclaimed in all the world,” and he hopes to visit them that his faith might be encouraged by theirs, as well as theirs by his, Romans 1:8, 12.
St. Ignatius of Antioch, in his Letter to the Church of Rome, written about A.D. 110, acknowledges that the Church of Rome, to whom the Apostles “Peter and Paul” had issued commandments, “hold
St. Irenaeus of Lyon, in his work Against Heresies, written about A.D. 189, acknowldeges that “all Church must agree, that is, all the faithful in the whole world,” with the Church of Rome because of its “superior origin,” being “founded and organized … by the two most glorious Apostles, Peter and Paul.” (book 3, chap. 3)
Pope St. Victor, about A.D. 190, acting very pope-like, unilaterally excommunicated, or was prepared to unilaterally excommunicate, all the Churches of Asia Minor over the issue of when the date of Easter should be celebrated, the so-called Quartodeciman controversy. And, he only withdrew his excommunication, or threat of excommunication, because of various pleas for tolerance that he subsequently received. (St. Polycrates of Ephesus, Letter to Victor of Rome; Eusebius, Church History, book 5, chap. 24)
The heretic Tertullian, in his treatise On Mosesty, written about A.D. 220, sarcastically refers to the bishop of Rome, perhaps Pope St. Victor, as “the bishop of bishops,” for acting very pope-like and unilaterally decreeing that repentant Christian adulterers and fornicators could be received back into the Church, by reason that his Church was “akin to Peter” and therefore he succeeded to the power to bind and loosen granted by Christ to Peter in Matthew 16:18. (chap. 1, 21)
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Todd_Easton
Guest
I just wanted to add St. Cyprian’s contributions to this topic. Writing about A.D. 252, in his treatise *On the Unity of the Catholic Church, first edition, *he says that there “is one Church and one chair,” “the chair of Peter,” which is the divinely appointed "source and intrinsic reason for … [Church] unity, what he calls “the unity of Peter.” He says that Christians must hold fast to this unity, and he insinuates that to desert the chair of Peter is to place oneself outside the Church of Christ. Elsewhere, Cyprian indicates that the bishop of Rome occupies this one chair of Peter and he describes the Church of Rome as “the principal Church, … among whom it is not possible for perfidy * to have entrance.” (Letter to Cornelius of Rome, A.D. 252)The primacy of the Church of Rome and of its bishop, the pope, was acknowleged and practiced long before Emperor Constantine issued the Edict of Milan and ended the persucution of Christians in A.D. 313:
Constantine ended the persecution of Christians, legalized the Catholic Church, assisted in the building of Churches, and granted privileges to Catholic clergy, etc., and a later emperor (Theodosius I) would establish the Catholic religion as the state religion, but the primacy of the Church of Rome and of its bishop, was established long before Constantine came along.*
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Victorious
Guest
Sounds like a busload of bushwa to me.In some of the Quotes that I received two of them say that the Popes received their power from the Ceasers. Would you please dispense your thoughts on this to me?
Would you mind providing links?
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