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Capuchin
Guest
Has anyone ever heard of something called the Sovereign Masonic religion and what do you know about it? Thanks.
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SPOKENWORD
Guest
Whatever it is , Masonic religion is anti Christ.
God Bless
J
jamesclaude
Guest
Spokenword beat me to this thread - kudos to ya, Spoken - ( “Anti-Christ” is one of his favorite words ! )
“Sovereign” as a branch of freemasonry ? Never heard of it. The word “sovereign” somes up as a courtesy title for the leaders in national Scottish Rite bodies - it also has useage in the York Rite ( York Rite Sovereign College ) - and that’s about all I know as a studious mason.
May I ask: Where did YOU hear about it ?
As a more progressive option to spokenword, cestusdei, and others who go out of their dear little way to berate and “expose” freemasonry, an interesting site regarding anti-catholicism and freemasonry is:
www.masonicinfo.com/anticatholic.htm
also: www.masonicinfo.com/KofC.htm for Knights of Columbus who wonder what the awful Masons are saying about 'em !
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PaulDupre
Guest
As a 3rd degree K of C for the last 4 years, I have never heard any mention of Masons. I doubt that most Knights have any knowledge about other fraternal organizations. But I would not be surprised if there are certain things common to all. Just that fact that the K of C has 4 “degrees” (signifying Charity, Unity, Fraternity and Patriotism) is significant. We don’t have grips and passwords and stuff, though - just rosaries and membership cards.
Paul
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St.James
Guest
“Religion”, because Freemasonry is a religion, regardless of what the propaganda states.
“Sovereign”, because Freemasonry is an authority unto itself in which the members swear allegiance to Masonry above all else–other religious faiths, government, family, one’s occupation, one’s civic duties–everything is secondary to one’s Masonic allegiance. This is clearly laid out in the Masonic oaths beginning with the first degree.
This, among many other reasons, is why the Roman Catholic Church has always opposed Freemasonry and forbidden Catholics from membership in Masonic organizations.
There is a book that is a collection of letters written by John Quincy Adams called “Letters on Freemasonry” which deals with this topic in great depth.
From New Advent.
What is the Catholic Church’s official position on Freemasonry? Are Catholics free to become Freemasons?
Freemasonry is incompatible with the Catholic faith. Freemasonry teaches a naturalistic religion that espouses indifferentism, the position that a person can be equally pleasing to God while remaining in any religion.
Masonry is a parallel religion to Christianity. The New Catholic Encyclopedia states, “Freemasonry displays all the elements of religion, and as such it becomes a rival to the religion of the Gospel. It includes temples and altars, prayers, a moral code, worship, vestments, feast days, the promise of reward and punishment in the afterlife, a hierarchy, and initiative and burial rites” (vol. 6, p. 137).
Masonry is also a secret society. Its initiates subscribe to secret blood oaths that are contrary to Christian morals. The prospective Mason swears that if he ever reveals the secrets of Masonry–secrets which are trivial and already well-known–he wills to be subject to self-mutilation or to gruesome execution.
Historically, one of Masonry’s primary objectives has been the destruction of the Catholic Church; this is especially true of Freemasonry as it has existed in certain European countries. In the United States, Freemasonry is often little more than a social club, but it still espouses a naturalistic religion that contradicts orthodox Christianity.
The Church has imposed the penalty of excommunication on Catholics who become Freemasons. The penalty of excommunication for joining the Masonic Lodge was explicit in the 1917 code of canon law (canon 2335), and it is implicit in the 1983 code (canon 1374). Because the revised code of canon law is not explicit on this point, some drew the mistaken conclusion that the Church’s prohibition of Freemasonry had been dropped. As a result of this confusion, shortly before the 1983 code was promulgated, the Sacred Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith issued a statement indicating that the penalty was still in force. This statement was dated November 26, 1983 and may be found in Origins 13/27 (Nov. 15, 1983), 450.
“Sovereign”, because Freemasonry is an authority unto itself in which the members swear allegiance to Masonry above all else–other religious faiths, government, family, one’s occupation, one’s civic duties–everything is secondary to one’s Masonic allegiance. This is clearly laid out in the Masonic oaths beginning with the first degree.
This, among many other reasons, is why the Roman Catholic Church has always opposed Freemasonry and forbidden Catholics from membership in Masonic organizations.
There is a book that is a collection of letters written by John Quincy Adams called “Letters on Freemasonry” which deals with this topic in great depth.
From New Advent.
What is the Catholic Church’s official position on Freemasonry? Are Catholics free to become Freemasons?
Freemasonry is incompatible with the Catholic faith. Freemasonry teaches a naturalistic religion that espouses indifferentism, the position that a person can be equally pleasing to God while remaining in any religion.
Masonry is a parallel religion to Christianity. The New Catholic Encyclopedia states, “Freemasonry displays all the elements of religion, and as such it becomes a rival to the religion of the Gospel. It includes temples and altars, prayers, a moral code, worship, vestments, feast days, the promise of reward and punishment in the afterlife, a hierarchy, and initiative and burial rites” (vol. 6, p. 137).
Masonry is also a secret society. Its initiates subscribe to secret blood oaths that are contrary to Christian morals. The prospective Mason swears that if he ever reveals the secrets of Masonry–secrets which are trivial and already well-known–he wills to be subject to self-mutilation or to gruesome execution.
