Same-sex marraige: honestly, what is the point?

[gracepoole]

I see you’ve chosen the “avoid the truth” option.

I can’t imagine how that’s a response to the question I asked.

 

[The_GreyPilgrim]

The only point of gay marriage is to destroy traditional marriage. That is the very aim of the GLBT community and has even been admitted by an openly gay journalist.

In reality there is no point, practical or otherwise, to destroy the lives of millions of people just to appease the sensibilities of a fractionally small segment of the population.

If their end is, by their own admission, not about equality but about destruction of the institution, then they don’t deserve to have their way. Period.

 

[kanrok]

I can’t imagine how that’s a response to the question I asked.

Of everyone in this thread, you certainly would be able to identify a non-answer.

Anybody else wish to take a crack at the question I posed?

Here is it again:

“What benefit is there to society to promote sodomy?”

I’ll wait.

God knows I’ve been waiting a good long time so far!

 

[livingwordunity]

I fully appreciate the benefits of authentic marriage.

I see no benefiit to society in promoting sodomy. Zero.

What benefit do you see to society in promoting sodomy?

You still have not answered the question.

 

[kanrok]

The only point of gay marriage is to destroy traditional marriage. That is the very aim of the GLBT community and has even been admitted by an openly gay journalist.

In reality there is no point, practical or otherwise, to destroy the lives of millions of people just to appease the sensibilities of a fractionally small segment of the population.

If their end is, by their own admission, not about equality but about destruction of the institution, then they don’t deserve to have their way. Period.

Yep.

I only wish those who self identify as “Catholic” would have the sense to acknowledge this truth.

What I fail to understand is how those who claim Catholicism as their religion can be so ignorant of Catholic doctrine on this issue.

 

[The_GreyPilgrim]

Yep.

I only wish those who self identify as “Catholic” would have the sense to acknowledge this truth.

What I fail to understand is how those who claim Catholicism as their religion can be so ignorant of Catholic doctrine on this issue.

It just proves that our brothers and sisters need to be re-evangelized. Soft heads are just as much as an evil as hard hearts.

 

[FireFromHeaven]

It just proves that our brothers and sisters need to be re-evangelized. Soft heads are just as much as an evil as hard hearts.

Indeed. It reminds me of a quote I heard somewhere on the web. “An open mind is a fortress with its gates unbarred and unguarded.” Let’s all agree to at least guard the gates.

 

[kanrok]

It just proves that our brothers and sisters need to be re-evangelized. Soft heads are just as much as an evil as hard hearts.

I think I’ll steal that last line.

I have often said that many Catholics are poorly catechized, but supporting same sex “marriage” is in willful ignorance territory.

I pray for them.

 

[gracepoole]

Yep.

I only wish those who self identify as “Catholic” would have the sense to acknowledge this truth.

What I fail to understand is how those who claim Catholicism as their religion can be so ignorant of Catholic doctrine on this issue.

I, for one, am not ignorant of Catholic doctrine, though I can’t speak for others. I “claim” Catholicism as my religion because it is. My apologies, as that seems to be unsettling for you. It’s a shame, though, that you’re unable to identify the benefits of marriage for communities. Marriage is a social contract. It is also a sacrament. This seems to be the rub for many Catholics. One needn’t be in favor of Catholic gay marriage in order to see the benefits of civil same-sex marriage.

 

[Monkey1976]

I, for one, am not ignorant of Catholic doctrine, though I can’t speak for others. I “claim” Catholicism as my religion because it is. My apologies, as that seems to be unsettling for you. It’s a shame, though, that you’re unable to identify the benefits of marriage for communities. Marriage is a social contract. It is also a sacrament. This seems to be the rub for many Catholics. One needn’t be in favor of Catholic gay marriage in order to see the benefits of civil same-sex marriage.

To publicly call oneself Catholic is to proclaim that one adheres to all the Church teaches. The Church teaches that homosexual activity is grave matter that, if left unrepented, will result in eternal damnation. Supporting same-sex “marriages” or “civil unions” is implicitly telling those who enter into such legal fictions to go ahead and continue engaging in homosexual activities. The Church teaches us to treat those who bear the cross of same-sex attraction with love and respect - not give them a bus ticket to Hell.

 

[josh987654321]

One needn’t be in favor of Catholic gay marriage in order to see the benefits of civil same-sex marriage.

Don’t you see how contradictory this statement is?

Catechism of the Catholic Church

CCC 2357 Homosexuality refers to relations between men or between women who experience an exclusive or predominant sexual attraction toward persons of the same sex. It has taken a great variety of forms through the centuries and in different cultures. Its psychological genesis remains largely unexplained. Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity,141 tradition has always declared that "homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered."142 They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved.

