Sins nailed to the cross? eternal security?

[thedevotionman]

This is a response I sent to a site who proclaimed that all sins were nailed to the cross.
Mark

There are somegood insights see what what you think.

Sins nailed to the Cross? Eternal Security?

Col 2:13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
(my response) Past trespasses only!
Col 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
(my response) ordinances are NOT SINS! This verse also refers to Romans, (works or deeds of the law) Rom 3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight…
1 Pet 2:24 Who bore our transgressions in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by WHOSE STRIPES You WERE HEALED.
(my response) Yes we were Healed, but what about new SINS?
Matt 6:11 Give us this day our daily bread. Indicating that the prayer should be said daily! And the next verse is asking the The Heavenly Father to forgive our SINS daily!
Matt 6:12 And forgive us our trespasses…
1 John 2:1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
We must have “free will” the posibility of commiting sin or John would not write this verse the Holy Ghost would not have inspired it!
1 Pet 4:8 And above all things have fervent charity among yourselves: for charity shall cover the multitude of sins. What SINS Were they not all nailed to the Cross?
Rom 6:14&15 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace. What then? SHALL WE SIN, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
Agian we have the ability to choose to sin!
IF ALL OF ALL OF OUR SINS WERE NAILED TO THE CROSS THESE VERSES MAKE NO SENSE AT ALL!
And this makes good sense since Genisis 3:5 says, For God doth know that in the day you eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.

Did Jesus Christ Himself HAVE ETERNAL SECURITY?
Matt 4:1 Then was Jesus led up of the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted of the devil.
(my response) Jesus could not have been tempted unless it were posible for Hime to consent, He did not consent, thanks be to God, but He could Have!
Matt 6:13 And lead us not into temptation…
(my response) It is also posible for us to consent to temptation& sin!
JESUS CHRIST DID NOT HAVE ETERNAL SECURITY & WE DO NOT HAVE ETERNAL SECURITY EITHER!

We also have a free will to chose to abide with Jesus or not!
John 15:5 I am the vine, you [are] the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
1Jo 3:6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.
Hebrews 10:26
For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth…
St. John 8:30-32
Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If you continue in my word, then are you my disciples indeed; And you shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.”
In Revelation 3:5 Jesus speaks of some people getting their names blotted out of the book of life.

 

[Salvatore123]

Sir,

What you cite reflects how poorly (and I don’t mean YOU - I mean in general) Catholics today are schooled in basic theology.

Even now, I asked the “Religion Coordinator” at one of my children’s schools what he thought was Christ’s purpose on earth, and the man had no clue. And my money, through tuition, goes to pay his salary.

Catholics - unlike protestants - divide “our saving” into two distinct acts:

1. Only Christ could redeem the breach between man and God that was committed by Adam and Eve. As such, it was an objective act that no mere man could do.
2. The second part of being “saved”, however, DOES depend on man. Remember the passage that we should “work out our salvation in fear and trembling”. That does not sound like “once saved, always saved”, or “Christ died for our sins, so we are all saved once we accept him as our ‘personal lord and savior’”.

Whether we wanted it our not, Christ’s death opened the gates of Heaven, which had been closed since the first sin. Even atheists get that benefit.

But we still have the “salvation” part to work on - and that requires OUR participation and work and cooperation. Contrary to what Luther and others claimed - our Church has never infallibly taught that we can “work our way into heaven”. But, in doing good works, along with our faith, God infuses our souls with grace so that when we die, we hope to die without mortal sin on our soul, and with the least amount of venial sin so as to enter Heaven from Purgatory as “quickly” (“time” has no real relevance in the afterlife) as possible.

It is a mystery how God can know who will be saved, and yet allow us to have complete freedom as to how we will act AND be able to change our actions at any time before death. It is though “watching” two trains rushing together on the same track and we know they will crash and what it will probably look like upon impact, but something may somehow prevent the crash (one training jumping the rails). God sees our future, knows our future, yet we are in control of our future.

