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Pete_1
Guest
If the cruxifiction trancends time why did Abrahams bosom exist and why were the gates of heaven closed before jesus rose from the dead?
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Pete_1
Guest
Anyone?
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Texas_Roofer
Guest
My understanding:
First this whole subject is in the mysteries meaning man does not actually know and may well be incapable of understanding the subject.
Form Adam to Jesus death had 3 outcomes for many there was Hell (separation from god), and Purgatory(Abram’s Bosom) for a rare few chosen by God heaven (in the presents of God) existed. After Jesus’ visit heaven was available to the typical man provided he lived as taught. All three outcomes are still present, what changed is rather than needing God’s will to deliver you to heaven now you may use your will to earn your way to heaven by faith and free will decisions.
This is my understanding but I am not a theologian.
First this whole subject is in the mysteries meaning man does not actually know and may well be incapable of understanding the subject.
Form Adam to Jesus death had 3 outcomes for many there was Hell (separation from god), and Purgatory(Abram’s Bosom) for a rare few chosen by God heaven (in the presents of God) existed. After Jesus’ visit heaven was available to the typical man provided he lived as taught. All three outcomes are still present, what changed is rather than needing God’s will to deliver you to heaven now you may use your will to earn your way to heaven by faith and free will decisions.
This is my understanding but I am not a theologian.
V
Verbum
Guest
Hi Pete
God and spiritual reality is outside of time. People before Christ could be saved by the merits of Jesus Christ, just as Mary was free from original sin through these same merits. Abraham was in heaven, not in some vague limbo “waiting” for Christ.
Since our human speech is not adapted to that reality, we do talk (as may scripture) of befores and afters and waiting for Christ. But in actual fact this is not so.
Verbum
God and spiritual reality is outside of time. People before Christ could be saved by the merits of Jesus Christ, just as Mary was free from original sin through these same merits. Abraham was in heaven, not in some vague limbo “waiting” for Christ.
Since our human speech is not adapted to that reality, we do talk (as may scripture) of befores and afters and waiting for Christ. But in actual fact this is not so.
Verbum
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Pete_1
Guest
Then why did Christ decend into ‘hell’ (abrahams bosom)?
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Pete_1
Guest
bump again 
C
Charlie_Zeaiter
Guest
I thought hell is full of sin and God first had to become man before He could descend into there. :twocents:
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Caesar517
Guest
God can go where he pleases.
Abraham’s bosom was seporated from the rest of Hell by “a great chasm” as I understand it.
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Pious_Mat
Guest
Abraham’s bosom exists in time. Mind, it would be very different from Earth-time. Like Purgatory, it at one point exists and at another point does not, and would therefore have to exist in time. Purgatory certainly exists in time, as different people spend different amounts of time there, hence why not Abraham’s Bosom? It is God and His will that exist outside time. Hence God can apply retroactive graces to Purgatory or Abraham’s bosom even after it ceases to exist.
Hence if Abraham’s bosom exists in time, it is subject to the crucifixion’s effects in time, since Earth has time as well, and people on Earth could not be saved before Christ.
Really, this is a misapplication of the term “transcends time”. The crucifixion itself transcends time. Our knowledge and ability to accept it and live it do not. The crucifixion trascends time, but it also happened in time.
Hence if Abraham’s bosom exists in time, it is subject to the crucifixion’s effects in time, since Earth has time as well, and people on Earth could not be saved before Christ.
Really, this is a misapplication of the term “transcends time”. The crucifixion itself transcends time. Our knowledge and ability to accept it and live it do not. The crucifixion trascends time, but it also happened in time.
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