Something out of nothing?

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This is a really basic question which I’m sure has a simple answer: how was the universe created out of nothing? “Nothing” cannot produce “something” by definition: it is empty, it cannot produce. Therefore, God didn’t really create the universe from “nothing”; he created it from Himself, and He would have to be eternally existing.

I dunno what I’m trying to get at here; if someone could just clarify that famous first chapter of Genesis it would help me out a lot.
 
Jack, God created the universe out of nothing that pre-existed ourside Himself. Therefore in this sense He created the universe out of nothing. He created the universe of time and matter from within Himself, He who always and ever shall exist.
 
The simple answer is that God is not limited in any way. You and I can’t create something out of nothing, which only prooves [in case there was any doubt] that we aren’t God.

The ancient creation stories are fascinating: the common thread seems to have been struggle. Seeing the vastness of the world, it was reasonably assumed that enormous effort must have been expended. In some cultures, the gods labor, in others they battle great giants [with no explanation of who made the giants], defeat them, build the world from the corpses.

The Hebrew God is different. Not merely in his singular nature, but in his infinite power, existing outside time and space.

Instead of strife and labor, he creates the universe with a word-- ‘Let there be light!’ in English, ‘Fiat Lux!’ in Latin, but in Hebrew, simpler still: ‘Light!’ spoken as a command. Such beauty, such insight…

And while ‘other’ gods take for ever to create, God needs only 6 days to forge every star, fill the seas, light the sun, fashion each plant and animal.

Now, I’m not a hard core, 6 days of 24 hours each creationist. But Genesis offers great wisdom about the Nature of God, and the nature of man. Sadly, that seems to be lost in the wrangling over pressing issues about Adam’s belly button.

But back to the original question: how can something come from nothing? The Judeo-Christian answer is that with God, all things are possible.

But maybe that would be a better question to ask the scientists: they’ve put a lot of thought into how the big bang went bang. How a universe where change was impossible became a universe where change is inevitable.

So far as I can tell, their answers are no more verifiable [and less plausible] than the existence of God
 
I think I understand what you’re saying now. Thanks for clearing things up; I know it’s a very minor point, just something I was thinking about.

He “created something out of nothing” in that He created something where there was nothing before, but the creation didn’t extend from the nothingness: it extended from Himself.
 
God didn’t create the universe from Himself. If He did, that would imply that he had parts (using some ‘part’ of himself to build the universe) and that he is divisible. But God is simple and indivisible.

God used no pre-existing ‘stuff’ out of which to create. That’s what we mean by saying he creates ‘from nothing.’ He simply willed the universe to be.

There is a corollary. If I ‘create’ something using pre-existing material, and then walk away from it, my creation is held in existence by the material out of which it is made.

Thus, if I make a sculpture and leave it, it is held in existence by the stone out of which it is made. If I make a desk, it is held in existence by the wood.

Since God creates from nothing, if He walks away from his creation, it is held in existence by…nothing.
 
JimG said:
God didn’t create the universe from Himself. If He did, that would imply that he had parts (using some ‘part’ of himself to build the universe) and that he is divisible. But God is simple and indivisible.
Click to expand...
I agree,

Here’s an idea:

From human sexuality,
we know that
union is a creative act.

Since a logical contradiction,
implies nonexistence
then
existence and nonexistence
is nonexistence

Since God is
existence and love
and love unites
and the universe exists,
then
existence overpowers nonexistence
by union

Just as good overpowers evil

Just as
God must unite
with human suffering
to defeat it.
 
Psychotheosophy said:
Since a logical contradiction,
implies nonexistence
then
existence and nonexistence
is nonexistence

Since God is
existence and love
and love unites
and the universe exists,
then
existence overpowers nonexistence
by union

Just as good overpowers evil
Click to expand...
Please correct me if I error…

St. Thomas states:

God is existence
God is love

My Opinion:

Since a logical contradiction,
implies nonexistence
then
existence and nonexistence
is nonexistence

Since God is
existence and love
and love unites
and the universe exists,
then
existence overpowers nonexistence
by union
 
I remember reading something about this in the stanford enyclopedia of philosophy, an atheist viewpoint and a christian (catholic) viewpoint.
 
If we dream of Heaven in this life…
When we get to Heaven “for real”…
Will it be a dream or reality?

And what will this life then be when looking from Heaven?
Perhaps, only a dream.

I bring these two states to the table because one we call ‘real’ and one we call ‘imagined’ (not real).

We have to define “something” and “nothing”…
And from what Perspective.

We say there is nothing between the Earth and the Moon (just nothingness, open space)… but still know there is 250,000 miles there (and time to travel it). So, in that empty nothing, I have just put a quarter of a million miles.

Is that something out of nothing?

Also, there is something else there in that nothingness. What creates the tides to rise? Gravity from the Moon.

If the Sun did not have enough Gravity to hold the Earth in a super fast circular orbit, we would of spun out past Pluto long ago.
Yet how can Gravity exist in a nothingness of open space?

So in that ‘nothingness’, there is something. We can not see it, but we can see it’s effects… and we may be able to create instruments to ‘detect’ it also. So why do we say the only reality in the universe are the ‘objects’ in it (stars, planets, etc), and not all the ‘nothing’ without objects… that has something to it?

And I believe the Good Lord gave us a way to detect Him in creating us. Even though He is (to us) more like open space or nothingness, He is something, He is real, He is there… Or am I just dreaming???
 
Dan_Michael said:
If we dream of Heaven in this life…
When we get to Heaven “for real”…
Will it be a dream or reality?

And what will this life then be when looking from Heaven?
Perhaps, only a dream.

I bring these two states to the table because one we call ‘real’ and one we call ‘imagined’ (not real).

We have to define “something” and “nothing”…
And from what Perspective.

We say there is nothing between the Earth and the Moon (just nothingness, open space)… but still know there is 250,000 miles there (and time to travel it). So, in that empty nothing, I have just put a quarter of a million miles.

Is that something out of nothing?

Also, there is something else there in that nothingness. What creates the tides to rise? Gravity from the Moon.

If the Sun did not have enough Gravity to hold the Earth in a super fast circular orbit, we would of spun out past Pluto long ago.
Yet how can Gravity exist in a nothingness of open space?

So in that ‘nothingness’, there is something. We can not see it, but we can see it’s effects… and we may be able to create instruments to ‘detect’ it also. So why do we say the only reality in the universe are the ‘objects’ in it (stars, planets, etc), and not all the ‘nothing’ without objects… that has something to it?

And I believe the Good Lord gave us a way to detect Him in creating us. Even though He is (to us) more like open space or nothingness, He is something, He is real, He is there… Or am I just dreaming???
Click to expand...
God is real, and your insights are correct.

When we speak of creation out of nothing however, we really do mean nothing: no space, no time, no gravity, no dark matter, nothing pre-existing. Except God. And He does not create something out of the substance of Himself. So the only thing remaining is nothing. God says “Let there be light,” and there is light. It is not made from a preexisting substance. It is created from nothing, by God’s will.

It’s quite true that empty space is not empty. But space itself is part of creation.
 
Jack_245814 said:
This is a really basic question which I’m sure has a simple answer: how was the universe created out of nothing? “Nothing” cannot produce “something” by definition: it is empty, it cannot produce. Therefore, God didn’t really create the universe from “nothing”; he created it from Himself, and He would have to be eternally existing.

I dunno what I’m trying to get at here; if someone could just clarify that famous first chapter of Genesis it would help me out a lot.
Click to expand...
Creation from nothing is Catholic doctrine. 🙂
 
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