Some Questions

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  1. Jesus said to enter the narrow path. Isn’t the estimate of Roman Catholics one billion? Can someone explain (Catholicism is the second biggest religion and once was the biggest).
  2. Do you pray to saints, or ask them to pray for you?
  3. Why do Catholic bow to icons and statues? What happened to worship “in spirit and truth”? Also, what about the commandment?
 
  1. Jesus said to enter the narrow path. Isn’t the estimate of Roman Catholics one billion? Can someone explain (Catholicism is the second biggest religion and once was the biggest).
1 billion people out of 6 billion people is still only about 17% of the world. That said, no Catholic is under the impression that their Catholicism alone gets them into heaven. We don’t believe in “once saved, always saved” like many Protestant denominations. A Catholic is perfectly capable of losing their salvation, and many Catholics are “cultural Catholics”, or Catholics in name only. In other words, they were raised Catholics and still identify with the faith, but don’t really practice. So, the actual number of Catholics going to heaven will be FAR smaller than 1 billion.

Also keep in mind that from the Catholic point of view, it is possible for non-Catholics to get to heaven as well, although it would be more difficult.
  1. Do you pray to saints, or ask them to pray for you?
When I teach this concept in my college Western Civilization classes, I phrase it something likes this.
  1. If you are a Christian, have you ever asked your congregation to pray for an intention, like a sick relative? The answer is that most likely, you have. Your whole congregation, together, prays aloud for the person to get better (or whatever the intention is). Is this problematic?
  2. As a Christian, do you believe in eternal life, whether it be in heaven or hell? For MOST Christian denominations, this is a key element of the faith. It is critical that we understand that when we die, we do not simply cease to exist, but continue on, thanks to the saving power of Christ. Death no longer has any power over us.
  3. So… if people do not cease to exist, and it’s ok to ask for a group of living people to pray together, why wouldn’t it be ok to ask both the living AND the dead to pray for our intentions?
Look at two famous Catholic prayers:

In the Hail Mary, we say “Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray FOR us sinners, now and at the hour of our death. Amen.” We are not praying TO her as much as we are asking her to pray WITH us and FOR us.

Now, look at the Penitential Rite of the Mass, which you will hear every week in church:

“And I ask Blessed Mary, ever Virgin,
All the angels and saints,
and you, my brothers and sisters,
to pray FOR me to the Lord our God.”

Catholics consider prayer so important, that here, we are actually asking the whole of creation to join us in prayer, including both the living, the dead, and even the angels and saints! This serves as a reminder that we are a part of a larger creation, and helps foster Christian unity.
  1. Why do Catholic bow to icons and statues? What happened to worship “in spirit and truth”? Also, what about the commandment?
Also remember that this is a common practice among the 400,000,000 or so Orthodox Christians as well. One of the keys here is that these are not “graven images”; in other words, they are not “false” gods like Baal or the golden calf. Another important point is that we are not praying TO the icon or statue, but rather, using it as a focal point for our prayer to GOD. If we were actually worshiping the statue or icon as if it WAS a god itself, with its own power, that would be different.
 
  1. Then why do I see Catholics (some on here even) say “Pray to [saint]”. I’m confused…
  2. Doesn’t that show that our faith and spirit are weak?
 
  1. Then why do I see Catholics (some on here even) say “Pray to [saint]”. I’m confused…
Language changes over time. For example, Latin used to be the language of the Roman Empire. However, when the empire collapsed, people in different regions of Europe became isolated. Much like today, different regions developed their own slang and dialects. Eventually, over hundreds of years, these regional variations became SO different that they evolved into completely new languages. These languages based on Latin are called the “Romance” languages, not because they are romantic (although some are quite lovely), but because they originated from the language of “Rome” - ROMEantic languages! These include languages like Italian, French, Spanish, Portuguese, Romanian, and Catalan.

As another example of this, English evolved from a completely different language group, the Germanic language group. Think about how hard it is to read Shakespeare today. We sometimes think that this was simply how the elite spoke back then; it was just difficult and for the educated. However, Shakespeare wrote for COMMON people. This is how EVERYONE spoke. That’s how much our language has changed in just 500 years. And if you go back another 500 years, to around 1000 AD, English is so different that it becomes just about impossible to read our own language! As an example, here’s the first few lines of Beowulf in “Old” English:

HWÆT, WE GAR-DEna in geardagum,
þeodcyninga þrym gefrunon,
hu ða æþelingas ellen fremedon!
oft Scyld Scefing sceaþena þreatum,
monegum mægþum meodosetla ofteah,
egsode eorlas, syððanærest wearð
feasceaft funden; he þæs frofre gebad,
weox under wolcnum weorðmyndum þah,
oð þæt him æghwylc ymbsittendra
ofer hronrade hyran scolde,
gomban gyldan; þæt wæs god cyning!
Ðæm eafera wæs æfter cenned
geong in geardum, þone God sende
folce to frofre; fyrenðearfe ongeat,
þe hie ær drugon aldorlease
lange hwile; him þæs Liffrea,
wuldres Wealdend woroldare forgeaf,
Beowulf wæs breme — blæd wide sprang—
Scyldes eafera Scedelandum in.

