Protestantism, Conversion, and Openness of the Heart

[Matariel]

I was thinking today as I was watching Mother Angelica on EWTN, and I was thinking about conversion and the way people are open to recieving the Truth (of the Catholic Church).

My cousin, who is a very close friend of mine, came back from California half a year ago, and we spent a lot of time together. He and I are very close friends, and he was baptized as a Presbyterian, but in no way practiced or believed it. Anyway, he was kind of cynical towards Catholicism, but asked me a lot of questions about it, especially when he saw the crucifix and Virgin Mary statue in my room. I did my best to explain Catholicism and it’s apostolic origin and roots, trying to do it without going over his head. Anyway, to my surprise, he asked how he could become Catholic! He said everything I said sounded more truthful and made more sense than anything he’d heard! So when he comes back from California in January, he’s going to RCIA with me.

At any rate, my godbrother is a staunch evangelical Protestant, and does not understand at all why I converted to Catholicism. He tries to come up with arguements against, but usually he just avoids the topic of religion when around me, which kind of hurt, because it’s almost like an untouchable subject. Anyway, he’s not completely closed to Catholicism, and I think, if we talked about it, he’d be opened up to it, so I’m praying that’s what happens.

Then there is my father-- I struggled so hard to explain to him and my staunch Protestant family why I had to convert, and, after so much talking and explaining to him, he said he undestood that the Baptismal Regeneration, Real Presence and Episcopal set-up (but not Apostolic Succession) and other things of the Catholic faith seemed true. I said, “well, you can’t go on attending a Protestant sect that doesn’t believe in the Real Presence if you do,” and he said, “I don’t know what I believe. If I were to accept the Real Presence or baptismal regeneration, that would ruin the understanding I have of salvation. I’m a Protestant; that’s my identity, and if I was anything else I wouldn’t be who I am.”

I was* very *upset.

But it got me thinking. My cousin, a nominal, unbelieving Protestant was so quick to believe, and yet my father, who has spent years building up his own theology and understanding, and attends Protestant services every Sunday, and who attempted to raise me Protestant, was the least open.

Why is it that people “set in” Protestantism, who have built their scriptural understanding up from scratch, and embrace their private interpretation so tightly (usually anti-Catholic too) are so closed to the Truth?

Why was my cousin so open, andmy own father so closed? Why is my godbrother inbetween? It seems to reflect their own understanding and teachablility.

Does anyone have any thoughts on this?

 

[gr8full]

Why are some open and some not? I would say for one, because God created us all differently. We all come to understanding on topics at our own pace. Didn’t you ever have a math class where the light came on for some quickly and others it took extra homework and a willingness to go the extra mile?
For others, it’s a matter of fear of the unknown. Not the kind of fear you feel when you hear something go bump in the night, but the kind of fear you feel when you have to face something new.
And, for some I think it’s just that they don’t want to know. It would be too much work and make them too uncomfortable.
It’s hard to change and even harder when you face opposition from people you care for.
Just my thought on this.

 

[Matariel]

Why are some open and some not? I would say for one, because God created us all differently. We all come to understanding on topics at our own pace. Didn’t you ever have a math class where the light came on for some quickly and others it took extra homework and a willingness to go the extra mile?

What about people who come to know the Truth but do not turn toward it? I fear that that’s what my Father’s done. Why? Because of my family? That shouldn’t get in the way of truth! My mom’s devout, but completely uninterested in the Protestant-Catholic split. She just says what ever makes people happy, as long as they’re worshipping the Christian God.

For others, it’s a matter of fear of the unknown. Not the kind of fear you feel when you hear something go bump in the night, but the kind of fear you feel when you have to face something new.
And, for some I think it’s just that they don’t want to know. It would be too much work and make them too uncomfortable.
It’s hard to change and even harder when you face opposition from people you care for.
Just my thought on this.

What I hate the most and don’t understand is when people are against your conversion but they don’t ever bring it up because it’s “controversial”. But we’re old enough to talk like adults, and there’s no reason to dance around “controversial” topics. Sometimes it’s more hurtful when they’re silent.

 

[Koolerkev]

There has to be a conversion of heart before there’s a conversion of mind. That’s what I keep on seeing when reading about protestant conversions and looking at atheism on youtube. One would think it so simple because when the Catholic case is presented to its fullest extent, its an incredibly historical and logical argument. It just makes so much sense. Like the way your cousin understood it. But often times its not that simple.