It is a very hard thing to grasp, and it is, indeed, mysterious. But we cannot surrender our beliefs so that we walk around thinking “I am already part of the elect” or “I am not part of the elect”, so what I do will make no difference if the future is set. We MUST act as though we fear and tremble regarding our salvation. To believe “once saved, always saved” is the height of arrogance, vanity, and presumptuousness.

 

[COPLAND_3]

The OP has all the signs of being a pseudo-Catholic trying to get Catholics to “think outside of the box.” I don’t like that stuff, I prefer to have someone not try to trick me into listening to their side. IF you want to debate it out then cut the deception and just make a case. This forum welcomes it, unlike many Protestant forums that won’t let their brethren get challenged by visiting Catholics.

OP, take off the mask and come as who you are and then give an intellectually honest case.

 

[jerry_kelso]

This is a response I sent to a site who proclaimed that all sins were nailed to the cross.
Mark

There are somegood insights see what what you think.

Sins nailed to the Cross? Eternal Security?

Col 2:13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
(my response) Past trespasses only!
Col 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
(my response) ordinances are NOT SINS! This verse also refers to Romans, (works or deeds of the law) Rom 3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight…
1 Pet 2:24 Who bore our transgressions in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by WHOSE STRIPES You WERE HEALED.
(my response) Yes we were Healed, but what about new SINS?
Matt 6:11 Give us this day our daily bread. Indicating that the prayer should be said daily! And the next verse is asking the The Heavenly Father to forgive our SINS daily!
Matt 6:12 And forgive us our trespasses…
1 John 2:1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
We must have “free will” the posibility of commiting sin or John would not write this verse the Holy Ghost would not have inspired it!
1 Pet 4:8 And above all things have fervent charity among yourselves: for charity shall cover the multitude of sins. What SINS Were they not all nailed to the Cross?
Rom 6:14&15 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace. What then? SHALL WE SIN, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
Agian we have the ability to choose to sin!
IF ALL OF ALL OF OUR SINS WERE NAILED TO THE CROSS THESE VERSES MAKE NO SENSE AT ALL!
And this makes good sense since Genisis 3:5 says, For God doth know that in the day you eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.

Did Jesus Christ Himself HAVE ETERNAL SECURITY?
Matt 4:1 Then was Jesus led up of the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted of the devil.
(my response) Jesus could not have been tempted unless it were posible for Hime to consent, He did not consent, thanks be to God, but He could Have!
Matt 6:13 And lead us not into temptation…
(my response) It is also posible for us to consent to temptation& sin!
JESUS CHRIST DID NOT HAVE ETERNAL SECURITY & WE DO NOT HAVE ETERNAL SECURITY EITHER!

We also have a free will to chose to abide with Jesus or not!
John 15:5 I am the vine, you [are] the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
1Jo 3:6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.
Hebrews 10:26
For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth…
St. John 8:30-32
Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If you continue in my word, then are you my disciples indeed; And you shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.”
In Revelation 3:5 Jesus speaks of some people getting their names blotted out of the book of life./QUOTE
Devotionman,
When one makes the statement nailed sins to the cross is an idiom to reference sins debt and it’s ransom was reconciled as in 2 Corinthians 5:17-21. Sin had to be rectified by the perfect lamb who was slain.
The debt of sin had to be atoned for in full before man could be given the opportunity to believe in him through the new covenant.
We are eternally secure by obedience from love through grace which produces the fruits of righteous living. A christian is at risk when he begins to play around with sin and continues to live carnal instead of trying to be reconciled to God then he risk losing his salvation. The new covenant has better promises to help achieve easier access to the throne of God instead of going through a priest, and greater power of the spirit without measure and yet it holds a higher bar than the old Mosaic covenant. This is why the cardinal ordinances had to be nailed to the cross and done away with. The civil law of the mosaic law was done away and Paul said in Timothy it was for the lawless. The moral law was done away according to the mosaic ethic that had specific blessings and cursings. Under the mosaic law if you committed adultery you were killed. Today, adultery is still wrong but there is no civil law to put us to death.
The old covenant had to be done away so the new covenant could come in it’s place. God Bless! Jerry kelso