Purgatory --- does one get (re)-educated there?

[EIF5A]

Does anyone know if one gains further spiritual knowledge in purgatory? For instance, if one held a wrong belief, not necessarily doctrine, does one learn the truth while being purified there? Or maybe while being purged of the effects of sin, come to a greater understanding of why that sin is grave and wrong, etc?

 

[dshix]

Does anyone know if one gains further spiritual knowledge in purgatory? For instance, if one held a wrong belief, not necessarily doctrine, does one learn the truth while being purified there? Or maybe while being purged of the effects of sin, come to a greater understanding of why that sin is grave and wrong, etc?

One learns the truth about everything instantly upon death. The instant you die, you will know everything you did wrong and everything you should have done right. Purgatory is just the temporal punishment you need to be purified of your sin.

 

[KrazyKat]

Can’t answer that, haven’t been there yet. No one can answer this in truth, it would only be supposition if they do.

 

[dshix]

Can’t answer that, haven’t been there yet. No one can answer this in truth, it would only be supposition if they do.

When a person dies, their soul’s knowledge is no longer limited by their human mind within their body. Our minds, our intellects, are clouded by Original sin at this time, and thus we are capable of believing false truths.

When we die, this effect will be removed.

 

[Carlan]

When a person dies, their soul’s knowledge is no longer limited by their human mind within their body. Our minds, our intellects, are clouded by Original sin at this time, and thus we are capable of believing false truths.

When we die, this effect will be removed.

Yes, only Truth will remains, and for now how God brings all about we will know soon enough.Peace,Carlan

 

[Joseph73]

The instant you die, you will know everything you did wrong and everything you should have done right.

That is my understanding also. You are naked before the Lord and your true nature becomes clear.

 

[EIF5A]

All the hatred, envy, jealousy, greed, self-entitlement, malicious thoughts, blasphemy, lies, corruption, and sin in one instant, eh…soooo looking forward to this…

 

[dshix]

All the hatred, envy, jealousy, greed, self-entitlement, malicious thoughts, blasphemy, lies, corruption, and sin in one instant, eh…soooo looking forward to this…

Heh, I wouldn’t “look forward” to Purgatory if I were you. It is a horribly painful place, full of remorse and regret.

Best get rid of as much of your temporal punishment as possible while here on earth.

 

[cmodrmac]

“Heh, I wouldn’t “look forward” to Purgatory if I were you. It is a horribly painful place, full of remorse and regret.”

Is it not true that only the Roman Catholic Church believes in Purgatory?

It is like time in prison??? -the whole concept makes no sense to me (personal reflection) why would a loving God punish those who are destined for Heaven . Is not living a human existence punishment enough -This concept ceated a bit of trouble in the 16th century.

The Buddhists concept of reincarnation I suspect has a similar underlying theme

I know it is the RC belief-I respect it but for the life of me do not understand it

 

[CatholicHockey7]

Heh, I wouldn’t “look forward” to Purgatory if I were you. It is a horribly painful place, full of remorse and regret.

Best get rid of as much of your temporal punishment as possible while here on earth.

I think you’re confusing Purgatory with Hell.

I’ve never once heard the underlined phrase in reference to Purgatory. I won’t say I’ve heard that Purgatory is all wine and roses, but there is joy there too.

“Unlike the damned, those in the state of purgatory have the joy of knowing that, upon purification, they will enter eternal life in heaven.” (CA’s Jim Blackburn answering the quick question “Is purgatory like hell?”)

There is suffering, to be sure. But to quote Ron Weasley: “You’re going to suffer, but you’re going to be happy about it.”

 

[Neofight]

Can’t answer that, haven’t been there yet. No one can answer this in truth, it would only be supposition if they do.

I think it can be answered in truth without having died: and that answer is no.

All souls in purgatory are saints-in-waiting. By this I mean every soul in purgatory will see heaven…either at some point before, or finally at the last judgement.

No souls in purgatory will go to hell, and sense they are righteous enough in the eyes of God to be heaven bound, they need purification, but certainly not re-education.

 

[CatholicHockey7]

“Heh, I wouldn’t “look forward” to Purgatory if I were you. It is a horribly painful place, full of remorse and regret.”

Is it not true that only the Roman Catholic Church believes in Purgatory?

It is like time in prison??? -the whole concept makes no sense to me (personal reflection) why would a loving God punish those who are destined for Heaven . Is not living a human existence punishment enough -This concept ceated a bit of trouble in the 16th century.

The Buddhists concept of reincarnation I suspect has a similar underlying theme

I know it is the RC belief-I respect it but for the life of me do not understand it

Rev 21:27 says nothing unclean will enter Heaven.

