"Sins of the father..."

[Lexee15]

Can someone tell me where I might find this text in Scripture, goes something like this…“The sins of the father will be visited upon the son” or something like that . Also, what does it mean and if it’s literal isn’t it something like karma ? Should I be overly concerned about my son since the sins of his mother and father have been great…especially his father’s, and they don’t seem to be getting any better :banghead: ? I do worry alot that my son will somehow suffer for the sins that we’ve committed and continue to commit (his father’s infidelities, addictions, lies, etc. and everything that I’ve done and failed to do). I don’t want him to suffer for what we’ve done .

 

[Todd_Easton]

Such phrases about multi-generational punishment for sin do appear in several places in the early books of Old Testament, including:
Exodus 20:5
Exodus 34:7
Numbers 14:18
Deuteronomy 5:9
However, there are places in the later books of the Old Testament that indicate that this multi-generational punishment no longer applies, including:
Jeremiah 31:29
Ezekiel 18:1-32

 

[Mystophilus]

Todd Easton:

Lexee15:

I don’t want him to suffer for what we’ve done.

Ezekiel 18:1-32

As referenced: You ask: “Why is not the son charged with the guilt of his father?” Because the son has done what is right and just, and has been careful to observe all my statutes, he shall surely live. Only the one who sins shall die. The son shall not be charged with the guilt of his father, nor shall the father be charged with the guilt of his son. The virtuous man’s virtue shall be his own, as the wicked man’s wickedness shall be his own. But if the wicked man turns away from all the sins he committed, if he keeps all my statutes and does what is right and just, he shall surely live, he shall not die. None of the crimes he committed shall be remembered against him; he shall live because of the virtue he has practiced.

Do I indeed derive any pleasure from the death of the wicked? says the Lord GOD. Do I not rather rejoice when he turns from his evil way that he may live? And if the virtuous man turns from the path of virtue to do evil, the same kind of abominable things that the wicked man does, can he do this and still live? None of his virtuous deeds shall be remembered, because he has broken faith and committed sin; because of this, he shall die.

You say, “The LORD’S way is not fair!” Hear now, house of Israel: Is it my way that is unfair, or rather, are not your ways unfair? When a virtuous man turns away from virtue to commit iniquity, and dies, it is because of the iniquity he committed that he must die. But if a wicked man, turning from the wickedness he has committed, does what is right and just, he shall preserve his life; since he has turned away from all the sins which he committed, he shall surely live, he shall not die.

And yet the house of Israel says, “The LORD’S way is not fair!” Is it my way that is not fair, house of Israel, or rather, is it not that your ways are not fair? Therefore I will judge you, house of Israel, each one according to his ways, says the Lord GOD.

Turn and be converted from all your crimes, that they may be no cause of guilt for you. Cast away from you all the crimes you have committed, and make for yourselves a new heart and a new spirit. Why should you die, O house of Israel?

For I have no pleasure in the death of anyone who dies, says the Lord GOD. Return and live! (Ezekiel 18: 19-32).

 

[Lexee15]

Todd Easton:

However, there are places in the later books of the Old Testament that indicate that this multi-generational punishment no longer applies, including:
Jeremiah 31:29
Ezekiel 18:1-32

Well, that makes me feel better, that each one of us will answer for our own actions. I may not have asked the question correctly . What I mean is if the father or mother has decided to take the wrong path and doesn’t do the right things, go on through life not really suffering any real consequences here on earth for their actions…child grows up and decides to take the same path or a worse one than the parent…parent may or may not have repented, may or may not have raised the child in a loving, faithfilled, God loving environment. Could the parent then suffer and live the consequences of their actions watching their child make the same mistakes? That’s kind of how I took the Bible text, maybe I understood it incorrectly, but the question still stands, could the consequence of our bad behavior be living to see our child or someone we love live a sinful life, perhaps the one we lived even before they were born?

 

[Lexee15]

Okay, does anyone have anything for me? Opinions? All comments appreciated .

 

[Onion]

Lexee15:

Okay, does anyone have anything for me? Opinions? All comments appreciated.

From personal experience, it’s simply impossible to judge what someone will do with the circumstances presented to them. If you were looking to draw it back to a faith based argument, the overriding principle that applies in this case is that of free will. If your decisions, mistakes and the consequences of your life are pre-determined, you simply cannot make any decisions in your life whatsoever.

Some people believe in a form of “pseudo-Karma” regardless of their religious observances, the concept that you’ll get what’s coming to you in this life, good or bad, and that good or bad things happen as a result of your own actions or other peoples, as completely indirect consequences of your own actions. With all due respect, I consider that idea to be an utter crock.

The question your asking is based upon two things - choice and circumstance. Using the example you’ve given, I’ve seen guys who’ve been afforded every opportunity in life, with loving parents, stable childhoods and the benefit of some of the largest, richest catholic schools in the world to attend f*** themselves up on drugs. In particular, one of the guys I went to school with was selling himself to keep his drug habit going well before he graduated.

Conversely, I’ve seen people come from the opposite end of the spectrum, with alcoholic and abusive parents and childhoods spent close to abject poverty go on to lead healthy, stable lives with loving families. My father would be the foremost among these examples.

You can cite different circumstances as being favorable or unfavorable in anyone’s growth and development as a person, you can say that they were influenced by this, or deterred by that, you can bring up their brain chemistry, the faith they adhere to, hell, you can bring in nonsense as trivial and inconsequential as how long they were breast fed for and how they did in toilet training if you’re enough of a crackpot to believe in some of the dumber the theories espoused by conventional psychology.

At the end of the day, they make their own damn decisions, for good or ill. All you can do as a parent is be honest with your children. Tell them about the mistakes you made, WHY you regret them, and what you want for them. As your children grow up, you’re going to be faced with the challenge of accepting them as capable of making their own decisions rather than having to protect them from exposure to dangerous ideas. Give them the benefit of your experience, and trust them to do what’s right. There’s quite simply nothing else that can be done with any degree of success.