Question about the Tree of Knowledge and conscience

[Flame4]

I have often heard that once Adam and Eve ate from the Tree of Knowledge they developped a conscience and were able to tell right from wrong. Is this true? T

he reason I am confused is because one must know something is wrong in order to commit a sin, yes? If Adam and Eve had no conscience (didn’t know right form wrong) before eating from the Tree, then how can it be considered a sin?

Thanks for taking time to read and respond. God Bless.

 

[colmcille1]

I have often heard that once Adam and Eve ate from the Tree of Knowledge they developped a conscience and were able to tell right from wrong. Is this true? T

he reason I am confused is because one must know something is wrong in order to commit a sin, yes? If Adam and Eve had no conscience (didn’t know right form wrong) before eating from the Tree, then how can it be considered a sin?

Thanks for taking time to read and respond. God Bless.

Hi Flame4,
It was Satan, in the guise of a serpent, who told Eve that she and Adam would know right and wrong if they ate the fruit of the Tree of Knowledge.
So temptation, sin and judgement were set in motion.
God Bless,
Colmcille.

 

[tobbias88]

That doesn’t answer the question. Actually blaming Serpent/Satan is a cop-out.

Presumably before the Fall, Adam & Eve were perfect super-intelligent human beings ( not mindless hairless animals); their mind & reason were totally unclouded, they had complete control over their passions. They also had Free Will (like Satan) and I guess that’s the stinger.

Sure Satan tempted them but these creatures had the power to resist - they didn’t. They deliberately chose to disobey the command, to sin in fact. As a consequence of their sin ‘their eyes were open’ in that they realized they had broken the link with God their Father. Nothing could ever be the same again so they had to accept the consequences of their deliberate choice - banishment, pain, sickness & death. After which they (and all their offspring) remained in Outer Darkness until they were redeemed by the Blood of Jesus Christ.

That is the basis of our Christian faith & that’s why the theory of Evolution removes the need for Redemption & the Mission of Jesus Christ. You can’t have both.

 

[PJM]

=Flame4;7183455]I have often heard that once Adam and Eve ate from the Tree of Knowledge they developped a conscience and were able to tell right from wrong. Is this true? T

he reason I am confused is because one must know something is wrong in order to commit a sin, yes? If Adam and Eve had no conscience (didn’t know right form wrong) before eating from the Tree, then how can it be considered a sin?

Thanks for taking time to read and respond. God Bless.

GREAT Question! THANKS

Adam and Eve like us had a intellect, mind and freewill. Here is Haydocks explaination of v 17

Ver. 17. “The death of the soul, and become obnoxious to that of the body; thou shalt become a mortal and lose all the privileges of innocence. Though Adam lived 930 years after this, he was dying daily; he carried along with him the seeds of death, as we do, from our very conception. He had leave to eat of any fruit in this delicious garden, one only excepted, and this one prohibition makes him more eager to taste of that tree than of all the rest. So we struggle constantly to attain what is forbidden, and covet what is denied, cupimusque negata. God laid this easy command upon Adam, to give him an opportunity of shewing his ready obedience, and to assert his own absolute dominion over him. Eve was already formed, and was apprised of this positive command, (Chap. iii. 3.) and therefore, transgressing, is justly punished with her husband. True obedience does not inquire why a thing is commanded, but submits without demur…”

Love and prayers,
Pat

 

[colmcille1]

That doesn’t answer the question. Actually blaming Serpent/Satan is a cop-out.
Presumably before the Fall, Adam & Eve were perfect super-intelligent human beings ( not mindless hairless animals); their mind & reason were totally unclouded, they had complete control over their passions. They also had Free Will (like Satan) and I guess that’s the stinger.
Sure Satan tempted them but these creatures had the power to resist - they didn’t. They deliberately chose to disobey the command, to sin in fact. As a consequence of their sin ‘their eyes were open’ in that they realized they had broken the link with God their Father. Nothing could ever be the same again so they had to accept the consequences of their deliberate choice - banishment, pain, sickness & death. After which they (and all their offspring) remained in Outer Darkness until they were redeemed by the Blood of Jesus Christ.
That is the basis of our Christian faith & that’s why the theory of Evolution removes the need for Redemption & the Mission of Jesus Christ. You can’t have both.

