Reading the Qur’an Through the Bible

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Yes indeed, where is it ~ can we also add where is this in the Bible…

Mary points to Baby Jesus as people ask her how can they talk to a baby… And then, Jesus as an infant speaks…

29 But she pointed to the babe. They said: “How can we talk to one who is a child in the cradle?”

And then, Jesus as an infant speaks…

30 He said: "**I am indeed a servant of Allah. He hath given me revelation and made me a prophet; **
This is from the Infancy Gospel of… Thomas, if I remember correctly.
 
It seems more likely that it is from the Arabic Infancy Gospel, which is a later writing that is based on the Greek or Syriac original Infancy Gospel of Thomas, but the same stories that end up in the Qur’an are in both documents, as far as I can tell.
 
Ok, but where is the palm tree story or reference in the Bible? :confused:
It’s not referenced in the Bible. It’s referenced in extra-biblical gospels and the tradition of the Holy Family’s flight into Egypt.
 
It’s not referenced in the Bible. It’s referenced in extra-biblical gospels and the tradition of the Holy Family’s flight into Egypt.
Can you provide a source or reference for this for me? Thanks.🙂
 
OK, Thanks. I guess I misunderstood your position. I thought you had some sort of confirmation of the Islamic view that Blessed Mother was under the palm tree complaining while in labor. I totally agree with the Flight into Egypt. I believe that it is even listed as one of the Seven Sorrows of Mary (#2).
 
It seems to me that the criticism of Christianity found the the Koran is of Gnostic Christianity. Since Gnosticism was very strong in Alexandria and spread throughout much of super-Saharan Africa, it was the most likely form of Christianity that Mohamed encountered. Many of his criticisms are ones that we would agree with. It also makes historical sense when one considers how quickly Christianity failed in North Africa as Islam expanded. Military conquest does not explain the rapid expansion. Consider for a moment if you were offered the choice between a religion that told you that only an elite few might be saved, and that God was blind, ignorant and cruel; and a religion that said that God was compassionate and cared for everyone, especially the downtrodden.
That was the choice between Gnosticism and Islam.
 
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Siddhartha:
Dear Siddarth, Its impossible to read quran from the Holy Bible, as well other then the prophets which are mentioned in the Quran, nothing seems to meet. Secondly muslims say that the Holy Bible is corrupted, that means its impossible for any comparision,

Other than that, Most of quran although is a copy of Old Testament, changes are made here and there to suit their purposes. Quran also says that they had almost 125000 prophets, but other than the Prophets mentioned in the Holy bible, there are no extra names, neither of Buddha, Krishna, Conficious, and all others.

According to Islam, only the people following the Torah, Holy Bible and Quran, are called the people of the book, but what about others, as from the 125000 prophets, sent, the whole world must be accepted as people of the book, so what is the hidden agenda of Mohhamed followers?

Lastly, Muslims dont believe in crucificiton, and that makes quran completely contradictory to the New Testament. so how can one read the quran thru Holy Bible?
 
There has been good discussion about the Quran here. I noted a few good posts were correct. from jakasaki and jay53. There has been a question about the palm tree, i.e. the birth of Jesus. Please note that there is anothe rmention of the palm tree later when mary was told to shake the trunk of the palm tree. Another mention of Mary as the sister of Aaron. Nobody would believe that Mary was sister of Aaron. I understand this chapter 19 of Quran very well and I can explain a few things.

Please see the verses and their translation. These all need lot of explanation / interpretations.

[19:16] وَاذْكُرْ فِىْ الْـكِتٰبِ مَرْيَمَ‌ۘ اِذِ انتَبَذَتْ مِنْ اَهْلِهَا مَكَانًا شَرْقِيًّاۙ‏

[19:16] And relate the story of Mary as mentioned in the Book. When she withdrew from her people to a place to the east,

[19:17] فَاتَّخَذَتْ مِنْ دُوْنِهِمْ حِجَابًا فَاَرْسَلْنَاۤ اِلَيْهَا رُوْحَنَا فَتَمَثَّلَ لَهَا بَشَرًا سَوِيًّا‏

[19:17] And screened herself off from them, then We sent Our angel to her, and he appeared to her in the form of a perfect man.

