Roman Catholic or Eastern Catholic?

[Luvs2Learn]

Here is a really complex question… I think I have mentioned before in this forum about my dear friend who is contemplating the Catholic church. (she is Orthodox).
Here is the senerio: My Orthodox friend has 3 children. She was not married in the Orthodox church since her husband is not a baptized Christian. (Orthodox don’t allow marriage between Ort. and non-Baptized persons). She never stopped being a practicing Orthodox but she was not really very educated as to the faith as a child and did not realize she had done something wrong until after she was married (protastant ceremony). anyhow, the Orthodox church did allow her to baptize her children since she did attend regulary and obiously wanted to remain with the church. Anyhow, my friends husband took an interest in the Catholic church.(There is no Byzintine parish anywhere near us so they have begun attending our RC parish several months back from time to time). A few months back her husband decided to enroll in RCIA at our Parish.My friend has decided that after her husband converts at Easter Vigial she too will make her profession of Faith and become Catholic. Here is the sticky part, where no one seems able to give her an accurate answer… If she converts, and her minor children (all are age 7 and under) convert through the parents profession of faith do her children become Latin (Roman) rite Catholics or do they become Byzintine Catholic the sui iuis church of their original baptizm? Their Father would now be Roman catholic and the mother Eastern Catholic, and I was under the impression that amongst Catholic families the children rite is that of the Father. But in this case the children have already been baptized, communed, and confirmed, in the Eastern Orthodox church which would make them easten Catholics? my friend has been jumping through hoops trying to find out the true and correct outcome of this situation. anyone know the answer ???

 

[puzzleannie]

HereIf she converts, and her minor children (all are age 7 and under) convert through the parents profession of faith do her children become Latin (Roman) rite Catholics or do they become Byzintine Catholic the sui iuis church of their original baptizm? Their Father would now be Roman catholic and the mother Eastern Catholic, and I was under the impression that amongst Catholic families the children rite is that of the Father. But in this case the children have already been baptized, communed, and confirmed, in the Eastern Orthodox church which would make them easten Catholics? my friend has been jumping through hoops trying to find out the true and correct outcome of this situation. anyone know the answer ???

this is something that should be brought to the bishop’s office for his ruling, and the pastor is the one to do this, early in process, as the whole Easter vigil thing may not be appropriate for this family. You are right, it is complex. My knee jerk reaction is the children belong in the rite corresponding to their Orthodox church but I, and probably most RCIA directors, are not competent to decide this.

 

[malphono]

Normally, she would indeed technically become a member of the corresponding Church sui juris. However, if I read this correctly, the bottom line is that the lady wishes to make her “profession of faith” and join the Latin Church. If my reading is correct, I would suggest she simply make her intention known to the Byzantine bishop as well as to the Latin bishop. I am not a canon lawyer, but in so doing, she should be able to effect the change of Church sui juris concurrently with her profession of faith. The minor children would follow her change, but according to the CCEO they would have the option of reverting to whichever Byzantine Church is involved at their 14th birthday.

 

[cameron_lansing]

I would endorse puzzleannie’s recommendation to refer this to the diocesan bishop. There are additional unexplored possibilities, and in my estimation, it is not helpful to speculate.

 

[5Loaves]

Had she made a profession of faith in a Latin Church and simply become enrolled as a Catholic in the corresponding Church sui juris before her husband became a catechumen then I think their children likewise would automatically be enrolled in the same (Eastern) Church sui juris. However catechumens have special rights and I’m not sure how those would impact his (catechumen/husband) children. I would definitely encourage her to contact the diocese. It would be very sad to have this family lose their patrimony having received all three of the Sacraments of Initiation as Orthodox Christians, no matter how weak the catechesis etc before and since seems to have been. Lack of a local Eastern Catholic parish isn’t a good reason for changing rites.

Maybe Deacon John Cameron will turn up with more information.
LOL I see he just posted.

 

[5Loaves]

I would endorse puzzleannie’s recommendation to refer this to the diocesan bishop. There are additional unexplored possibilities, and in my estimation, it is not helpful to speculate.

If the DRE has been the go-between with the Diocese on this up to now, and theoretically s/he should have been working on it, it may not be intentional but all this “jumping through hoops” and “no one seems able to give her an accurate answer” may be related to the DRE being it that go-between role with the Diocese. Not that it’s intentional but few DREs and parish priests have any idea about the implications of this conversion from Orthodoxy. I really think mom has a right and responsibility to be in touch herself with the Diocese . Would you agree or think otherwise, Deacon?
Easter is fast approaching.

 

[aspirant]

My friend has decided that after her husband converts at Easter Vigial she too will make her profession of Faith and become Catholic.

She and her children, if they become Catholic, will be received into the Catholic Church corresponding to the Orthodox Church in which they were baptized (e.g. if Ukranian Orthodox then Ukranian Catholic), even if they are received at a Latin Catholic parish.

If she and the children wish to become Latin Catholics, or if her husband wishes to become Eastern Catholic, that change will probably not be difficult. (Of course, the latter would be most easily accomplished if the husband was simply baptized into the Eastern Catholic Church to which the rest of his family would belong.)

If she converts, and her minor children (all are age 7 and under) convert through the parents profession of faith do her children become Latin (Roman) rite Catholics or do they become Byzintine Catholic the sui iuis church of their original baptizm?

The latter.

I was under the impression that amongst Catholic families the children rite is that of the Father.

If they were being baptized after their father, and the parents did not both request that they follow their mother, that would happen. But you are talking about people baptized before their father. They already belong to a Church.

If your friend needs more help, I would recommend that she contact a Catholic priest. If he is ill-informed about the relevant canon law, she might think about consulting a canon lawyer.

 

[cameron_lansing]

. I really think mom has a right and responsibility to be in touch herself with the Diocese . Would you agree or think otherwise, Deacon?
Easter is fast approaching.

I do recommend that and observe that the most likely place to find canon lawyers would be in some office of a diocese. The advantage is that the situation can be resolved rather quickly and efficiently after some basic questions (which have not been asked in this thread) are used to clarify the facts. Those with a proper knowledge of the law are inclined to establish facts with some certainty before offering opinion on a particular case. After all, jurisprudence is the application of the law to a concrete circumstance.

 

[Diak]

I would agree with Deacon John - being a UGCC deacon myself and having been in the middle of several complicated cases at some point both the appropriate Eastern Catholic and Latin Catholic chanceries are going to have to come to an agreement.

 

[Luvs2Learn]

Thank you for all of the helpful responses. I will relay the suggestions to my friend. And let you all know the results when we find out…