Question for Muslims

[gmcbroom]

Maybe it was my sources because with the internet you ever know what you’ll read whether it’s legit or not. I read somewhere of Mohammed stating he came through the power of his arms? Was there any miracles he performed? I know some say the Koran is a miracle yet since it was compiled after his death by his successor a caliph I’m not so sure.

 

[brandonmorris]

No miracles that I know of is stated in the Kuran that Mohammed has done one reason why Islam is not the thruth

 

[mamlukman]

Muslims believe the Qur’an is a miracle. That’s the only one for Muhammad.

 

[unstoppable_II]

Muslims believe the Qur’an is a miracle. That’s the only one for Muhammad.

But the proof they offer is that the challenger cannot produce a like document. Notice the fallacy? Just because one particular individual cannot produce a like document is not proof that no one else can either. This method could be used to prove The Iliad is a miracle. This analysis goes into the miracle claim of Muslims, among others.

 

[mamlukman]

I have studied the Qur’an–in Arabic. I personally can’t see the attraction. Yes, there are a few poetic verses here and there, some of them transparently modeled on Christian prayers or scripture. But a lot of it is legalistic (i.e., boring), or trying to justify some sketchy actions of Muhammad (making war in the holy month, marrying his adopted son’s ex-wife, etc.), or just plain repetitious (as you would expect anything to be that’s revealed over a 20-year period). Some of it is just funny (ha ha funny) like the verse where clearly Muhammad is annoyed because dinner guests were arriving early and staying late. So he had a “revelation” telling guests to arrive on time and leave right after dinner! Is this the stuff of divine revelation???

Furthermore, in their attempt to deflect Western criticism, for about the last century Muslims scholars have been trying to claim that certain verses only apply to specific conditions in a specific place at a specific time (for example, fighting against disbelievers only applying to Mecca c. 622+ only). Contrast that to the Gospels, where–as far as I know–every parable and command is universal and applies everywhere to everyone at all times.

Lately there has been a movement to see complex mathematical patterns in the Qur’an (see the Texas sharpshooter fallacy) or attribute modern scientific knowledge (embryology, astronomy, etc.) to the Qur’an. This is an attempt to quantify the “miracle” of the Qur’an beyond just language. A lot of the scientific arguments hinge on equating vague 7th c. terms to precise modern scientific language. It seems to me those Muslim apologists are heading down the same street as fundamentalist Christians who believe in the literal truth of Genesis.

 

[Wesrock]

No miracles that I know of is stated in the Kuran that Mohammed has done one reason why Islam is not the thruth

I got to say, though, Mohammad isn’t the Muslim version of Jesus. In fact, they believe Jesus performed many miracles during his life. Did all of Israel’s prophets perform miracles?

Not that there isn’t discussion to be had along these lines, but perhaps the issue could be elaborated more?

 

[arthra]

Maybe it was my sources because with the internet you ever know what you’ll read whether it’s legit or not. I read somewhere of Mohammed stating he came through the power of his arms? Was there any miracles he performed? I know some say the Koran is a miracle yet since it was compiled after his death by his successor a caliph I’m not so sure.

You are correct in regard to what you can read on the internet…as there are bias and slanders ad nauseaum…

The revelation came to Prophet Muhammad beginning during His meditations in a cave on Mount Hira that overlooked Mecca… In the early years of His ministry the new Faith was persecuted and maligned resulting in boycotts of the Hashimite tribe of which the Prophet was a part… Muslims sought refuge in Abyssinia and later some of the pagan tribes sought to assassinate the Prophet in His bed… The call to leave Mecca came the Hijra began and the Prophet moved to Medina. Pagan tribes followed Him and sought to kill Him… Muslims sought to defend themselves from the pagans in Jihad… which allowed defensive actions.

Muhammad was not a lettered man rather a shepherd and later a director of caravans… The revelations of the Qur’an occurred over twenty some years and many relate to specific situations… The Prophet’s cousin Ali ibn abu Talib was there from His first revelation until His passing… and could indicate the exact places and situations where the revelation obtained… so it was a “miracle” as it was recited regularly and it’s composition has been preserved intact.

 

[brandonmorris]

I got to say, though, Mohammad isn’t the Muslim version of Jesus. In fact, they believe Jesus performed many miracles during his life. Did all of Israel’s prophets perform miracles?

Not that there isn’t discussion to be had along these lines, but perhaps the issue could be elaborated more?

Sure,
according to my knowledge not all Prophets had any particular “special” miracles per se but what makes Jesus so special and seperates him from the rest is the fact that Him being God and able to make a pure sacrifice for mankind’s sins . Mahommad teaches a distant God. With rules and regulations that is only made to submit to his teachings as to opposed to God’s who is a personal God to His children . Mohammed never made any type of sacrifice for mankinds sins the prophets of ancient Judaism were pointing to Jesus Christ the fullment of all the prophets the beginning and the end the alpha and omega. I on’t ever remember hearing Muslims talking about anyone changing water into wine or forgiving sins …food for thought

 

[unstoppable_II]

…
Not that there isn’t discussion to be had along these lines, but perhaps the issue could be elaborated more?

See the link reference in my post #4.

