RCIA is driving me nuts!

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I have been sitting in RCIA on Sudays. I was born and raised Catholic but, out of respect for the Church, I decided to wait until I felt I was worthy of confirmation. So now I am doing it.

The teachers of the class (there are several) seem to be some kind of trippy hybrid-touch-feely-hippy Catholics. I’m losing it! One teacher went off about how she beleives women should be ordained. I tried to explain to the others in the class what the Church teaches on the subject and that Pope John Paul II has allready spoken on the issue.

Another of the teachers in the class said he did not beleive that Mary was a perpetual virgin. I told him to read passages 499-501 of the Catholic Catechism. That did not sway him. I then asked him how he could have faith that Jesus performed miracles yet he cannot beleive something like Mary’s virginity. I beleive the Holy Spirit guides the church and I beleive wholeheartedly in the Churchs’ position on the subject.

I could go on and on. I actually come home from Church angry. I know I could tear them up on theology, facts, and Church teaching but I don’t want to create a scene and scare off the others in the class, but I don’t want them receiving bogus information on Catholic teaching, either.

God help me! I’d be willing to take advice from any of you who may be able to help. 👍
 
Does the parish priest know what is going on? If not, tell him. If that doesn’t change anything, I would write a letter to your bishop and get this fixed. Isn’t Mary’s perpetual virginity a doctrine of the church? If they are teaching something against it, that would be heresy.

😦 I really wish there was a set way to teach RCIA in the church. There seems to be not too many issues with CCD (that I have seen, anyway) - if they can teach the kids, what’s up with the programs for adults?? :nope:
 
These folks have been warned before. The problem is that my parish is small (we live way out nowhere), but I have a plan. I’m going to become a hard-core Catholic and take over the RCIA.

The best way to teach prospective new Catholics is to read the Catechism. Instead we read “Idiots Guide”. That book is weak. They offer Ted Kennedy and Maddona as examples of typical Catholics. That book makes me feel like I’m reading the funny pages. 👍
 
Good idea Jon S. !!! It sounds like that program really really needs some help!
 
/but I have a plan. I’m going to become a hard-core Catholic and take over the RCIA./

Go Jon go! 🙂

Have they been warned by the bishop or just the priest? If they insist on teaching this you-know-what, they should be removed from their positions.
 
Next time you go to class bring some of your books and tear those teachers a new one, I don’t know about the rest of you but I am appauled they are spreading falsetruths about the word of god. who knows how much damage that could have? who knows? :eek:
 
I knew someone who was in the Seminary discerning his vocation. He was appalled when the teachers that things that were contrary to Church teaching, which he was well-versed on.

Those who know better have a responsibility to call these people who are teaching error, but before you have entered the Church it might not be wise.

Perhaps you can invite the others in the group to meet for coffee afterwards and discuss what has been said and what the Church actually teaches.

Do you know in advance what the next lesson is to cover? Have the others all bring a Catechism to class.
 
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Jon_S:
I have been sitting in RCIA on Sudays. I was born and raised Catholic but, out of respect for the Church, I decided to wait until I felt I was worthy of confirmation. So now I am doing it.

The teachers of the class (there are several) seem to be some kind of trippy hybrid-touch-feely-hippy Catholics. I’m losing it! One teacher went off about how she beleives women should be ordained. I tried to explain to the others in the class what the Church teaches on the subject and that Pope John Paul II has allready spoken on the issue.

Another of the teachers in the class said he did not beleive that Mary was a perpetual virgin. I told him to read passages 499-501 of the Catholic Catechism. That did not sway him. I then asked him how he could have faith that Jesus performed miracles yet he cannot beleive something like Mary’s virginity. I beleive the Holy Spirit guides the church and I beleive wholeheartedly in the Churchs’ position on the subject.

I could go on and on. I actually come home from Church angry. I know I could tear them up on theology, facts, and Church teaching but I don’t want to create a scene and scare off the others in the class, but I don’t want them receiving bogus information on Catholic teaching, either.

God help me! I’d be willing to take advice from any of you who may be able to help. 👍
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I would suggest following the advice of the Scriptures.

Speak with them individually and explain that you know and will be happy to show them that the Church does NOT teach as they are saying. If that does not work. Speak with the DRE or person in charge of the RCIA and explain exactly what was said by who and what the Church teaches. If that produces no results. Speak with the Pastor directly, again explaining who you have already spoken with and what you told them. If that does not work send a letter to the Bishop.
 
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Jon_S:
These folks have been warned before. The problem is that my parish is small (we live way out nowhere), but I have a plan. I’m going to become a hard-core Catholic and take over the RCIA.

