So why does the Catholic Church use the Tyndale version of the Lord's Prayer

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“forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us”, didn’t they execute Tyndale for paraphrasing the bible, why does the Catholic Church use his version in prayer. I’ve looked in all pretty much all catholic bibles and they say debts not trespasses.
 
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“And we must remember that this was not merely a translation of Scripture. His text included a prologue and notes that were so full of contempt for the Catholic Church and the clergy that no one could mistake his obvious agenda and prejudice. Did the Catholic Church condemn this version of the Bible? Of course it did.”
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“The secular authorities condemned it as well. Anglicans are among the many today who laud Tyndale as the “father of the English Bible.” But it was their own founder, King Henry VIII, who in 1531 declared that “the translation of the Scripture corrupted by William Tyndale should be utterly expelled, rejected, and put away out of the hands of the people.””
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“Ultimately, it was the secular authorities that proved to be the end for Tyndale. He was arrested and tried (and sentenced to die) in the court of the Holy Roman Emperor in 1536. His translation of the Bible was heretical because it contained heretical ideas—not because the act of translation was heretical in and of itself. In fact, the Catholic Church would produce a translation of the Bible into English a few years later (The Douay-Reims version, whose New Testament was released in 1582 and whose Old Testament was released in 1609).”
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As for English translations of the Lord’s Prayer, it comes from the Latin Vulgate, not Tyndale. The Latin is:
“6:12 et dimitte nobis debita nostra, sicut et nos dimittimus debitoribus nostris.”
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Which pretty well lines up with “and forgive us our debts, as we forgive those who trespass against us”.
 
The article on “The Lord’s Prayer” in the Catholic Encyclopedia says, in part:
With regard to the English text now in use among Catholics, we may note that this is derived not from the Rheims Testament but from a version imposed upon England in the reign of Henry VIII, and employed in the 1549 and 1552 editions of the “Book of Common Prayer”. From this our present Catholic text differs only in two very slight particulars: “Which art” has been modernized into “who art”, and “in earth” into “on earth”.

The version itself, which accords pretty closely with the translation in Tyndale’s New Testament, no doubt owed its general acceptance to an ordinance of 1541 according to which “his Grace perceiving now the great diversity of the translations (of the Pater noster etc.) hath willed them all to be taken up, and instead of them hath caused an uniform translation of the said Pater noster, Ave, Creed, etc. to be set forth, willing all his loving subjects to learn and use the same and straitly commanding all parsons, vicars and curates to read and teach the same to their parishioners”.
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Jaxonwelch99 said:
“forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us”, didn’t they execute Tyndale for paraphrasing the bible, why does the Catholic Church use his version in prayer. I’ve looked in all pretty much all catholic bibles and they say debts not trespasses.
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Tyndale version, Matthew 6:9-13
O oure father which arte in heve halowed be thy name. Let thy kyngdome come. Thy wyll be fulfilled as well in erth as it ys in heven. Geve vs this daye oure dayly breede. And forgeve vs oure treaspases eve as we forgeve oure trespacers. And leade vs not into teptacion: but delyver vs fro evell.
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Some Catholic approved versions use “wrongs”.

Good News Translation
‘Our Father in heaven:
May your holy name be honored;
may your Kingdom come;
may your will be done on earth as it is in heaven.
Give us today the food we need.
Forgive us the wrongs we have done,
as we forgive the wrongs that others have done to us.
Do not bring us to hard testing,
but keep us safe from the Evil One.
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Contemporary English Version
Our Father in heaven,
help us to honor
your name.
Come and set up
your kingdom,
so that everyone on earth
will obey you,
as you are obeyed
in heaven.
Give us our food for today.
Forgive us for doing wrong,
as we forgive others.
Keep us from being tempted
and protect us from evil.
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The term “debts” is better for at least three reasons.

1 - It is literally how it is written in the Bible as Our Lord taught, and each word was carefully chosen by Him.

2 - For thousands of years the Church has prayed this way. This is called Tradition.

3 - The term “debt” is more perfect because it denotes the idea of Justice. Everytime someone trespasses/offends, they not only damage someone (including God) but they also start owing a retribution to the damaged. So the prayer teaches us to forgive not merely the trespasses against us but also the debt due to us.
 
Jesus apparently considered either acceptable.

Luke 11:2-4 “Father, hallowed be thy name. Thy kingdom come. Give us each day our daily bread; and forgive us our sins, for we ourselves forgive every one who is indebted to us; and lead us not into temptation.”
NIV, RSV, KJV
 
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When my jurisdiction (Pittsburgh/Ruthenian) revised the Divine Liturgy a couple of years ago, they actually commented on the translation of the Lord’s Prayer.

They noted that better translations were available (particularly noting that “deliver us from the evil one” would be more accurate), but that the common transition pre-date the (so-called) reformation, and is a source of Christian unity among English speaking Christians.
 
I was doing some googling to see how the Church has handled this issue in other languages. Four languages to start with:

Italian and Spanish both stick to “our debts” and “our debtors,” in line with the Latin words used in the TLM:

• (Latin) Dimitte nobis debita nostra, sicut et nos dimittimus debitoribus nostris
• (Italian) Rimetti a noi i nostri debiti come noi li rimettiamo ai nostri debitori
• (Spanish) Perdónanos nuestras deudas así como nosotros perdonamos a nuestros deudores

French and Portuguese, on the other hand, change those words to “our offenses” and “those that have offended against us”:

• (French) Pardonne-nous nos offenses, comme nous pardonnons aussi à ceux qui nous ont offensés
• (Portuguese) Perdoai-nos as nossas ofensas assim como nós perdoamos a quem nos tem ofendido

I didn’t find any explanation. My guess is that, quite simply, “debt” and “debtor” are readily understood as metaphors for owing a debt of moral reparation of some kind, rather than a material debt expressed in cash, in some languages but not in others.
 
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I’ve been wondering for some time if this is not a way of nodding to saint Luke’s version of the Our Father, which has a different word here from the Matthean version. Luke’s word means “sin” while Matthew’s means “debt”. Translating with “offenses” could maybe be seen as a way of acknowledging the Lucanian version, which is probably easier to understand for us today than the word “debt” in that particular context, in an otherwise very Matthean text.
 
dochawk said:
When my jurisdiction (Pittsburgh/Ruthenian) revised the Divine Liturgy a couple of years ago, they actually commented on the translation of the Lord’s Prayer.

They noted that better translations were available (particularly noting that “deliver us from the evil one” would be more accurate), but that the common transition pre-date the (so-called) reformation, and is a source of Christian unity among English speaking Christians.
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I find it refreshing that, in the midst of all our division, Christians of all stripes can find at least this one thing to agree on. Protestants add the doxology, we don’t, but aside from that, to have one prayer we can all say in common, is a very good thing.
 
I suspect that liturgists don’t find Luke a good model to follow, because his version, unlike Matthew’s, uses two linguistically unrelated terms: Forgive us our sins, as we forgive our debtors. It’s more expressive when the words are the same (or almost the same, a clearly related noun and verb) in both halves of the petition. As many commentators have pointed out, this is the only one of the seven petitions that Jesus makes conditional: God won’t forgive us unless we forgive others. Using different words, as Luke does, tends to obscure this conditionality.
 
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Particularly interesting is how to translate “daily”. This is also the word used in the Missal.

But the original Greek and the Vulgate say “supersubstantial”
 
I like Luke’s version because it makes clear that “sin” is the only thing for which we need God’s (“Our Father’s”) forgiveness.
 
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