Rock music and the church

[c659smith]

I cannot for any good reason see why more paticipation in this area is not used for evangelizing our Catholic Faith.At events such most christian youth groups attend but do not see our churches at these events. If there is a conflict here with some of the teachings in these songs better we discuss then ignor (from the word ignorant)

CCM is a way to evangelize our Catholic Faith. Here in central Florida every September Universal Studios and Walt Disney World have a Christian Music Weekend blowout. This weekend is filled with approximately 20 to 25 best of the best Amy Grant,Michael Smith, passion band, and the list goes on each night. Alcohol sales are stopped at each of these parks and then hundreds of thousands attend these concerts running from 6pm till the early morning hours.The first time I attended it gave me goose bumps to know Chtristianity is not as dead as the far left would lead us to believe. Our youth do have an extreme sense of Christ and I believe if more catholic priests/Brothers etc. took the time to take their youth groups to these events a deeper appreciation of faith would be attained. One should listen to Rich Mullin and his rendition of the Creed. Yes some are prostestant based and some catholic and our clergy can make a discussion group among our youth groups to explain the difference. Our youth is shrinking within the church and one evangelizes to somewhat of the other,s customs. After all did not the Apostle Paul argue his case with the other Apostles concerning circumcision, food, and many other customs of the Gentiles and win his case to evanglize.We need to go after the youth of America and C.C.M. is an avenue growing within the Amierican culture.This is not gangster hip hop and is a good wholesome family night out that leads us to our Savior. One last item currently check to see how we as Catholics evangelize and meet the customs of other countries Africa, South America, Central America and what music is used. Do you believe the Georgian chant is used there. Get with it.

 

[Scott_Waddell]

It depends on what you mean. If you mean using rock during the mass, absolutely not. There is already too much of an insipid view that the mass is entertainment and not a sacrifice. The use of Catholic CCM for evangelization does not bother me so much although I seriously doubt its power to make real people of faith. Taking pop garbage and christianizing the lyrics is like spraying pine air-freshener after the cat left a present in the box–all you get is an awful combo pine/poop smell.

Scott

 

[the_Hatter]

Scott Waddell:

It depends on what you mean. If you mean using rock during the mass, absolutely not. There is already too much of an insipid view that the mass is entertainment and not a sacrifice. The use of Catholic CCM for evangelization does not bother me so much although I seriously doubt its power to make real people of faith. Taking pop garbage and christianizing the lyrics is like spraying pine air-freshener after the cat left a present in the box–all you get is an awful combo pine/poop smell.

I agree…partially. Rock/pop music should be kept out of the Mass. I almost wish we would just use straight Gregorian Chant instead of the stuff that’s currently in use, but that’s just me. Whenever I go to an Eastern Rite Mass, along with being confused, as the liturgy is quite different, I feel slightly jealous of their music.
And I agree with what was said about pop garbage. The thing is, not all mainstream pop/rock music is garbage. Unfortunately, much of the Christian music that’s popular today (at least what I’ve heard) is completely worthless musically (let’s use something other than a synthesizer, shall we?) and not much better lyrically (variations on “Jesus is my Savior” and various Bible verses). Catholic music, along with Christian, has been bugging me, as it is usually nothing more than renditions of popular Catholic hymns. Bo-ring.
However, bands like Switchfoot are, IMHO, the sort of thing we should be going for. Their lyrics are considerably more imaginative than most CM, and their music is much better, we actually have some real instruments in it. If we could get music of a bit more quality, it could make a considerably powerful evangelization tool. Musc moves the world, man. Along with God.

 

[Primitive]

I use to (rerely any more though) listen to a lot of rock music (heavy metal type stuff). I have to say that the reason that it is not used more to evangelize is because when you take something that is of the world and try to adapt it to fit God, it makes it seem “cheesy” to many youth especially…I know from experience that most (not all) people who listen to rock music think it is strange to evangelize through it, we listen to that sort of music because of the rythm, not the message…we want the message of God to sound Holy and reverant. God is our escape from the world, He is Holy and Divine, and that is how we want to view him, not like a worldly emotional rock song…

Hope this make sense…

 

[Wampa]

Primitive:

I know from experience that most (not all) people who listen to rock music think it is strange to evangelize through it, we listen to that sort of music because of the rythm, not the message…we want the message of God to sound Holy and reverant.

I don’t know. I love rock and heavy metal. While I know plenty of people who like it just for the rhythm, I feel like most go for the lyrics and vocals. I suppose it’s impossible to know for sure what the percentages really are, but I think the content is more important than you think.

In my experience in the world of CM, Protestants own the youth. We’re nowhere to be found. And it disturbs me, too. I think we’re losing ground. Music is one of the most powerful forces in the world.

 

[c659smith]

Has anyone here gone to one of these ccm festivals?

I know I have and as a 48 year old I was absolutely awe struck by the masses. I am not saying that all these artists should be in the mass as part of the music but sooner or later we are not going to have the elderly choir solo’s
Who under 60 sings like that? not in this country

I know that Rich Mullin’s Rendedition of the Creed in the Catholic format is appropriate.

when did the gregorian chant come into the picture? Was this something that was being used by the original church and Christians?