Hi tobias,
In responding to the OP, I was referring strictly to what Satan said (Gen. 3:5).
The poster asked if Adam and Eve would attain a conscience (and so distinguish right from wrong) if they ate of the fruit of the Tree of Knowledge. The answer is no; rather, it was Satan who said to Eve: ‘For God doth know that in what day soever you shall eat thereof, your eyes shall be opened: and you shall be as Gods, knowing good and evil.’ (Gen. 3:5).
See also CCC 396 - 405.
Their eyes were indeed opened - by evil.
God Bless,
Colmcille.

 

[tobbias88]

Sorry to disagree but your answer is not theologically sound (nor even scientific). How one earth can you commit a sin if you don’t know it is wrong? Full Knowledge is one of the three conditions. (the others being: Grave Matter and Full Intention.) Adam’s sin had all three - otherwise it is not a sin.

If a creature does not have a conscience - knowing right from wrong - then it is basically an animal. We (or indeed God) would not punish animals for doing 'wrong’ since they have no conscience. Animals have no consciousness of sin. Man, even the most primitive or debased, usually knows what is wrong.

Adam & Eve were ‘lesser than Angels but higher than the beasts’. Therefore they were fully formed humans & knew exactly what they were doing. We, on the other hand after the Fall, may sometimes have an excuse for doing wrong because we are often controlled by our emotions or our thinking is confused. This was never the case with our First Parents.

Adam’s sin was similar to Satan’s - Disobedience with Full Knowledge prompted by Pride.

 

[colmcille1]

Sorry to disagree but your answer is not theologically sound (nor even scientific). How one earth can you commit a sin if you don’t know it is wrong? Full Knowledge is one of the three conditions. (the others being: Grave Matter and Full Intention.) Adam’s sin had all three - otherwise it is not a sin.

If a creature does not have a conscience - knowing right from wrong - then it is basically an animal. We (or indeed God) would not punish animals for doing 'wrong’ since they have no conscience. Animals have no consciousness of sin. Man, even the most primitive or debased, usually knows what is wrong.

Adam & Eve were ‘lesser than Angels but higher than the beasts’. Therefore they were fully formed humans & knew exactly what they were doing. We, on the other hand after the Fall, may sometimes have an excuse for doing wrong because we are often controlled by our emotions or our thinking is confused. This was never the case with our First Parents.

Adam’s sin was similar to Satan’s - Disobedience with Full Knowledge prompted by Pride.

Hi tobias,
Thank you for your reply.
May I ask you please to look again at what the OP is asking.
We are talking her about Original Sin.
Adam and Eve’s “knowledge” extended only as far as what they expected: to be like God by eating the forbidden fruit. The idea was planted by Satan.
I do not know what you mean by stating that this is not “theologically sound (nor even scientific)”!
God did not make the first couple with evil natures. It was this first sin which separated them from God to the extent that they lost the Paradise He created for them.
God Bless,
Colmcille.

 

[Crumpy]

The truths in Genesis are not always presented in abstract form, such as declaring that Adam and Eve have free will, for example, or stating that Satan took the form of the snake.
We ARE given an abstract truth, that Adam and Eve were created in the image and likeness of God – whatever that means.

The story is told rather graphically, so that many people in different cultures can grasp what is going on. Without much formality we conclude that A&E must have done SOMETHING wrong and that they were responsible and accountable for it.

They must have been fallible right from the start, if God had to give Adam a command, about anything. It may be narrow to look at that command as just a command. There was a covenant of sorts involved. God had promised that they would have everlasting life if they ate of the Tree of Life.

Etc.

In the first chapter of the epistle of James, he talks about temptation being beguiled by desire.

And, that’s what we see in the incident in the garden. There may have naturally been some tempation to eat of the fruit, and the snake comes along to stoke the flames of desire. And, so it goes.

 

[fhansen]

They had consciences because they had God-given natures; laws had been written on their hearts, and they obeyed their consciences without bothering to question them. When they *did *question them, what they questioned was whether or not an outside authority (God) even had the right to give them consciences, whether or not they should be in control of determining right from wrong, i.e. forming their own consciences. All moral evil results from this breech with God.

What Adam & Eve apparently did not know-and therefore what mankind did not yet know-was the answer to why it’s imperative-to their own integrity-to follow Gods will, IOW for God to be their God. What mankind-each of us as individuals-is here to learn is the answer to that question, with the help of God’s grace. Once we have the answer, we will obey spontaneously-out of love for the One who we’ve come to know deserves it.

 

[Flame4]

^ The last answer made the most sense to me, but thank you all for responding.
Basically what I was asking is whether the Tree of Knowledge would give A & E a concience or tdid hey already had one. And, what did the Tree of Knowledge give to A and E if not a concience?

Thanks everyone! You’ve helped me understand better.

God Bless.