[19:18] قَالَتْ اِنِّىْۤ اَعُوْذُ بِالرَّحْمٰنِ مِنْكَ اِنْ كُنْتَ تَقِيًّا‏

[19:18] She said, ‘I seek refuge with the Gracious God from thee if indeed thou dost fear Him.’

[19:20] ‌قَالَ اِنَّمَاۤ اَنَا رَسُوْلُ رَبِّكِ‌ۖ لِاَهَبَ لَـكِ غُلٰمًا زَكِيًّا‏

[19:20] He replied, ‘I am only a Messenger of thy Lord, that I may bestow on thee a righteous son.’

[19:21] قَالَتْ اَنّٰى يَكُوْنُ لِىْ غُلٰمٌ وَّلَمْ يَمْسَسْنِىْ بَشَرٌ وَّلَمْ اَكُ بَغِيًّا‏

[19:21] She said, ‘How can I have a son when no man has touched me, neither have I been unchaste?’

[19:22] قَالَ كَذٰلِكِ‌ۚ قَالَ رَبُّكِ هُوَ عَلَىَّ هَيِّنٌ‌ۚ وَّلِنَجْعَلَهٗۤ اٰيَةً لِّلنَّاسِ وَرَحْمَةً مِّنَّا‌ۚ وَكَانَ اَمْرًا مَّقْضِيًّا‏

[19:22] He replied, ‘Thus it is.’ But says thy Lord, ‘It is easy for Me; and We shall do so that We may make him a Sign unto men, and a mercy from Us, and it is a thing decreed.’

[19:23] فَحَمَلَتْهُ فَانتَبَذَتْ بِهٖ مَكَانًا قَصِيًّا‏

[19:23] So she conceived him, and withdrew with him to a remote place.

[19:24] فَاَجَآءَهَا الْمَخَاضُ اِلٰى جِذْعِ النَّخْلَةِ‌ۚ قَالَتْ يٰلَيْتَنِىْ مِتُّ قَبْلَ هٰذَا وَكُنْتُ نَسْيًا مَّنْسِيًّا‏

[19:24] And the pains of childbirth drove her unto the trunk of a palm-tree. She said, ‘O! would that I had died before this and had become a thing quite forgotten!’​

These verses of the Quran tell beautiful story about Mary and her son Jesus. It is a poetical language, needs to be understood. I will post the meaning in next post. please wait…
 
A good many years back when I started studing Islam, Quran and Mohammad I started with the premiss that He was a prophet of the One True GOD.

My view changed when I saw how the Quran which is not in chronological order became more violent and hateful with each new verse. Mohammad had started out peaceful but became greedy and war like- I thought he was thinking way too much of himself.

So I thought well all men are sinful maybe there is still some good in the Quran- use it as a study guide. The quranic stories are so vague you have to read the Holy Bible to get to the full truth.

Then I realized there is one that would want men to think that a hateful, violent, wishywashy and distant from man allah was in control of the world.

There is one that would want men to believe that Christians worship 3 gods.

There is one that would want to deny that a loving GOD gave a part of HIMSELF to die as one final sacrifice for men’s sins.

Do you realize that the majority of religions have the Golden Rule? Mohammad and the “angel” have added a little twist to Islams. There is one that would want men to believe that you should treat your brothers as yourself- but not your neightbor!!
religioustolerance.org/reciproc.htm

Islam is the handiwork of satan, devil, evil, the fallen angel.
 
Continued…

**[19:16] And relate the story of Mary as mentioned in the Book. When she withdrew from her people to a place to the east, **

Mary was given away to God by her mother before her birth (for that see Quran chapter 3, verses 35, 36, 37). The mother of Mary was pregnant and she thought she will have a son. That she would spare that son to work for God only. But when she delivered, it was a baby girl. She named her Mary…

When Mary was about a few years old, the rmother, according to her promise made with God, took Mary and left her in a temple to the east of her home in some far away city… That temple was in the charge of Zakariyya a.s.
So Mary moved at the very young age to an eastern place. (God knows where !)

[19:17] فَاتَّخَذَتْ مِنْ دُوْنِهِمْ حِجَابًا فَاَرْسَلْنَاۤ اِلَيْهَا رُوْحَنَا فَتَمَثَّلَ لَهَا بَشَرًا سَوِيًّا‏

[19:17] And screened herself off from them, then We sent Our angel to her, and he appeared to her in the form of a perfect man.