The best way to teach prospective new Catholics is to read the Catechism. Instead we read “Idiots Guide”. That book is weak. They offer Ted Kennedy and Maddona as examples of typical Catholics. That book makes me feel like I’m reading the funny pages. 👍
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Something needs to be done! I agree. However disrupting the group will not help it will just get you thrown out or worse! I might suggest since you have already spoken with the pastor that you write the Bishop/ Office of Catechesis/ RCIA in the diocese. Speak with members of the group and see who might be interested in meeting for coffee or food at a local place and talking over what was presented that Sunday AWAY from the RCIA session without the RCIA leaders. Remember that this is proper because Candidates and Catechumens should meet with their sponsors and others OUTSIDE of the normal RCIA meetings each week. So you are not doing anything wrong. And yes stick with the Catechism. Make sure everyone is aware that they ahould have one for reference. The new Adult Catechism for the US Church which is based on the CCC should be on the shelves in a few weeks I understand.
 
I waited til I was 35 to get confirmed and almost dropped out because of vague, touchy feely classes myself. I have to say that I learned nothing about Catholicism in the class but a lot about the teachers personal lives. It was more of a group therapy session than anything else. We had 2 priests and they rarely attended any of the classes. When they did, they basically just sat back and listened. The only reason I continued is because I have a relative in the FSSP and I talked to him about it. He told me that no matter what, I needed to stick it out for my confirmation. I have learned so much more about Catholicism from him and ya’ll than my parish ever taught me. But I really do worry about the other candidates. If I didn’t learn anything (and I’m a craddle Catholic) what could they have possibly gotten out of it. I think this is a major reason for the lack of respect for the Mass. Sorry to rant, but my RCIA was a horrible experience (the main person running it didn’t like me and made it known every class). I would like to see more substance, less therapy in these classes.
 
Br. Rich SFO:
Something needs to be done! I agree. However disrupting the group will not help it will just get you thrown out or worse! I might suggest since you have already spoken with the pastor that you write the Bishop/ Office of Catechesis/ RCIA in the diocese. Speak with members of the group and see who might be interested in meeting for coffee or food at a local place and talking over what was presented that Sunday AWAY from the RCIA session without the RCIA leaders. Remember that this is proper because Candidates and Catechumens should meet with their sponsors and others OUTSIDE of the normal RCIA meetings each week. So you are not doing anything wrong. And yes stick with the Catechism. Make sure everyone is aware that they ahould have one for reference. The new Adult Catechism for the US Church which is based on the CCC should be on the shelves in a few weeks I understand.
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Brother Rich is right. With this being said, I’m a member of our RCIA team and I’m trying to give you a perspective on how I’d react as well as my Pastor (we are only human).

First, assuming that after you meet and organize your thoughts and comments, you meet with your Pastor. Keep in mind that he might be very busy with things that might even be more important (ie running the school too, preparing a big class for 1st Communion or even a capital drive to fix the roof before winter sets in) so he will quickly see that this might result in him having to assume the teaching. I suggest that you have a plan to mitigate this concern. A couple of suggestions would be to:
  1. Have for him an outline of what other dioceses and parishes have for a curriculum. Most Priests might be able to “talk off the cuff” on most of the subjects. If he expresses a challenge or conflict on a certain area, offer to try to find a substitute teacher. You’d be surprised the retired Priests or other informed people in your parish or area (many can be found in daily Mass!).
  2. Offer one of your group to be the “Administrator” of the class. This might include arranging who brings treats or gets there early to make coffee, keeping track of attendance, making copies of handouts.
  3. If you currently meet at at time and date that conflicts w/ his schedule, be prepared to change the meeting time to accommodate his schedule.
Second, be aware of your Priest’s strength and weaknesses (again they are only human). For example, my Pastor hates confrontation. While this makes him very pastoral in many ways, his first reaction might be avoidance. You might suggest that he approach the team with the message that the class feels the program isn’t meeting their needs and it is about the converts and not the teachers. Offer to have one of you to meet with them to express your concerns. Then, give them the curriculum you think meets your needs.

Third, if this all fails, at minimum, ask them to give you the curriculum for the rest of the year. To the extent possible, try to prepare for the subject matter prior to class. A good source that our parish uses is “Catholic and Christian” by Schreck and it parallels close to our curriculum. Additionally, you can compare the curriculum to the curriculum that is commonly covered in other RCIA programs. That which will not be covered in your program will give you areas that you need to supplement on your own. You could even do this in the form of “offline” meetings w/ your class. I belong to a Christian Mens Book Club where we read a book and meet every few weeks to discuss what we have read. You could do this for your “class.” Maybe invite someone you know to be a good Catholic to be a “check” and resource if you get stuck.

Finally, if all else, fails. Read the Schreck book and possibly another book that covers the basics of Catholicism.

I know this all puts alot of responsibility on you. However, the bulk of spiritual development is our responsibility anyway. Unfortunately, you have a greater burden than most. Offer it up to God. He will greatly bless you for your effort. And, you will probably become such an effort, you’ll soon be runnign the RCIA program in your parish. What a blessing this has been for me.