Let’s take a white shirt and spill a little wine on it. Now run it through the wash without treating the stain in any special way. The shirt is technically clean because it has been washed. But is it spotless? No. It is forever stained.

Purgatory exists to remove the stains of our sins.

Another example from my days in HS. The day before our first home football game the grounds crew was out painting the goal posts. Why? Because they were covered in bird droppings. The crew failed to clean the droppings before applying the paint. Would you say the goal post was clean? Or was it merely covered? When the first rains came, what do you suppose happened to the goal posts?

Lastly, you say the concept created trouble in the 16th century, but why did it take that long? If you read the links below you’ll see that the doctrine has been around for a long time and has roots in sacred scripture. Hopefully these will help you understand it.

catholic.com/tracts/purgatory
catholic.com/quickquestions/is-purgatory-like-hell
catholic.com/blog/matt-fradd/the-logical-case-for-purgatory
catholic.com/tracts/the-roots-of-purgatory

 

[cmodrmac]

Thank you

It took a long time for trouble to be created: however when the inevitable invention of indulgences came up-if one has a type of waiting room for Heaven ala Purgatory then obviously if one can get out quicker than another one would " suffer less?" -Now that caused trouble

Can’t have indlulgences without a Purgatory -sort of a get out of Jail free card in Monoply

Praying for the Dead is an ancient custom I agree-but there really is no need to pray for the dead as those who are in Hell will always be in Hell and those in PUrgatory are going to Heaven regardless of our prayers

an interesting concept Purgatory is -the concept of “soul sleep” makes more sense to me

 

[dshix]

I think you’re confusing Purgatory with Hell.

I’ve never once heard the underlined phrase in reference to Purgatory. I won’t say I’ve heard that Purgatory is all wine and roses, but there is joy there too.

“Unlike the damned, those in the state of purgatory have the joy of knowing that, upon purification, they will enter eternal life in heaven.” (CA’s Jim Blackburn answering the quick question “Is purgatory like hell?”)

There is suffering, to be sure. But to quote Ron Weasley: “You’re going to suffer, but you’re going to be happy about it.”

When did I give an indication that I misunderstood the definition of Purgatory? Did you not see me post the words “temporal punishment?”

One of the greatest mistakes of Catholics in the world today is the idea that “all I have to do is “make it” at least to Purgatory and then I’ve done it. I’m free and clear, I’ll be in heaven forever.”

This is gravely mistaking just how painful Purgatory is, just how painful it is to see your sins in their TRUE light and just how horribly they offend God.

Yes, there is light at the end of the tunnel: Heaven. But, that doesn’t mean Purgatory is any small matter.

 

[dshix]

“Heh, I wouldn’t “look forward” to Purgatory if I were you. It is a horribly painful place, full of remorse and regret.”

Is it not true that only the Roman Catholic Church believes in Purgatory?

It is like time in prison??? -the whole concept makes no sense to me (personal reflection) why would a loving God punish those who are destined for Heaven . Is not living a human existence punishment enough -This concept ceated a bit of trouble in the 16th century.

The Buddhists concept of reincarnation I suspect has a similar underlying theme

I know it is the RC belief-I respect it but for the life of me do not understand it

We punish ourselves. Prison is a bad analogy for Purgatory.

It is impossible for any soul to enter Heaven if there is any blemish on that soul; the perfection and holiness of Heaven cannot permit it. Thus, we go to Purgatory to clean our souls and prepare ourselves for the Beatific vision.

EDIT: Ah, I see that CatholicHockey already answered your question.

 

[CatholicHockey7]

When did I give an indication that I misunderstood the definition of Purgatory? Did you not see me post the words “temporal punishment?”

One of the greatest mistakes of Catholics in the world today is the idea that “all I have to do is “make it” at least to Purgatory and then I’ve done it. I’m free and clear, I’ll be in heaven forever.”

This is gravely mistaking just how painful Purgatory is, just how painful it is to see your sins in their TRUE light and just how horribly they offend God.

Yes, there is light at the end of the tunnel: Heaven. But, that doesn’t mean Purgatory is any small matter.

I saw the temporal punishment, but your description of it as a “horribly painful place full or remorse and regret” is not something I have ever heard before. It’s certainly not something written in the CCC. It does describe a purifying fire, but your description of that fire makes it sound more like hell than the last step before heaven.