Historically, one of Masonry’s primary objectives has been the destruction of the Catholic Church; this is especially true of Freemasonry as it has existed in certain European countries. In the United States, Freemasonry is often little more than a social club, but it still espouses a naturalistic religion that contradicts orthodox Christianity.
The Church has imposed the penalty of excommunication on Catholics who become Freemasons. The penalty of excommunication for joining the Masonic Lodge was explicit in the 1917 code of canon law (canon 2335), and it is implicit in the 1983 code (canon 1374). Because the revised code of canon law is not explicit on this point, some drew the mistaken conclusion that the Church’s prohibition of Freemasonry had been dropped. As a result of this confusion, shortly before the 1983 code was promulgated, the Sacred Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith issued a statement indicating that the penalty was still in force. This statement was dated November 26, 1983 and may be found in Origins 13/27 (Nov. 15, 1983), 450.
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jamesclaude
Guest
St. James:
Before the candidate takes upon himself the obligation - in not only the first, but the second and third degrees of the blue lodge - it is explained to him that everything he is about to agree to will not violate his duty to God, his family, his country or himself.
Please produce this ritual book that you are quoting. There should be a publishing house and author printed in it for proper citation.
It irks me when people get on a wild-eyed tangent and make things up in order to scare people to death.
I just answered a similar posting to St. James under “Freemasonry - why isn’t it warned about?” - same tangent - a mix of truth, half-truths and downright nonsense.
As a Mason and a Christian I have never berated the Catholic Church nor has that attitude been taught to me in the 4 or 5 appendant bodies of freemasonry to which I currently belong- in 25 years of active membership.
Are you satisfied and smug to simply embrace what St.James zealously peddles on here without investigating it to see for yourself ?
ARE the masons another religion ?
www.masonicinfo.com/religion.htm
HOW do we feel about Catholicism ?
www.masonicinfo.com/anticatholic.htm
WHAT is the history behind the distrust of church and masonry ?
I don’t think that you will be excommunicated or disciplined for reading - is that allowed ? It’s a lot better than hearsay and fabricated quotes…
Utter balderdash !
Before the candidate takes upon himself the obligation - in not only the first, but the second and third degrees of the blue lodge - it is explained to him that everything he is about to agree to will not violate his duty to God, his family, his country or himself.
Please produce this ritual book that you are quoting. There should be a publishing house and author printed in it for proper citation.
It irks me when people get on a wild-eyed tangent and make things up in order to scare people to death.
I just answered a similar posting to St. James under “Freemasonry - why isn’t it warned about?” - same tangent - a mix of truth, half-truths and downright nonsense.
As a Mason and a Christian I have never berated the Catholic Church nor has that attitude been taught to me in the 4 or 5 appendant bodies of freemasonry to which I currently belong- in 25 years of active membership.
Are you satisfied and smug to simply embrace what St.James zealously peddles on here without investigating it to see for yourself ?
ARE the masons another religion ?
www.masonicinfo.com/religion.htm
HOW do we feel about Catholicism ?
www.masonicinfo.com/anticatholic.htm
WHAT is the history behind the distrust of church and masonry ?
I don’t think that you will be excommunicated or disciplined for reading - is that allowed ? It’s a lot better than hearsay and fabricated quotes…
S
St.James
Guest
I recommend reading “John Quincy Adams’ Letters on Freemasonry.” It’s available at Amazon, Barnes & Noble etc.
John Quincy Adams explains very clearly why Masonic oaths conflict with Christian beliefs and one’s civic duties.
Also, one can easily confirm these things in the Freemasons own literature. I would discourage anyone from placing any trust in the information found at Freemason websites, they are sources of propaganda and cover up what is written in the actual literature. Freemasonry thrives on deception.
“The Blue Degrees are but the portico (porch) of the Temple. Part of the symbols are displayed there to the initiate, but he is intentionally misled by false interpretations. It is not intended that he shall understand them; but it is intended that he shall imagine that he understands them. Their true explication (explanation / understanding) is reserved for the Adepts, the Princes of Masonry.” Albert Pike, “Morals and Dogma,” 30th Degree, p. 819
If the Freemasons of higher degrees intentionally mislead their own initiates, what chance is there that they would be honest with Catholics?
“You must conceal all crimes of your brother Masons…and should you be summoned as a witness against a brother Mason be always sure to shield him…It may be perjury to do this, it is true, but you’re keeping your obligations.” Ronayne, “Handbook of Masonry.” p. 183
John Quincy Adams explains very clearly why Masonic oaths conflict with Christian beliefs and one’s civic duties.
Also, one can easily confirm these things in the Freemasons own literature. I would discourage anyone from placing any trust in the information found at Freemason websites, they are sources of propaganda and cover up what is written in the actual literature. Freemasonry thrives on deception.
“The Blue Degrees are but the portico (porch) of the Temple. Part of the symbols are displayed there to the initiate, but he is intentionally misled by false interpretations. It is not intended that he shall understand them; but it is intended that he shall imagine that he understands them. Their true explication (explanation / understanding) is reserved for the Adepts, the Princes of Masonry.” Albert Pike, “Morals and Dogma,” 30th Degree, p. 819
If the Freemasons of higher degrees intentionally mislead their own initiates, what chance is there that they would be honest with Catholics?
“You must conceal all crimes of your brother Masons…and should you be summoned as a witness against a brother Mason be always sure to shield him…It may be perjury to do this, it is true, but you’re keeping your obligations.” Ronayne, “Handbook of Masonry.” p. 183
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