Problem with something taught in my RCIA Class

[DaMaMaXiMuS]

Hello,

About 2 months ago the RCIA teachers began to teach about the 10 Commandments. I was surprised to see that the list of 10 Commandments they distributed was not what was written in the Bible, and to which I’m used to.

Basically, the list excluded the 2nd Commandment, Exodus 20 verses:

4Thou shalt not make to thyself a graven thing, nor the likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or in the earth beneath, nor of those things that are in the waters under the earth.
5Thou shalt not adore them, nor serve them: I am the Lord thy God, mighty, jealous, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children, unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me:

The list of commandments had been pushed up one, so for example, Thou shat take the name of the Lord in vain, was now the 2nd commandment, Remember the Sabbath day, was now the 3rd commandment, etc.

Then the last commandment, 17Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour’s house; neither shalt thou desire his wife, nor his servant, nor his handmaid, nor his ox, nor his ***, nor any thing that is his.

Was broken up into the 9th and 10th commandments. “Thou shalt not covent thy neighbors house” was the 9th Commandment and “Thou shalt not covet thy neighbors wife” was the 10th.

I asked the teachers about this at the end of Class and told me that the paper they handed out was the one they use in the childrens Catechism class. And that they leave out the 2nd commandment because its easier for the children, that way they won’t get confused, until they were a little older and able to understand better. I asked if they meant confused with statues of the Saints? They said yes.

I thought about it, and said to myself alright maybe that’s a good reason. But this past week in class we all received a catholic pamplet that was filled with common catholic prayers. It also had the 10 commandments, but again, it was according to the way I described above. And I know this pamplet was not only geared to children, it was geared towards everyone. And now I really don’t see how it’s right to censor the full 10 commandments from children.

So what gives here? I mean to ask my priest about this. In my opinion this would be giving ammunition to anti-catholics or worse cause someone coming back to the church to stumble.

Is something wrong going on here?

thanks,

Nelson

 

[SMHW]

This way of numbering the commandments has been practiced by Catholics for MANY years.

If you were to separate out all the different commands listed in Exodus (or in Deuteronomy which also lists commandments) there would actually be more than ten. The numbering scheme that has us come up with ten is a bit arbitrary.

In the Catholic way of doing things, what you think of as the second commandment is considered to be incorporated as part of the first .

You might also want to check out the following:

catholic.com/thisrock/2004/0403fea3.asp

 

[Aaron_I]

Protestant Second Commandment

Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them.

Well, that’s too bad for sculptors, as they are clearly sinning. All joking aside, the biggest use of this by Protestants is to attack the Eucharist. Studying the Church Fathers; however, tells us that the Eucharist was a well-established practice by no later than 110 AD.

I believe that Radzinger recently (don’t know whether before/after being pope) wrote on symbols and the fact that they stem NECESSARILY from a belief in the INCARNATE God.

 

[Ferdinand_Mary]

The True Ten Commandments

 

[jaz1976]

I think the important thing to understand here is that once again we have an example of the protestant revolutionists changing traditions that they had no business changing (see also the canon of the Old Testament). Although the Catholic Church does not dogmatically define the exact ordering of the Commandments, we go by how Augustine ordered them (the Decalouge) according to Deuteronomy. This has been the tradition of the Church for over a millenia until some decided that they wanted to expound upon the “graven image” thing to bash Catholics.

What I think is truely sad is that your RCIA teacher, who is supposed to be a trained catechist, gave you such a weak answer to your question. In the future, I hope you get the answers that you seek in a more timely manner.

May God be with you on your journey home and know that you are in the right place (CA Forums) to learn about your faith from knowledgeable people, many of whom have been right where you are know.

 

[Melissa]

I agree–the biggest problem is that the RCIA teacher wasn’t giving a correct answer. The correct answer is that the second commandment was not omitted (assuming that you did indeed have on the list “Thou shalt not take the Name of the Lord thy God in vain”).

The first commandment “I am the Lord thy God, thou shalt not have strange gods before me” has a lot of commentary that was particularly relevant at the time it was given. That’s what all the ‘no graven image’ stuff is about–commentating on exactly what was forbidden by the ‘no other gods’ limit.

Now, one reason that I like the Catholic numbering is the beautiful symmetry that you can find:

1. thou shalt not kill → 8) thou shalt not bear false witness (or kill someone’s reputation)
2. thou shalt not commit adultery → 9) thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s wife
3. thou shalt not steal → 10) thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s goods

So–in each pair, the first forbids physical actions, the second forbids the internal process that makes the first more likely.

 

[DaMaMaXiMuS]

Thanks everyone,

Well this was totally new to me! You see I remember that before I approached the teacher, I had looked inside a NAB bible to make sure cuz I did think well it could be possible Catholics list it differently. As far I’ve learned, the NAB is a commonly used bible by Catholics. So when I looked the 10 commandments up, they are listed the exact same way in the King James Bible. Which made me even more certain that the teachers had made a mistake. I saw the same thing on this Online Douay-Rheims Bible aswell.
So this is something I definately have to research. Not that it’s going derail my journey to the Catholic Chruch, I still believe it has the Fulness of Truth. But I’m glad this came to my attention, I could me getting blind sided by a protestant cuz I would not have know how to explain it.

But this kinda of reminds me of the Jehovah Witnesses, there’s a scripture in Mathews that they remove, Mat. 18:10 I believe. I don’t remember their reasons for doing so.

Now as for my RCIA teachers that’s another story. I’ve been talking about this with my girlfriend, whom I’m courting, that I feel like I’m not learning anything. And there has been time that they’ve made mistakes about very basic things. Don’t get me wrong, their both very nice ladies, but in my opinion their not qualified to teach adults.

Before coming to the RCC, I was a teacher in the church I was a part of for 10 yrs. My girlfriend agreed with me that it’s probably a combination of my background in bible study and their inexperience that make me feel like I’m not learning anything.

I’ve said this before, I felt like I’ve learned immensely more from Catholic Answers and books I’ve obtained, than the RCIA Class. The one in my parish is really in need of better catechists.

I’ve always had a teaching spirit and wondered if I could one day be a teacher of RCIA classes. I think its something I really would like. And this is regardless of whether my current RCIA teacher were good or so so.

Thanks again everyone,

Nelson

 

[LindaS]

Of course you can be on the RCIA team and even do the catechesis. MY dh & I do catechesis for our parish team. The 2 men who came into the Church last year are both on our team this year and have a great deal to offer our candidates since their own journey is so recent. As they mature in their faith, we expect them to take a greater role on the team.

Peace,
Linda