 

[CatholicHockey7]

Thank you

It took a long time for trouble to be created: however when the inevitable invention of indulgences came up-if one has a type of waiting room for Heaven ala Purgatory then obviously if one can get out quicker than another one would " suffer less?" -Now that caused trouble

Can’t have indlulgences without a Purgatory -sort of a get out of Jail free card in Monoply

Praying for the Dead is an ancient custom I agree-but there really is no need to pray for the dead as those who are in Hell will always be in Hell and those in PUrgatory are going to Heaven regardless of our prayers

an interesting concept Purgatory is -the concept of “soul sleep” makes more sense to me

Purgatory was around long before the first recorded use of indulgences (1095 A.D.). Even after that, it still took almost 500 years before someone took serious issue with the practice.

The analogy to a “get out of jail free card” doesn’t work out. In Monopoly you acquire the card BEFORE committing the action that lands you in jail. Indulgences are not like that. Sticking with Monopoly, an indulgence would be more like paying the fine rather than trying to roll doubles on your next three turns.

As for praying for the dead, if you knew someone you loved was in a horrible place and you had the power to do something about it would you really leave them there to suffer?

We may not agree on the exact details, but dshix is right that purgatory is not a pleasant experience in spite of the joy of knowing you will soon be with Christ.

 

[dshix]

I saw the temporal punishment, but your description of it as a “horribly painful place full or remorse and regret” is not something I have ever heard before. It’s certainly not something written in the CCC. It does describe a purifying fire, but your description of that fire makes it sound more like hell than the last step before heaven.

Well, since the CCC doesn’t exactly contain a description of Purgatory, I concede that there is no direct teaching on what it is like.

Yes, my words may have seemed somewhat strong, but from what I have read and heard of the Church fathers, and learned through other instruction, I have understood that Purgatory is not pleasant* at all*; quite the opposite, and considering the fact that we’ll be suffering through the cleansing of our sins, seeing just how much we offended God with each sin, it seems that it will be very unpleasant indeed.

Our suffering will not so much be physical suffering or torture as much as self-punishment. With all revealed we will know exactly what all our sins are and just how bad they are.

 

[fred_conty]

Well, since the CCC doesn’t exactly contain a description of Purgatory, I concede that there is no direct teaching on what it is like.

Yes, my words may have seemed somewhat strong, but from what I have read and heard of the Church fathers, and learned through other instruction, I have understood that Purgatory is not pleasant* at all*; quite the opposite, and considering the fact that we’ll be suffering through the cleansing of our sins, seeing just how much we offended God with each sin, it seems that it will be very unpleasant indeed.

Our suffering will not so much be physical suffering or torture as much as self-punishment. With all revealed we will know exactly what all our sins are and just how bad they are.

CCC 1031
“The tradition of the church, by reference to certain texts of Scripture, speaks of a cleansing fire.”

This word “cleansing” is the word used in the eastern churches, catholic and orthodox. That is their traditional understanding. Their explainations of theology is not as technical and precise using words like a surgeon would use the scalpel. The west is more Thomistic and exact in its understanding. So to preserve compatibility between the east and west, the church continues to use the understanding we both agree on.

However, the west has a more precise understanding of cleansing fire but dosen’t push it.

I think personally, that whenever the word “fire” is used, it is not pleasant under any condition. And tho cleansing is a more acceptable word and less scary, I believe it is a bit more, otherwise why would “fire” be used.

The big thing is, it is still a separation from God, and just how is this waiting carried out during this separation? Is it fire? I really don’t want to find out when it is too late.

I personally think that putting oneself in the hands of Mary would go along way here.
The miraculous medal, when worn and used, has the promise of Mary of GREAT graces and ABUNDANT graces.

May God bless and keep you. May God’s face shine on you. May God be kind to you and give you peace.

 

[dshix]

CCC 1031
“The tradition of the church, by reference to certain texts of Scripture, speaks of a cleansing fire.”

This word “cleansing” is the word used in the eastern churches, catholic and orthodox. That is their traditional understanding. Their explainations of theology is not as technical and precise using words like a surgeon would use the scalpel. The west is more Thomistic and exact in its understanding. So to preserve compatibility between the east and west, the church continues to use the understanding we both agree on.

However, the west has a more precise understanding of cleansing fire but dosen’t push it.

I think personally, that whenever the word “fire” is used, it is not pleasant under any condition. And tho cleansing is a more acceptable word and less scary, I believe it is a bit more, otherwise why would “fire” be used.

The big thing is, it is still a separation from God, and just how is this waiting carried out during this separation? Is it fire? I really don’t want to find out when it is too late.

I personally think that putting oneself in the hands of Mary would go along way here.
The miraculous medal, when worn and used, has the promise of Mary of GREAT graces and ABUNDANT graces.

May God bless and keep you. May God’s face shine on you. May God be kind to you and give you peace.

Well said.