Questions about excommunication

[Firebug]

Hi you guys!

I just had a question that popped into my head last night, and was wondering what you guys thought.
If a person got excommunicated, but doesn’t think they deserved to be, and wants to attend Mass (of course, they wouldn’t be allowed to recieve the Eucharist), can he do so? Would he get kicked out? Also, what if he wanted to recieve the sacraments (Eucharist, confession, etc.), what would he do? Would a person go to hell if they got excommunicated?

Thanks for your time!

 

[threej_lc]

Excommunication explicitly bans anyone from licitly recieving the sacraments under pain of mortal sin.

I BELIEVE they are free to attend mass, should they not participate in any way (lector, EMHC, recieve communion, choir, etc.)

If you want your excommunication removed, go repent of whatever you did wrong to you bishop. It is his jurisdiction. If you feel you were excommunicated wrongly, you can appeal to the pope.

If a person was excommunicated wrongly, and obeyed the church in all its restrictions, and acted to the best of their ability to get it removed, there would be no concern of hell. Excommunication does not immediately deny someone from heavenly grace. It just denies them the normal aid of the church in getting there.

However, if someone was excommunicated justly, and did not repent, that of course makes entering heaven slightly more difficult. But God is always the final judge.

Josh

 

[cameron_lansing]

Firebug:

If a person got excommunicated, but doesn’t think they deserved to be, and wants to attend Mass (of course, they wouldn’t be allowed to receive the Eucharist), can he do so? Would he get kicked out? Also, what if he wanted to receive the sacraments (Eucharist, confession, etc.), what would he do? Would a person go to hell if they got excommunicated?

You probably will find your answer in canon 1331: “§1. An excommunicated person is forbidden: 1º to have any ministerial participation in celebrating the sacrifice of the Eucharist or any other ceremonies of worship whatsoever; 2º to celebrate the sacraments or sacramentals and to receive the sacraments; 3º to exercise any ecclesiastical offices, ministries, or functions whatsoever or to place acts of governance. §2. If the excommunication has been imposed or declared, the offender: 1º who wishes to act against the prescript of §1, 1º must be prevented from doing so, or the liturgical action must be stopped unless a grave cause precludes this. . .”

The sacraments and the sacramentals cannot be received by the excommunicated. In my opinion, a cleric or lay person could attend Mass in the pew but no more than that.

§1,1º would apply to clerics and those instituted as lectors or acolytes. If it could be done without a grave reason otherwise, a liturgy would be stopped if some of these attempted to participate. Because of the possible tumult, it is unlikely anyone would physically try to remove the person.

§1, 3º would apply to those exercising a role as extraordinary minister of holy communion or reading, or perhaps ushering.

Generally, excommunication is a deprivation of certain spiritual goods celebrated in the external life of the Church (called the external forum). Simply said, it requires the grave external violation of a Church law or precept to which this penalty is attached or imposed. This must be done freely, knowingly and deliberately. There are other aspects to this, since Church penal law is highly complex.

While these are similar to the conditions for a mortal sin, sin is a matter of the internal forum, or the forum of conscience. The Church in declaring or imposing excommunication does not address the question directly then, of whether an excommunicated person would suffer eternal loss. The question of a person’s state of grace is not evaluated by Church law.

Therefore it would be a little misleading to say that “excommunication explicitly bans anyone from licitly receiving the sacraments under pain of mortal sin.” It bans them from the sacraments, but it is just silent about the matter of sin, as you can see from the canon above.
.

 

[threej_lc]

cameron_lansing:

Therefore it would be a little misleading to say that “excommunication explicitly bans anyone from licitly receiving the sacraments under pain of mortal sin.” It bans them from the sacraments, but it is just silent about the matter of sin, as you can see from the canon above.
.

Thanks for the clarification!
Josh

 

[Firebug]

Thanks so much! It just got me thinking, and not finding out about it would have bothered me.

 

[Topher]

threej_lc:

Excommunication explicitly bans anyone from licitly recieving the sacraments under pain of mortal sin.

I BELIEVE they are free to attend mass, should they not participate in any way (lector, EMHC, recieve communion, choir, etc.)

If you want your excommunication removed, go repent of whatever you did wrong to you bishop. It is his jurisdiction. If you feel you were excommunicated wrongly, you can appeal to the pope.

If a person was excommunicated wrongly, and obeyed the church in all its restrictions, and acted to the best of their ability to get it removed, there would be no concern of hell. Excommunication does not immediately deny someone from heavenly grace. It just denies them the normal aid of the church in getting there.

However, if someone was excommunicated justly, and did not repent, that of course makes entering heaven slightly more difficult. But God is always the final judge.

Josh

Actually, an excommunication is an automatic sentence to hell for the justly ecommunicated person who does not repent before death.

 

[threej_lc]

Topher:

Actually, an excommunication is an automatic sentence to hell for the justly ecommunicated person who does not repent before death.

Hence my saying it becomes more difficult to enter heaven. But again, God is the final judge. Because we do not know if they repented before death, or if they lacked proper understanding of the gravity of their situation, or if the excommunication was given unjustly, etc. etc. etc.

Josh

 

[cameron_lansing]

Topher:

Actually, an excommunication is an automatic sentence to hell for the justly ecommunicated person who does not repent before death.

Again, there is a distinction between the external declaration or imposition of such a penalty and the moral condition of the offender. Sure, it’s probably true that someone who has been justly excommunicated is also likely to have incurred mortal sin from an objective perspective, and that had better be confronted. Yet it remains true we don’t and we can’t know the internal disposition of the person.

So I would encourage avoiding the kind of absolute assertion made above. To my knowledge, not even the Church, which is the authority imposing or declaring such a penalty, is willling to make it.

If I am wrong and you can cite a reference from the present law of the Church, I would reconsider my thinking here. Otherwise, I would continue to encourage being careful about an absolute approach to excommunication and final judgment.