So, did you get any of that? (Maybe a few words, like under, him, and God…) That’s our OWN LANGUAGE 1000 years ago!

Now, why did I go into all of this, pray tell…?

Have you heard that expression before - “pray tell”?
This was a common expression in Shakespeare’s time, about 500 years ago. You see, the meaning of the word “pray” used to be much more general. The word “pray” actually simply means “to ask”. When I say, “pray tell”, I’m obviously not praying to you, I’m just ASKING you something. Even today, you may still hear a lawyer “pray” that a jury find the right conclusion in a court case. But today, the usage has evolved and changed in many parts of the world. Many people, especially Protestants, reserve the word as something ONLY directed toward God, when in fact, they simply misunderstand other, older usages of the term. So, when a Catholic “prays to a saint”, they are “asking” for their intercession. They are “asking” them to join them in communicating their intentions to God, in the Shakespearean definition of the term.
  1. Doesn’t that show that our faith and spirit are weak?
Was the spirit of God weak when he commanded that statues of angels be placed on top of the Ark of the Covenant? The use of images IS allowed in the Bible.

Further, we are not bowing to the statues. Catholics do genuflect in front of the tabernacle, since this is where the Precious Body and Blood of God is kept (Communion, which we actually, TRULY believe is God in the flesh). They also bow to the altar, just as the Jews did, since it is the place of sacrifice. In other parts of the church, we kneel to pray.
 
  1. Jesus said to enter the narrow path. Isn’t the estimate of Roman Catholics one billion? Can someone explain (Catholicism is the second biggest religion and once was the biggest).
There are over a billion people calling themselves Catholic, yes. Most of whom are far from practicing the faith in the manner Jesus has asked us to.

Most follow a very worldly path that is the opposite of the ‘straight and narrow’, ignoring Church teachings on such sins as contraception and abortion, divorce and remarriage, homosexuality, attending church infrequently if at all, and so on.
  1. Do you pray to saints, or ask them to pray for you?
Both! “pray” just means to ask. So we ask them to ask Jesus and the Father for certain things on our behalf.
Why do Catholic bow to icons and statues? What happened to worship “in spirit and truth”? Also, what about the commandment?
It’s a gesture of simple respect, as opposed to worship. Jacob bowed seven times to Esau his brother, you can be sure he wasn’t worshipping Esau in any way!

Which commandment? The one against graven images? Remember it comes from the same God who then turned around and commanded that images be used - not just in the temple but on the very ark of the covenant itself.

Do you think people bowed before the Ark and the carved cherubim on top? It was considered to be His throne, who wouldn’t bow before the Throne of God? Were they worshipping the angels - or the Ark - in bowing before it? Nope.
 
  1. Jesus said to enter the narrow path. Isn’t the estimate of Roman Catholics one billion?
Nevermind Catholics… what about all Christians? There’s even more Christians than there are Catholics! But the point is, just calling yourself a Christian or a Catholic doesn’t mean you’re actually on the narrow path. There are weeds among the tares, as Christ said.
  1. Do you pray to saints, or ask them to pray for you?
Both. I pray to the saints to ask them to pray for me. Prayer is not worship, it is conversation. To “pray” means to “ask” or “beseech”.
  1. Why do Catholic bow to icons and statues? What happened to worship “in spirit and truth”? Also, what about the commandment?
God said: “You shall not make for yourself a graven image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; you shall not bow down to them or serve them.” (Ex. 20:4-5)

We do not “bow to” icons and statues. We bow or kneel or pray in the presence of icons and statues, but that does not mean we are bowing or kneeling or praying to the icon or statue itself. We certainly do venerate icons and statues (that is, we give honor to the person or persons represented by the icon or statue), but we do not worship or adore them. If you have ever thought of something or even said something aloud while looking at the picture of a loved one, you know what I mean. You don’t actually expect the picture to respond, do you? The picture of your loved one is not an idol, is it?!

What does “worship in spirit and truth” mean to you? Does “truth” mean “non-bodily, non-physical”? But Jesus came in the flesh. Worship in spirit and truth has to recognize the spiritual and the natural/physical. This is why Catholic worship includes things you can see, smell, taste, touch, and hear: because God became Incarnate. Our worship – which is Divine Worship – must reflect that reality.
 
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