My question would be, if you see the sexual acts of homosexuality as immoral, than why would you try and advocate and embrace that form of sexuality for others? it would seem a bit heartless of you and if you don’t see the sexual acts of homosexuality as immoral than why? If you see such acts as immoral in your faith and you seclude your faith and advocate the exact opposite of your faith for society, that’s hardly living your faith is it? that’s more condemning your faith if your knowingly doing it.

God Bless

Thank you for reading
Josh

 

[The_GreyPilgrim]

I, for one, am not ignorant of Catholic doctrine, though I can’t speak for others. I “claim” Catholicism as my religion because it is. My apologies, as that seems to be unsettling for you. It’s a shame, though, that you’re unable to identify the benefits of marriage for communities. Marriage is a social contract. It is also a sacrament. This seems to be the rub for many Catholics. One needn’t be in favor of Catholic gay marriage in order to see the benefits of civil same-sex marriage.

Grace do you know what the definition of “good” is?

Do you know what the definition of “sin” is?

It’s simple. Good, in the moral imperative, means that it is according to the design of God.

Sin, in the classic hebrew definition of the word, literally means “to miss the mark.” In the religious moral sense, to sin is to act in any way not in accord with the good, or according to God’s plan and purpose.

It’s real simple, there is no way that gay marriage is in accord with the plan or purpose of marriage. It does not benefit the couple couple to right virtue, it does not produce children, nor does it properly bond the individuals in their complementary roles of parents. It doesn’t foster devotion or the healthy rearing of children. And it scandalizes other married couples to false ideas and impressions of the truth.

Its not a mere contract, nor can it ever be. It in every way is a deprivation of the good.

 

[josh987654321]

To publicly call oneself Catholic is to proclaim that one adheres to all the Church teaches. The Church teaches that homosexual activity is grave matter that, if left unrepented, will result in eternal damnation. Supporting same-sex “marriages” or “civil unions” is implicitly telling those who enter into such legal fictions to go ahead and continue engaging in homosexual activities. The Church teaches us to treat those who bear the cross of same-sex attraction with love and respect - not give them a bus ticket to Hell.

I don’t understand how people could seclude their faith, their beliefs, that’s like believing that theft is wrong and than encouraging others to steal, it’s nonsensical.

 

[jonathan_hili]

I’m new to this…but I assume you don’t consider in-vitro fertilization or adoption as the same outcome…i.e. children for parents? Also, in terms of women, they are fertile and with donated sperm can conceive.

So I must conclude that the assumption here is that only when pregnancy comes from a man and a woman via regular sex, that all the conditions are met?

OK, but it would seem that for many, many gay couples who choose never to have kids that the issue is being able to legally share in all that they do, make, evolve as a team

Hi, thanks for the comments.

I guess even in in-vitro fertilisation you still need a man and a woman. My big beef with in-vitro (most particularly in these instances) is that it treats human beings as having instrumental rather than inherent value, and again deprives the child of a natural mother or father. As for adoption, it’s obviously a different case, and I wouldn’t use it as a basis for defending same-sex marriage. After all, brothers and sisters can adopt, so can they also get married? Obviously not.

The moral conditions are met when procreation takes place in a natural and good way. Men and women can have sex and procreate under all sorts of conditions, e.g. rape or while stoned, but we wouldn’t say that that is morally good.

The fact of the matter is that a gay couple cannot have children without some gross violation of the natural law (i.e. in the process using one person as a means to an end). Certainly, they can adopt, but that’s not the same thing.

 

[kanrok]

To publicly call oneself Catholic is to proclaim that one adheres to all the Church teaches. The Church teaches that homosexual activity is grave matter that, if left unrepented, will result in eternal damnation. Supporting same-sex “marriages” or “civil unions” is implicitly telling those who enter into such legal fictions to go ahead and continue engaging in homosexual activities. The Church teaches us to treat those who bear the cross of same-sex attraction with love and respect - not give them a bus ticket to Hell.

This is the truth.

It may be a hard truth, but it is the truth nonetheless.

Those who claim Catholicism and support gay “marriage” are fomenting scandal and placing themselves and others in grave danger of losing their salvation.

 

[fix]

I, for one, am not ignorant of Catholic doctrine, though I can’t speak for others. I “claim” Catholicism as my religion because it is. My apologies, as that seems to be unsettling for you. It’s a shame, though, that you’re unable to identify the benefits of marriage for communities. Marriage is a social contract. It is also a sacrament. This seems to be the rub for many Catholics. One needn’t be in favor of Catholic gay marriage in order to see the benefits of civil same-sex marriage.

Pretending to separate marriage into true marriage and false marriage and then claiming benefits to society for false marriage is not only contrary to the Catholic faith but nonsensical.