Question on Joseph

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NonDenom

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Hi All
I was posting on another thread and had a crazy thought. If Catholic say that it was Mary’s “YES” that played a huge role in Salvation then your only getting it half right. If Joseph has not said “YES” and had cast Mary out, she would have been shunned by the community and STONED. So in theory Joseph played as much a role in Salvation as Mary. I am very interested in your thoughts.
In Him and Only Him
 
NonDenom said:
Hi All
I was posting on another thread and had a crazy thought. If Catholic say that it was Mary’s “YES” that played a huge role in Salvation then your only getting it half right. If Joseph has not said “YES” and had cast Mary out, she would have been shunned by the community and STONED. So in theory Joseph played as much a role in Salvation as Mary. I am very interested in your thoughts.
In Him and Only Him
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Mary said yes, right from the start. Joseph initially said no, and said yes only after the angel came to him in the dream and “persuaded” him. So there’s a bit of a difference there.

Also, Mary was the ark of the new covenant (holding Jesus the new Law, the new High Priest, and the new Bread from Heaven), Joseph was not.

Mary gave Jesus her actual DNA. Joseph did not.

Mary is the new Eve. Genesis 3:15. Joseph is not the new Adam, Christ is.

Mary is a child of God the Father (as are we all, including Joseph) but is also the Mother of God the Son, and the spouse of God the Holy Spirit. Joseph was not.

Mary became our spiritual mother at the foot of the cross. Joseph did not.

Mary was crowned Queen (Queen Mother) of Heaven (Rev 12:1). Joseph was not.

These are just a few off the top of my head.

Catholics do hold St. Joseph in high esteem, we do pray to him (NOT WORSHIP) as we do to many saints. And he certainly had a unique role in salvation, but not to the extent Mary did.

🙂
 
Not quite. In fact not nearly.

Yes, Joseph protected Mary, and helped raise Jesus, and for this reason we Catholics rightly give him a place of high honour.

But the fact remains Mary not only bore the Word made Flesh within her, He was given that very flesh by her, and her alone! And it was at her request that He performed His first miracle, and she and she uniquely suffered right alongside Him at His crucifixion - the ‘sword’ Simeon spoke of pierced her heart alone, no-one else’s but His.
 
NonDenom said:
Hi All
I was posting on another thread and had a crazy thought. If Catholic say that it was Mary’s “YES” that played a huge role in Salvation then your only getting it half right. If Joseph has not said “YES” and had cast Mary out, she would have been shunned by the community and STONED. So in theory Joseph played as much a role in Salvation as Mary. I am very interested in your thoughts.
In Him and Only Him
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No. St Joseph was a wise and loyal servant of God, but God had come into the world with the Incarnation. Killing Mary would not have undone that - what would have happened is anyone’s guess, but presumably Jesus would still have risen from the dead.

In the event, of course, St Joseph did protect Mary and Jesus.
 
NonDenom said:
Hi All
I was posting on another thread and had a crazy thought. If Catholic say that it was Mary’s “YES” that played a huge role in Salvation then your only getting it half right. If Joseph has not said “YES” and had cast Mary out, she would have been shunned by the community and STONED. So in theory Joseph played as much a role in Salvation as Mary. I am very interested in your thoughts.
In Him and Only Him
Click to expand...
Joseph’s plan was to “put her away quietly” (emphasis mine). He did not want any harm to come to her. He simply thought, quite understandably, that she had been unchaste. Once he learned, in a dream, that she was with child via the Holy Spirit, that was different. Joseph was a righteous, kindly and merciful man. If he had not been, then I do not think God would have chosen him as a foster father.

I would also add that both the Blessed Virgin Mary and St. Joseph were each in the own way, singularly gifted people. They must have been to meet the unprecedented challenge and nurturing and raising their own Creator. Lots of parents think their children are perfect, but Jesus really was! What a challenge it must have been to know that the little Child they were teaching to walk or build a fire or clean His room was also the same Person Who delivered the Jews from Egypt, parted the Red Sea and gave Abraham and Sarah a child in their old age. And here they were telling Him to wash His hands before dinner. This line of thought is simply amazing to me.
 