P.S. Be prepared for your current lay teachers/ team members to be hurt. Despite their folly, I’m sure they are well-intentioned. Make sure that you make sure that the message is delivered w/ the tender heart of Jesus.
 
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Jon_S:
God help me! I’d be willing to take advice from any of you who may be able to help. 👍
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Jon, Hang in there. YES, to all who said tell the priest, bishop … whoever will listen…but hang in there. THEN after you get confirmed, go back and volunteer to take over the class and teach it right.
 
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Jon_S:
I have been sitting in RCIA on Sudays. I was born and raised Catholic but, out of respect for the Church, I decided to wait until I felt I was worthy of confirmation. So now I am doing it.
/QUOTE]
get out of this program and find somewhere they teach the CAtholic faith, not new age syncretism and heresy. However, if you wait until you are “worthy” to receive holy communion you will be waiting forever. None of us is worthy, not me, not you, not your priest, not the pope. That is why we pray "Lord, I am not worthy . . . " It is Christ coming to us that makes us worthy of this great gift, we merely prepare the way by tilling the soil so that the Master may plant the seed.
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puzzleannie:
get out of this program and find somewhere they teach the Catholic faith, not new age syncretism and heresy.
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I believe the best way to effect change is from within. Personally (and this is just me) I say Stay and fight.
 
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Jon_S:
These folks have been warned before. The problem is that my parish is small (we live way out nowhere), but I have a plan. I’m going to become a hard-core Catholic and take over the RCIA.

The best way to teach prospective new Catholics is to read the Catechism. Instead we read “Idiots Guide”. That book is weak. They offer Ted Kennedy and Maddona as examples of typical Catholics. That book makes me feel like I’m reading the funny pages. 👍
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Examples of typical Catholics, or typical idiots?
 
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Jon_S:
That book is weak. They offer Ted Kennedy and Maddona as examples of typical Catholics. :
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So let me get this straight.

“Typical” Catholics either attend an Episcopal Church on most weekends instead of Mass, or are into Jewish Mysticism.
 
The “Idiot’s Guide” is horrific, full of errors. Try the “Dummies Guide” written by 2 very orthodox and learned priests, both on EWTN. It even has the Nihil Obstat and the Imprimateur (sp?).

Peace,
Linda
 
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LindaS:
The “Idiot’s Guide” is horrific, full of errors. Try the “Dummies Guide” written by 2 very orthodox and learned priests, both on EWTN. It even has the Nihil Obstat and the Imprimateur (sp?).Peace,Linda
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I am with Linda, it is an excellent book and along with Schreck you won’t go wrong. I am thinking that for some new folks the CCC is excellent but maybe intimidating. I teach RCIA also and when I read these horror stories on the forum my blood boils because the Process done correctly has so much to offer. Maybe the idea of “off-line” meetings with some of the others is a way to go. I am sure these instructors mean well, but I think that an awful lot of the people who received instruction in the Faith after Vatican II were short changed. That is of course no excuse for not getting up to speed before trying to pass your own mis-information on to others. Seems to me that anyone interested in learning more about their Faith would have realized by now that they were out of step with the Church.
 
is a very very very good resource for RCIA. And I mean very good. It was written by John Trijilio You know the web of faith guy.

My Deacon is using it for RCIA and he is a Very obidient in his beliefs to the faith.

Dummies is ROCK SOLID.
 
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Jon_S:
These folks have been warned before. The problem is that my parish is small (we live way out nowhere), but I have a plan. I’m going to become a hard-core Catholic and take over the RCIA.

The best way to teach prospective new Catholics is to read the Catechism. Instead we read “Idiots Guide”. That book is weak. They offer Ted Kennedy and Maddona as examples of typical Catholics. That book makes me feel like I’m reading the funny pages. 👍
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If you would stop looking down your nose at the book, it is very highly regarded in orthodox circles. Every person I know who reads the book is shocked at how much of a punch it packs while still being readable. FYI the hundreds of ccc’s throughout the book mean a reference to the Catechism of The Catholic Church.

Fr. John Trigillio, a co-author, is about as orthodox as you get. He hosts several shows on EWTN (such as Web of Faith). He is also a cooperator of Opus Dei. I know this man personally he is a wonderful priest and general human being.

For what it is worth, the 60’s hippie/liberal priests of our diocese can’t stand him and our AMAZING and orthodox Bishop Kevin Rhoades (who had to build onto Mt. St. Mary’s Seminary when he was rector because it was bursting at the seams) absolutely loves this guy.

You can still be a “Hard-Core” Catholic and enjoy your faith. I agree that some of the statements your catechists have made are ridiculous, but Fr. Trigillio backs you up.

I suggest reading the section of Catholocism for Dummies (pgs 222-224 (women - non-ordination of in the index). He cites Ordinatio Sacredotalis specifically and states that women “Can’t be ordained”.

I suggest you actually read the book with an open mind. You may just find out how well it can help you become a “Hard-Core” and more importantly orthodox Catholic.

Good Luck.
 
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