 

[drac16]

You people have no respect. What do you think it says about you when you people don’t have any regard for representing Islam fairly? You people will post anything to get people to disbelieve Islam, even if you have to lie by saying that there is no miracle by Muhammad recorded in the Qur’an (there’s the night journey in surah 17:1)

So there you go, if you say that no miracles means that Muhammad is a false prophet, since you’ve now been presented with one, you have no reason not to convert, right?

I know you won’t do that, though. You people have no desire for consistency or representing someone fairly. It’s called intellectual integrity. Learn some. I will bear witness against you people on Judgment Day in the strongest of terms.

 

[arthra]

Drac,

It certainly doesn’t do any harm for people to learn more about Prophet Muhammad… but I think today there’s a lot of misinformation and centuries of mistrust and bias … I’d urge patience with them.

• Art

 

[brandonmorris]

You people have no respect. What do you think it says about you when you people don’t have any regard for representing Islam fairly? You people will post anything to get people to disbelieve Islam, even if you have to lie by saying that there is no miracle by Muhammad recorded in the Qur’an (there’s the night journey in surah 17:1)

So there you go, if you say that no miracles means that Muhammad is a false prophet, since you’ve now been presented with one, you have no reason not to convert, right?

I know you won’t do that, though. You people have no desire for consistency or representing someone fairly. It’s called intellectual integrity. Learn some. I will bear witness against you people on Judgment Day in the strongest of terms.

I hope you won’t be offended …this is not my intent but it seems by your judgement you are not treating Christianity fairly . While certainly our Muslims brothers recognize that is only one God as the same as we it’s just theologically that we disagree. It is not the heart of our Holy Catholic church to condem but we have to stand and preach the truthand for us that is only through Jesus Christ. true there is some that don’t fully understand Islam but there is a lot of Islam that I can not agree with I will pray for you I hope that helps you understand why we may not see from your point of view on agreement in theology .May God Bless you in His grace

 

[gmcbroom]

Drac16,
I Was actually just getting to that. The two miracles I'd heard of were Mohammed's night journey and the splitting of the moon. Yet, the miracle that seems to be discussed at length would be the miracle of the Koran as it was recited by a man who never studied Judaism or Christianity. Saying that they descriminate against none of them. Even confirming the divine origins of each. This means there can be no picking and choosing of which verses to accept for the Old and New Testament as they're both valid. So, this poses a problem.

 

[CompSciGuy]

I hope you won’t be offended …this is not my intent but it seems by your judgement you are not treating Christianity fairly . While certainly our Muslims brothers recognize that is only one God as the same as we it’s just theologically that we disagree. It is not the heart of our Holy Catholic church to condem but we have to stand and preach the truthand for us that is only through Jesus Christ. true there is some that don’t fully understand Islam but there is a lot of Islam that I can not agree with I will pray for you I hope that helps you understand why we may not see from your point of view on agreement in theology .May God Bless you in His grace

I want to thank you for being a true apologist and true evangelist instead of being a wishy-washy “I’m OK, you’re OK, everybody’s saved” Catholic like so many I know.

 

[McCartney]

What exactly is the miracle of the Koran?

 

[brandonmorris]

I want to thank you for being a true apologist and true evangelist instead of being a wishy-washy “I’m OK, you’re OK, everybody’s saved” Catholic like so many I know.

Thank God For His truth I am only trying to do what is right and being fair at the same time brother a lot of our own brothers and sisters our not well taught in the Christian faith and as a reslt they think that everyone is saved and every religion that claims to be monotheistic is ok to believe in once we really learn what the Catholic faith is all about we can shed light on the flaws of the religious point of views. We preach and teach and pray for thetruth and those to see the true light of the world

 

[gmcbroom]

So now onto the other miracles of the Koran. Were there any witnesses to the night journey? Or was this something he alone experienced? How about him splitting the moon?

 

[MartinJordan]

How about him splitting the moon?

This one is most interesting. I would like to know if there are some Muslim (Islamic) scholars and/or scientists who refer to this. How do they go about explaining it, through reason and logic and in what way is a miracle (of which I mean a benefit) for the human race. I’m sure there are.

MJ

 

[arthra]

What exactly is the miracle of the Koran?

My impression is that as an illiterate Man of His time the Qur’an was revealed through Him over some twenty years… Of course illiterate persons tend to have good memories and repeat or recite verses…and so regularly the Qur’an was recited. Secretaries also took down the revealed words.

The writing of Arabic also was in transition.

The splitting of the moon

There is a literary expression that goes like this:

“…he would never accept the truth…even if he should see, taking place before his very eyes, the miracle of the splitting of the moon.”

another expression:

“The Moon of Religious teachings by the priesthood is split asunder-”

The Night Journey…

There is a Hadith attributed to Aisha that Muhammad was in His bed when this occurred so some believe it was more of a spiritual nature than physical one:

“he was transported only in his spirit while His body did not leave its place”

See the appendix of “The Message of the Qur’an” by Muhammad Asad for more information…also Asad’s Symbolism and Allegory in the Qur’an.

 

[gmcbroom]

Thank you Arthra,

So then the night journey is in the Hadith not the Koran. If the Hadith stand on equal footing as the Koran then it could be relevant. Yet, if not it could be viewed as hear say.