rpp said:
What a challenge it must have been to know that the little Child they were teaching to walk or build a fire or clean His room was also the same Person Who delivered the Jews from Egypt, parted the Red Sea and gave Abraham and Sarah a child in their old age. And here they were telling Him to wash His hands before dinner. This line of thought is simply amazing to me.
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Yes. And here’s another amazing thought: The Bible says He “learned obedience.”
 
rpp said:
Joseph’s plan was to "put her away quietly

" (emphasis mine). He did not want any harm to come to her. He simply thought, quite understandably, that she had been unchaste. Once he learned, in a dream, that she was with child via the Holy Spirit, that was different. Joseph was a righteous, kindly and merciful man. If he had not been, then I do not think God would have chosen him as a
foster father
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Just a thought, I agree with what’s been posted here: St. Joseph’s role was certainly not the same or equal to Mary’s, but I do think that he doesn’t get as much mention as he should sometimes. I mean, WOW that guy was really faithful, even if it did take some coaxing, and he performed a pretty important task, right?
 
rpp said:

As Christians, whether we be Catholics or Protestants, we know that Jesus was born of a virgin, a biological impossibility to begin with. But then, God is God and, while He normally works through the natural world and natural processes, He did this to make a sign. The same is true with the miracles Jesus performed.

Hi
It makes alot of difference, one poster called Joseph a “Stepfather”. If it were not Mary’s egg that was fertelized, but rather God leaping into Mary’s womb that would only make her a “Stepmother”.
In Him and Him Only
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[/QUOTE]
 
The genealogy of Jesus shows the line of Kings from David. St. Joseph had to be covertly the King.
 
With all that said, it should not be overlooked that St. Joseph is the Patron of the Church:
  1. The special motives for which St. Joseph has been proclaimed Patron of the Church, and from which the Church looks for singular benefit from his patronage and protection, are that Joseph was the spouse of Mary and that he was reputed the Father of Jesus Christ. From these sources have sprung his dignity, his holiness, his glory. In truth, the dignity of the Mother of God is so lofty that naught created can rank above it. But as Joseph has been united to the Blessed Virgin by the ties of marriage, it may not be doubted that he approached nearer than any to the eminent dignity by which the Mother of God surpasses so nobly all created natures. For marriage is the most intimate of all unions which from its essence imparts a community of gifts between those that by it are joined together. Thus in giving Joseph the Blessed Virgin as spouse, God appointed him to be not only her life’s companion, the witness of her maidenhood, the protector of her honour, but also, by virtue of the conjugal tie, a participator in her sublime dignity. And Joseph shines among all mankind by the most august dignity, since by divine will, he was the guardian of the Son of God and reputed as His father among men. Hence it came about that the Word of God was humbly subject to Joseph, that He obeyed him, and that He rendered to him all those offices that children are bound to render to their parents. From this two-fold dignity flowed the obligation which nature lays upon the head of families, so that Joseph became the guardian, the administrator, and the legal defender of the divine house whose chief he was. And during the whole course of his life he fulfilled those charges and those duties. He set himself to protect with a mighty love and a daily solicitude his spouse and the Divine Infant; regularly by his work he earned what was necessary for the one and the other for nourishment and clothing; he guarded from death the Child threatened by a monarch’s jealousy, and found for Him a refuge; in the miseries of the journey and in the bitternesses of exile he was ever the companion, the assistance, and the upholder of the Virgin and of Jesus. Now the divine house which Joseph ruled with the authority of a father, contained within its limits the scarce-born Church. From the same fact that the most holy Virgin is the mother of Jesus Christ is she the mother of all Christians whom she bore on Mount Calvary amid the supreme throes of the Redemption; Jesus Christ is, in a manner, the first-born of Christians, who by the adoption and Redemption are his brothers. And for such reasons the Blessed Patriarch looks upon the multitude of Christians who make up the Church as confided specially to his trust - this limitless family spread over the earth, over which, because he is the spouse of Mary and the Father of Jesus Christ he holds, as it were, a paternal authority. It is, then, natural and worthy that as the Blessed Joseph ministered to all the needs of the family at Nazareth and girt it about with his protection, he should now cover with the cloak of his heavenly patronage and defend the Church of Jesus Christ.
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vatican.va/holy_father/leo_xiii/encyclicals/documents/hf_l-xiii_enc_15081889_quamquam-pluries_en.html

:gopray2:
 
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