Responsible procreation, NFP before Fall and just after?

[fpt]

Good reason not to have children…Could that thought have come along with Vatican II??

I know it is the teaching of the church. Every teaching of our church can be traced to the church fathers or the bible. The teaching of having good reason not to have a child however, where does that come from? It is a man made rule given to the people of the church because the people of the Church no longer wanted to have 20 kids. The church had to move with the world and had to give couples some sort of birthcontrol to use. NFP is contraception. It is against conception.

Where in the bible (ancient Testament and new testament) do you find that it was a moral obligation from natural contract and moral duty from the natural institution for couple to have 20 kids or more? Never the catholic Church oblige couple to have many kid?

NFP is one of aspect of responsible procreation. That is not contraception. That one element of natural law concerning couple life.

 

[fpt]

Good reason not to have children…Could that thought have come along with Vatican II??

I know it is the teaching of the church. Every teaching of our church can be traced to the church fathers or the bible. The teaching of having good reason not to have a child however, where does that come from? It is a man made rule given to the people of the church because the people of the Church no longer wanted to have 20 kids. The church had to move with the world and had to give couples some sort of birthcontrol to use. NFP is contraception. It is against conception.

Are you okay with this point of view that is called theoretical providentialism.

theuniversityconcourse.com/article/1915.html

“NFP, while distinguishable from contraception in not being absolutely immoral, is seldom licit and always regrettable.”

“Most married couples (especially in the wealthy West) are perfectly capable of having large families, and most reasons cited for not having large families are bogus.”

“Couples who choose to have large families are making the religiously and morally superior choice.”

“Since selfishness is such a near and present danger, no one should practice NFP without first consulting a priest.”

“The following do not constitute valid reasons for using NFP: wanting to finish your education; wanting to save up for children’s future education; being tired; being stressed; being burdened by debt; having to move; having a small, crowded house; being depressed; feeling overwhelmed, etc.”

Are you okay with those statements that is coming from catholic lay persons

“The natural family regulation is a birth control sinful.”
“The Natural Family Planning is diabolical [Evil].”

“Getting married at age 40, what a shame to lose her virginity at this age.”

“The natural family planning is a concession to human weakness. The ideal is to have sex only when you are happy to have children.”

 

[JimG]

Before all, couple (one man with one woman or one woman with one man, for respect the equality of the dignity of each one), then family is, per se, for God, for each one of spouse and for the fruit of love(children).

For the couple to have children is one of finalities, but each couple has not kids in the first time for the society; that is for the mix beetween God’s plan, for the couple, the family and then at the end the States, nations?

In my point of view, We do not have to emphasize too much procreation in order to protect the States. We must be moderated. How to define moderation???

I’m not sure I understand the question, but to me, moderation–at least in a sociological context, would mean not letting fertility levels fall to a level which threatens the continuance of society. That is where we are headed now, with increasingly below replacement level fertility rates. Depopulation is going to be a lot more worrisome than overpopulation. And once a depopulation trend is in place, it is very hard to turn around. It leads to economic stagnation and social disintegration.