People’s bias or fear can take precedent over logic. I like to compare it to the old saying, “You can bring a horse to water, but you can’t make it drink.” You can lead people to the truth, but the people won’t accept it if they don’t want to, not because of any logical argument, but maybe because its hard to break a line of thinking that a person’s held for so long or they simply don’t want to do what the truth entails.

 

[ericka1701]

I was raised Presbyterian as well, attended church my whole life with no more than a 6 month absence from church, and studied Reformation and Protestantism as much as I could. About the age of 16, I started realizing that there were quite a few things that weren’t really explained or even explainable (and I was told when I had a question about one of those unexplainable things “You have to take it in faith”). Very soon after I started researching all different denominations and soon realized that Catholicism held the full truth and the unexplainable was explained, very well in most cases.

With that said, it still took me another 5 years for me to take the plunge in the Tiber. Since I had been raised and was still active in my first church, it took me a long time to break all of the attachments and to overcome the fear of what others would think. Very vain, I know, but that is the truth.

I’m not saying that this might be the case with your father or godbrother, but it can be more difficult to convert to a new church than it is to convert from “nothing”.

I will be praying for you and your family!

God Bless!
Ericka

 

[Matariel]

I was raised Presbyterian as well, attended church my whole life with no more than a 6 month absence from church, and studied Reformation and Protestantism as much as I could. About the age of 16, I started realizing that there were quite a few things that weren’t really explained or even explainable (and I was told when I had a question about one of those unexplainable things “You have to take it in faith”).

I was the same. To me, I wondered wht Christianity had so much division and disagreement. Where could I go to get Definitive Truth? I found the answer in the ancient and undivided Catholic Church.

With that said, it still took me another 5 years for me to take the plunge in the Tiber. Since I had been raised and was still active in my first church, it took me a long time to break all of the attachments and to overcome the fear of what others would think. Very vain, I know, but that is the truth.

I have to admit, it took me about a year to finally do it.

I’m not saying that this might be the case with your father or godbrother, but it can be more difficult to convert to a new church than it is to convert from “nothing”.

I just can’t believe my Father, that he realized that these Catholic doctrines were very biblical, and very rational, and seemed true-- but that if he really acted on that belief he wouldn’t be a Evangelical Protestant. Which, to me, was very hurtful, since I would think that if you find the truth you would pursue it.

I will be praying for you and your family!

Thank you! May God bless you and may the saints always intercede for you! :bounce:

And merry Christmas!

 

[Salonika]

Matariel:

I was thinking today as I was watching Mother Angelica on EWTN, and I was thinking about conversion and the way people are open to receiving the Truth (of the Catholic Church).

But it got me thinking. My cousin, a nominal, unbelieving Protestant was so quick to believe, and yet my father, who has spent years building up his own theology and understanding, and attends Protestant services every Sunday, and who attempted to raise me Protestant, was the least open.

Why was my cousin so open, and my own father so closed? Why is my godbrother inbetween? It seems to reflect their own understanding and teachablility.

Does anyone have any thoughts on this?

Yes, I have a few ideas which may or may not be relevant to your father, godbrother and cousin. These include:

• we have different degrees of opennesss to new ideas ranging form nil to great
• we often have more openness to new ideas if they complement existing views and/or do not conflict with ideas we have already
• our openness to new ideas is influenced by how the new ideas are presented to us - as a possibility or as the truth which we must accept
• whether we believe that there is only one true church or religion or whether we believe that all churches have part of the truth
• whether the person trying to convince us of new ideas respects our current views and our right to hold them
• what we already believe about the ideas that are presented to us - in this case what the three people involved already knew about Catholicism
• how long it takes people to accept new ideas - some people are looking for new ideas some don’t want to hear new ones.

I am always interested in what people think and believe and sometimes this causes some problems. People can misunderstand interest in their ideas and how they have developed them for being interested in adopting them.

Also we should not assume that people will come to think as we do if they know all we know. Knowing more can often have the opposite effect, of confirming us that the views are not for me.

And finally there are times when some people would like to believe but know that this is impossible without violating their conscience.

 

[puzzleannie]

I
Why is it that people “set in” Protestantism, who have built their scriptural understanding up from scratch, and embrace their private interpretation so tightly (usually anti-Catholic too) are so closed to the Truth?

Why was my cousin so open, andmy own father so closed? Why is my godbrother inbetween? It seems to reflect their own understanding and teachablility.

