Problem with intercessory prayer

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Filius_Prodigus

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I understand that God wants us to pray for others.

This is my problem:

I pray (among other people) for my brothers who are away from the Faith. I am sure the Trinity and Our Lady will bring them over. Now I’m thinking, “If weren’t doing this, would God let them perish?” Doesn’t God love them unconditionally enough to not let them perish were I not here to pray for them? So God does not do everything his love for them would oblige him to do, unless there is someone else praying for them? Wouldn’t that by itself be unholy?

:confused:
 
I think it has to do with free will. God might not keep offering graces to those who refuse them. Out of deference to those of us who beg for him to extend those graces for conversion, he may listen, as we are required to help him in this process.

We must in part or whole, earn our crown. Intercessory prayer is just one of the ways we do that.
 
I think it has to do with free will. God might not keep offering graces to those who refuse them. Out of deference to those of us who beg for him to extend those graces for conversion, he may listen, as we are required to help him in this process.

We must in part or whole, earn our crown. Intercessory prayer is just one of the ways we do that.
I tend to think that praying helps to open the hearts of people, and keep open our hearts, to grace.

God has generously bestowed upon us the privilege of sharing in His glory (in bold).

He will always listen but won’t always answer how we expect. Prayers through the humblest of means, ensures all prayers are heard.
 
I tend to think that praying helps to open the hearts of people, and keep open our hearts, to grace.

God has generously bestowed upon us the privilege of sharing in His glory (in bold).

He will always listen but won’t always answer how we expect. Prayers through the humblest of means, ensures all prayers are heard.
So, Friardchips (please don’t think I’m fighting you --I may sound like an atheist trying to rebut, but I have a big inner atheist as I was one for 25 years --so I am grateful if you will bear with me on this), the point is this:

If I don’t pray for my two brothers who are away from the faith, God will not call them, or not call them so hard, if I do not pray for them?

This question really bothers me, as it implies God withholds his goodness unless there is someone to pray for us/them.
 
So, Friardchips (please don’t think I’m fighting you --I may sound like an atheist trying to rebut, but I have a big inner atheist as I was one for 25 years --so I am grateful if you will bear with me on this), the point is this:

If I don’t pray for my two brothers who are away from the faith, God will not call them, or not call them so hard, if I do not pray for them?

This question really bothers me, as it implies God withholds his goodness unless there is someone to pray for us/them.
No. God calls all to repentance. But, he will not make anyone believe in him–each of us must make that decision for himself. Praying for them helps–I pray for people who don’t believe or who have fallen away from the faith whom I don’t even know because God loves them and wants me to share in his love for them.

We aid one another with our prayers and no prayers ever go to waste. If your brothers, heaven forbid, decide they don’t want God and end up in hell, your prayers will help others who opened their hearts and minds to repentance. But, pray on in hope, for God is wanting to restore your brothers to the faith–more than you want it for them.

Trust in God’s mercy. He has his own good time for placing them in the kind of circumstances that will help them open their hearts. Be a good example to them, love them, continue to pray, and leave the rest to God’s infinite mercy.
 
People have free will to accept or reject God will not take that away.
But we still must pray and put our hope in God who can do the impossible.

My God, I believe in Thee, I adore Thee, I hope in Thee and I love Thee. I ask pardon for all those who do not believe in Thee, do not adore Thee, do not hope in Thee and do not love Thee.

Most Holy Trinity, Father, Son, and Holy Ghost, I adore You profoundly, and I offer You the Most Precious Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Jesus Christ, present in the tabernacles of the world, in reparation for the outrages, sacrileges and indifferences by which He, Himself is offended. And I draw upon the infinite merits of the Most Sacred Heart of Jesus and of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, that You might convert poor sinners.

The Angels two prayers who met the children of Fatima - he repeated each pray 3 times - I think (these are my own thoughts ) he said it 3 times because he was praying to the Holy Trinity
 
So, Friardchips (please don’t think I’m fighting you --I may sound like an atheist trying to rebut, but I have a big inner atheist as I was one for 25 years --so I am grateful if you will bear with me on this), the point is this:

If I don’t pray for my two brothers who are away from the faith, God will not call them, or not call them so hard, if I do not pray for them?

This question really bothers me, as it implies God withholds his goodness unless there is someone to pray for us/them.
Grace from Heaven to earth flows like a channel. Yes, grace is from God, but it flows through the intercessory hierarchy (degrees of humility). So we have Jesus at the Father’s right hand, as Mediator, we have the Holy Spirit as Advocate and Our Lady, His Mystical Spouse, through whom graces flow, and then we have the Saints in Heaven, Angels, and we have the Church on earth. All graces flow through the Church though seemingly grace comes direct from God; but in fact, since the fall of humankind, it has been this way. So that all people co-operate in the sharing work of the Redeemer. But all graces flow through and beyond the visible confines of the Church. This was the case even before the visible Church came into being. This might take more explanation to understand, and more examples, but this is the case, nevertheless. In terms of intercession on earth, before Jesus’ time, we had the prophets. Yet all, every single being who ever existed, that is saved, belongs to the Church, and has received intercession on their behalf.

With this explanation, you can see how each one of us is not only doing a nice extra something for someone, when we pray for them, but actually carrying out a duty, a work; in this case, I think prayer is known to be a ‘work of mercy’. This is a duty, as a Catholic. The biggest part, in fact, other than living the sacramental life.

As another poster said, God calls all of humanity. He calls humanity through every good means available in Creation. Even in suffering, humankind can cry out, and receive the grace of conversion. But even if someone has received an on-the-spot conversion, in the manner of St. Francis or St. Augustine, this conversion has still been instituted via grace, through the power of Intercession. This is the most perfect way as created by the Father when He pre-empted the Fall of Humankind with His Saving Plan.

God always invites. It is humanity that turns away. The grace is there, but we cannot always open our hearts to it. So, with the power invested in each Baptised Catholic, one is to pray for others.
 
Ah, I see.
So, God does not withhold help to people if others don’t pray for them. He just prefers we do it if he knows (beforehand, even) that we are available to pray for them, like me in relation to my two brothers, right?
 
Ah, I see.
So, God does not withhold help to people if others don’t pray for them. He just prefers we do it if he knows (beforehand, even) that we are available to pray for them, like me in relation to my two brothers, right?
🙂 I don’t know how to answer this in succinct enough terms…

God knows everything before it has happened.

He created the world and gave us freewill.

The grace is there, but He requires of us, to participate in saving others. We become His ‘channels of grace’.

The Church - in Heaven and on earth - is His intercessory means. This is His family through which His grace flows.

This is why Jesus said: “Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them, in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit.”

Grace, through the power of the Church, goes forth to all peoples of all nations.

God Wills all people to Himself. We have a duty to put His graces into effect.

God’s Church is Universal, in time and dimensions; therefore, God’s grace is always flowing from her, like water from a spring in constant flow.
 
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