Revolutions and Separation of Church & State

  • Thread starter Thread starter kyleboerner
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
K

kyleboerner

Guest
Hello. I heard a snippet of a really good program on EWTN radio recently. The gentleman was speaking of revolutions, and how they’re a bad thing, not a good thing, as well as the separation of church and state being bad. This got me thinking. Where can I find Catholic Political / Government reading material as to what the Church teaches pertaining to how its followers should engage with politics/government etc.? Does the church believe in the union of church and state, and why, and why does America have the separation of church and state?

I’m sure that I am opening Pandora’s box, but it’s interesting stuff, especially in the heart of political season.

Thank you, and God Bless.

Kyle
 
edwest2 said:
There is no separation of Church and State.

newadvent.org/cathen/14250c.htm

The State is prohibited from establishing a State religion, but recognizes the free exercise of religion in the US.

Ed
Click to expand...
A quote from that link:

“The essential idea of such union is a condition of affairs where a State recognizes its natural and supernatural relation to the Church, professes the Faith, and practises the worship of the Church, protects it, enacts no laws to its hurt, while, in case of necessity and at its instance taking all just and requisite civil measures to forward the Divinely appointed purpose of the Church.”

How on earth can you imply that is anything near the situation in the US? It is directly the opposite.
 
kyleboerner said:
Hello. I heard a snippet of a really good program on EWTN radio recently. The gentleman was speaking of revolutions, and how they’re a bad thing, not a good thing, as well as the separation of church and state being bad. This got me thinking. Where can I find Catholic Political / Government reading material as to what the Church teaches pertaining to how its followers should engage with politics/government etc.? Does the church believe in the union of church and state, and why, and why does America have the separation of church and state?

I’m sure that I am opening Pandora’s box, but it’s interesting stuff, especially in the heart of political season.

Thank you, and God Bless.

Kyle
Click to expand...
You might start with the USCCB website, usccb.org/issues-and-action/faithful-citizenship/index.cfm They have a whole section on political issues.

As to your other questions: 1) I think the Catholic Church has a very nuanced opinion on the integration of church and state: They advocate for the freedom of conscience of people, but then they also advocate for the government to act justly (in accordance with Catholic doctrine). In action, I think those two teachings run afoul with each other.
  1. The US has a separation of church and state because, in England, the King or Queen is also the head of the Church of England. Thomas Jefferson didn’t like that.
 
Jefferson Memorial:

Panel Three

“God who gave us life gave us liberty. Can the liberties of a nation be secure when we have removed a conviction that these liberties are the gift of God? Indeed I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just, that his justice cannot sleep forever. Commerce between master and slave is despotism. Nothing is more certainly written in the book of fate than that these people are to be free. Establish a law for educating the common people. This it is the business of the state and on a general plan.”

And…

Office of the Chaplain
United States House of Representatives

chaplain.house.gov/

Ed
 
The United States has a separation between Church and State because Thomas Jefferson and James Madison (who I hold in higher esteem than Jefferson) knew how much Europe was wrecked by the religious wars that followed the reformation. Also, absolutists European monarchs, such as the English king, had the support of the clergy. Finally, Virginia, where the Anglican Church was dominant, had some religious problems of their own with the newly arrived baptists and their refusal to submit to the Anglican Church.

TL,DR; The seperation of Church and State is a solution to the religious vying for legal privilege.
 
Cheiron said:
The United States has a separation between Church and State because Thomas Jefferson and James Madison (who I hold in higher esteem than Jefferson) knew how much Europe was wrecked by the religious wars that followed the reformation. Also, absolutists European monarchs, such as the English king, had the support of the clergy. Finally, Virginia, where the Anglican Church was dominant, had some religious problems of their own with the newly arrived baptists and their refusal to submit to the Anglican Church.

TL,DR; The seperation of Church and State is a solution to the religious vying for legal privilege.
Click to expand...
The specifics are imposed, in both clauses of the 1st amendment, as limits on government - government may not establish a state church, and government may not limit free exercise. Churches and individual free exercise are independent of government restriction. ( Congress shall pass no law…).
 
JonNC said:
The specifics are imposed, in both clauses of the 1st amendment, as limits on government - government may not establish a state church, and government may not limit free exercise. Churches and individual free exercise are independent of government restriction. ( Congress shall pass no law…).
Click to expand...
Wait, if it’s “Congress shall pass no law”, then can the states have religious mandates?

Also, this is out of left field, but there’s this cool link in the signature. Ahem.
 
XndrK said:
Wait, if it’s “Congress shall pass no law”, then can the states have religious mandates?

Also, this is out of left field, but there’s this cool link in the signature. Ahem.
Click to expand...
14th amendment makes clear that states cannot violate enumerated rights.

Jon
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top