Does anyone have any thoughts on this?

it is in my experience people who have a habitual attitude of openness to God’s grace in all facets of their life who respond to tihs movement when He calls them to full union in His Church. A person who is atheist because he is on a personal quest for truth has a much better chance of converting than a devout Christian who reads the bible every day looking for confirmation of his own pre-set beliefs and rejects everything that conflicts with his own opinions. The person in the latter frame of mind is generally like that about everything–their favorite football team, what brand of car to buy, politics–so they cannot open to truth from anything outside themselves.

 

[Monica4316]

Don’t feel discouraged, I used to think JUST LIKE your father and God literally dragged me into the Church and now I’m becoming Catholic. Just pray for Him. Especially pray the Rosary.

God bless

 

[skeyes]

Matariel, folks like you father have a vested interest in their lives as they are now.It is okay for them to be able to agree with you that the real presence is correct, but it is another thing for them to base their lives on the real presence being correct. It is tough to believe when you have put your whole life into something that it could possibly be wrong. So it becomes a quandry, you want to serve God, but you want God to leave you where you are and not make you uncomfortable. They say things like “I have been whatever all my life and I am a good man, why should I change to another denomination?” That is hard for us to understand because we know the truth, not just with our minds, but also with our hearts. You have presented the truth, now, obey the fourth commandment and honor your father because he will get it right.
Peace, you and your father are in my prayers.
In His service,
Stan

 

[MarkBrown]

Why is it that people “set in” Protestantism, who have built their scriptural understanding up from scratch, and embrace their private interpretation so tightly (usually anti-Catholic too) are so closed to the Truth?

Re think your attitude toward your Father. He has the Truth, he has Christ. He does not have what we would say it the fullness of the Truth.

Change protestantism to catholicism and catholic to protestant in your post and view it from a protestant lens. Ideas like you present from either side closes down true and real discussion. Defensive walls are built up and both side start viewing it as a battle or contest to win.

When your Father asks questions, answer them. Give him the answer and do not give more info than he asked for you to give.

Understand also, your other relatives will not have the same feelings as your father. He can have feelings of rejection, he raised you with a set of certain beliefs and you have rejected them. Hence he could in the back of his mind feel you are rejecting him. Your cousin and your brother are on a different relational plane than you and your father. They have not “invested” anything near what your dad has invested in you.

I know as my father has those feelings. I was raised SBC, was a SBC pastor, as was my grandfather, uncles, great uncles. Dad was a deacon. I became an Anglican, a very catholic Anglican. He struggles with it. The last time we went hunting together, he would ask questions. I could tell he struggles with my decision. I am studying to be a priest. The first priest ever in the family. I tread carefully to help my dad understand. But I do not for one moment think dad does not have the Truth. That has helped me to help him to understand.

 

[Salonika]

I had a thought while I was waiting to open this thread and read the new entry/entries.

Think there are two types of “openness of heart” and we should not assume that they go together.

The first is “openness of heart” in the sense of being willing to hear about the views of another religion (in this case Catholicism).

The second is “openness to being converted” to another religion (in this case Catholicism.)

They sometimes go together but sometimes they don’t. Think we need to keep this in mind and not assume they always do.

 

[Matariel]

Wow, these were all really good replies, thanks. :yup:

 

[meghaningram08]

Well, I can say I am having personal experience with this right now. I was raised outside of the church, but found it on my own when I was in 7th grade. I moved from one protestant church to another before finding my “home” in a southern baptist church. I liked the church for a while, but then it seemed as if no one there had any love for each other. When I began college in the fall of 2008, I met a guy, who happened to be Catholic, in the school band. We started talking, and began dating. We have been together for four months now, and I have decided to convert. I went to mass at his church several times, and there was a love and respect there that I had never before experienced. They had more respect for each other, as well as for God. I spent a couple months in intense prayer and studying before coming to this conclusion. I have now announced it to my friends that I will begin RCIA classes soon, and many of them are thrilled. Sadly, I’ve lost a lot of friends for it. What really aggravates me is that when they argue against it, they make invalid points and it is very clear that they have no concept of what the Catholic Faith is all about.

 

[Junebug999]

There has to be a conversion of heart before there’s a conversion of mind.

Yes, and only God can help with the conversion of heart. Sometimes I think prayer, prayer, prayer is what makes the heart fertile ground for the seed of Truth.