Was it the music of the times?

A beautiful song and will always be with us is the Ave Maria. When was Ave Maria written and what was the music style of the time?

I wonder what the church thought of the music we use now and first brought into the church.

Even the Pope attending the youth rallys is not going to hear the gregorian chant there.

Also what music once again is used at the Spanish, African, Central American, ect. masses?

Lets face it where we are growing as a church is wherre we celebrate the mass according to the customs of that area of the world in keeping with the critical customs and sacred rights of the mass and church.

We do not teach our young the Latin language (dead language) and we do not speak in the language Christ spoke anymore and as such lets not lose our post Vatican 2 followers by them not understanding and being able to paticipate in the celebration of the Mass and other ceremonies.

Who under 60 sings like that? not in this country.

Lets not lose sight of what we as Catholic Christians all sent here by Christ to accomplish and that is spread the word.

 

[Scott_Waddell]

c659smith:

Has anyone here gone to one of these ccm festivals?
I know I have and as a 48 year old I was absolutely awe struck by the masses. I am not saying that all these artists should be in the mass as part of the music but sooner or later we are not going to have the elderly choir solo’s
Who under 60 sings like that? not in this country

I know that Rich Mullin’s Rendedition of the Creed in the Catholic format is appropriate.

Of course many people are awestruck. Music has direct access to the soul. Which is why the Church in its wisdom gives gregorian chant primacy–it is simple, contemplative without distracting, and will not warp the soul. Modern rock music plugs people into the awful and difficult to escape matrix. Plenty of people under 60 sing like that. Almost every high school in the country teaches traditional choir singing.

when did the gregorian chant come into the picture? Was this something that was being used by the original church and Christians? Was it the music of the times?

It is first written down in the 800’s AD but was probably around for several centuries before that. The very early church avoided any music.

A beautiful song and will always be with us is the Ave Maria. When was Ave Maria written and what was the music style of the time?

There are a multitude of Ave Maria songs. The most famous is the Schubert from the romantic period. Schmaltzy and distracting.

Even the Pope attending the youth rallys is not going to hear the gregorian chant there.

Also what music once again is used at the Spanish, African, Central American, ect. masses?

Yes, but that only means that the music is tolerated, not that it is any good or that the primacy of gregorian chant is going to be displaced, and I am willing to bet there is more interest in chant in 3rd world countries than you think.

Lets face it where we are growing as a church is wherre we celebrate the mass according to the customs of that area of the world in keeping with the critical customs and sacred rights of the mass and church.

We do not teach our young the Latin language (dead language) and we do not speak in the language Christ spoke anymore and as such lets not lose our post Vatican 2 followers by them not understanding and being able to paticipate in the celebration of the Mass and other ceremonies.

Latin is and will always be the official language of the Church. You can chant in English by the way.

Lets not lose sight of what we as Catholic Christians all sent here by Christ to accomplish and that is spread the word.

I don’t see the logic that says, “get more rock music in the Church otherwise you are an obstructionist to Christ’s mission”.

Scott

 

[kage_ar]

There is a world of Catholic music out there, from punk to hip hop to metal -

www.catholicmusicnetwork.com

www.phatmass.com

My son loves hip hop, and exploring the Catholic artists in this genre unearthed some SHARED favorites. I sit here with School of the Eucharist by Fr. Stan Fortuna to fire me up at work!

 

[Wampa]

c659smith:

At events such most christian youth groups attend but do not see our churches at these events.

FYI, I don’t think the thread starter ever intended to suggest changes to the Mass. I think the topic is about a lack of Catholic presence within CCM and therefore a lack of evangelizing. I think the Mass changes comment are going off track here. I surely am not suggesting any changes to the Mass.

 

[c659smith]

Scott why is rock (CCM) garbage if the lyrics are done from Scripture and the Psalms. Do you then believe that the hymns and songs over the past 2000 years make real people of faith or is it the difference in beat that bothers you.

Exactly I am not saying that Mass should be a rock concert.

What I am saying is that times change and see where the Catholic Church is expanding and growing. No the Greorgian Chants are not being done on a regular basis in Africa or other 3rd world nations. The Music is native to their country.

Latin Masses are not said in the States and with Vatican 2 is frowned upon as far as I know in the U.S. anyway.

Can you tell me where you have attended a Latin Mass in the United States from start to finish (every word in Latin). Not even on E.W.T.N.

What I am trying to say is do not get rid of the Chant, Latin, the Renassance period , or the Romantic period but also involve the period that you are living in. . We are a 1.2 + billion strong and span over 2000 years.

Do not ignore what is attracting your youth to Christ.

Do not be afraid of new things as Christ makes all things new again.

Let say this, if 50 years ago you were reading a bible or talked about evangelizing 25 years ago you were a bit of a rebel in the church. CCM is here to stay just as much as the Chant was when it started 1200 years ago.

If CCM was to give us a 1000 more priests than it has done it’s job. right

No I am not saying you are an obstructionist but an individualist.Otherwise what is your objection to today’s CCM if it follows scripture, the Psalms, and church teachings except your own personal likes and dislikes for music.Others do not like the Chants and was done for rythm. I do not hear from others to do away with it.