Sin and forgiveness

[steve99]

Hi,

I understand that the Eastern Orthodox have a different perspective on sin and forgiveness to Western Catholics. We tend to be focussed on legalistic terms like guilt, punishment, expiation. EOs tend to be more focussed on God as Father and reconciliation with our Father. “Punishment” is not something external but a consequence on us of the sin.

How does Eastern Catholicism view these things? Eastern Catholics presumably believe in original sin and purgatory - which EOs don’t. But how do you view sin, forgiveness, punishment, reparation reconciliation etc. Do you have a different perspective to Western Catholics?

I realise that’s a big topic but perhaps you could give me some thoughts.

 

[PriestGrrl]

Hey there! I really like the perspective of the Eastern Orthodox. I think it’s important that reconciliation is a blessing because our God is such a loving wonderful God, that She just wants to embrace us in her loving care. Mind you, much of the connotation of reconciliation is tradition with a little “t” as opposed to Tradition… So it isn’t a pillar of our faith to think of reconciliation as a time to be punished and feel guilty.

The beautiful part about this is that it’s great to be able to see the holy and true in other faith traditions, whether they are Protestant, Orthodox, or our fellow Catholics!

This is such a wonderful thread! Thanks!

 

[Pitcharan]

I share below some personal thoughts based on my many ponderings. They have not been theologically vetted and therefore unfit for publication but okay for discussion

… EOs tend to be more focussed on God as Father and reconciliation with our Father. “Punishment” is not something external but a consequence on us of the sin.

EO view is in line with ancient beliefs during OT times and very similar to the “Hindu karma theory” of reaping what you sow: sin begets sin, love begets love, forgiveness begets forgiveness. Our Lord too taught this. It is true that sin has certain irreversible negative consequences just like how love has its irreversible positive outcomes. The best example is that of David who repented and gained God’s pardon for His sin against Uriah the Hittite; nevertheless suffered for the same exactly as God had decreed.

…Catholics presumably believe in original sin and purgatory - which EOs don’t. But how do you view sin, forgiveness, punishment, reparation reconciliation etc. Do you have a different perspective to Western Catholics? I realise that’s a big topic but perhaps you could give me some thoughts.

The consequence or price paid for comitting a sin, can itself be the expiation or purgation, provided there is also true repentance. Both repentance and expiation are pre-requisites for salvation (or rather divinisation)

 

[mardukm]

Dear brother Steve,

Hi,

I understand that the Eastern Orthodox have a different perspective on sin and forgiveness to Western Catholics. We tend to be focussed on legalistic terms like guilt, punishment, expiation. EOs tend to be more focussed on God as Father and reconciliation with our Father. “Punishment” is not something external but a consequence on us of the sin.

How does Eastern Catholicism view these things? Eastern Catholics presumably believe in original sin and purgatory - which EOs don’t. But how do you view sin, forgiveness, punishment, reparation reconciliation etc. Do you have a different perspective to Western Catholics?

I realise that’s a big topic but perhaps you could give me some thoughts.

Could you please explain what you understand by the term “legalistic?” And could you also please explain how guilt, punishment, and expiation are “legalistic?”

Blessings

P.S. Sorry I haven’t been around, everyone. I don’t expect to be back again until another three weeks.

 

[Phillip_Rolfes]

Hi,

I understand that the Eastern Orthodox have a different perspective on sin and forgiveness to Western Catholics. We tend to be focussed on legalistic terms like guilt, punishment, expiation. EOs tend to be more focussed on God as Father and reconciliation with our Father. “Punishment” is not something external but a consequence on us of the sin.

How does Eastern Catholicism view these things? Eastern Catholics presumably believe in original sin and purgatory - which EOs don’t. But how do you view sin, forgiveness, punishment, reparation reconciliation etc. Do you have a different perspective to Western Catholics?

I realise that’s a big topic but perhaps you could give me some thoughts.

Eastern Catholic of the Byzantine tradition hold the same view as Eastern Orthodox of the Byzantine tradition. Not all Easterners are “Byzantine,” however. So you’ll find that some of the other non-Byzantine Eastern and Oriental Catholics and Orthodox do actually hold a similar view to Roman Catholics (look forward to Marduk’s comments in a few weeks. He always has great things to say! ).

As to Eastern (Byzantine) Orthodox and Catholics, some believe in original sin and purgatory, others don’t. All have some concept of a “theosis” that goes on even after death, but we tend not to speculate on it too much because it’s so steeped in theologumena and nothing definitive. There are many different understanding of original sin, from an actual physical taint of the soul and the notion of inherited guilt to an abstract state of fallen nature. In the Catechism of the Catholic Church Rome rejected the idea of a physical taint and inherited guilt, but it does stay sort of close to those ideas. Do a google search for the blog “Byzantine Ramblings.” The Melkite priest who runs it has been doing a series of meditations on the first chapters of Genesis. Coverage of the original sin/ancestral sin will be included.