Mary was left in the temple for good and did not go back to her parents at all. She was left in the temple permanently. That is the meaning of “screened herself”. While she was in the temple and may have been grown up to about 12 or 13 years of age, she was visited by an angel (Gabriel, that is holy spirit) in some dream (vision). That angel appeared to Mary in the form of a perfect handsome ( lovable ) perfect man.​

[19:18] قَالَتْ اِنِّىْۤ اَعُوْذُ بِالرَّحْمٰنِ مِنْكَ اِنْ كُنْتَ تَقِيًّا‏

[19:18] She said, ‘I seek refuge with the Gracious God from thee if indeed thou dost fear Him.

Mary was very pious. She did not know that it was an angel from God. She could not tolerate the company of any man even in a dream. The Quran is telling that she sought refuge with God from that perfect man and told him also to keep away, if he was a pious person.​

[19:19] ‌قَالَ اِنَّمَاۤ اَنَا رَسُوْلُ رَبِّكِ‌ۖ لِاَهَبَ لَـكِ غُلٰمًا زَكِيًّا‏

**[19:19] He replied, ‘I am only a Messenger of thy Lord, that I may bestow on thee a righteous son.’ **

Thereupon, the angel, the holy spirit, introduced himself as a messenger from her God to give her the good news about an illustrious son for her. That a pious, worthy, righteous son will be born to her…

[19:20] قَالَتْ اَنّٰى يَكُوْنُ لِىْ غُلٰمٌ وَّلَمْ يَمْسَسْنِىْ بَشَرٌ وَّلَمْ اَكُ بَغِيًّا‏

[19:20] She said, ‘How can I have a son when no man has touched me, neither have I been unchaste?’

Mary was old enough to know the matters of birth etc. So she told the angel “How could a son be born to her when no man had touched her.” She said, “She was not married, and she was not any unchaste (rebellous) person.” This was a dialogue between Mary and the angel in a vision only.

Mary told the angel that she could not have any son because she was not yet married and that she was not any misbehaving person.​

[19:21] قَالَ كَذٰلِكِ‌ۚ قَالَ رَبُّكِ هُوَ عَلَىَّ هَيِّنٌ‌ۚ وَّلِنَجْعَلَهٗۤ اٰيَةً لِّلنَّاسِ وَرَحْمَةً مِّنَّا‌ۚ وَكَانَ اَمْرًا مَّقْضِيًّا‏

**[19:21] He replied, ‘Thus it is.’ But says thy Lord, ‘It is easy for Me; and We shall do so that We may make him a Sign unto men, and a mercy from Us, and it is a thing decreed.’ **

The angel said, “It will be as I said.” That The Lord God says it was easy for Him and that He would make him (the son) a sign for all men and means of Mercy from Me (God). The angel said that it was a matter fully decided. It was bound to happen. ( Means that Mary will have a son.)

[19:22] فَحَمَلَتْهُ فَانتَبَذَتْ بِهٖ مَكَانًا قَصِيًّا‏

**[19:22] So she conceived him, and withdrew with him to a remote place. **

So it happened like that.Mary got married. The problems that she had presented before the angel were removed in due course of time. After a few years, she got married and left the temple. She concieved Jesus and went on travel to a far away place.​

[19:23] فَاَجَآءَهَا الْمَخَاضُ اِلٰى جِذْعِ النَّخْلَةِ‌ۚ قَالَتْ يٰلَيْتَنِىْ مِتُّ قَبْلَ هٰذَا وَكُنْتُ نَسْيًا مَّنْسِيًّا‏

**[19:23] And the pains of childbirth drove her unto the trunk of a palm-tree. She said, ‘O! would that I had died before this and had become a thing quite forgotten!’ **

While she was travelling, her husband (Joseph) was with her. She felt the pains of delivery and there was no good place of rest. The child was not delivered near the palm tree. It only shows the bad and helpless condition at the time of delivery. She had no good comfortable facilities available that the ladies like to have at such times.

Muslims take many wrong meanings of the above verses. They say that she was weeping for shame about the birth of a son and that how would she explain that birth. But apparantly, there was no problem at all. Mary’s husband was with her.
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