SPLIT: If confirmed in mortal sin does one need to be reconfirmed?

[oxoSarahoxo]

Sarah,

It is wrong of you to stop evangelizing. We are called always and everywhere to evangelize.

If there is a serious theological issue at a parish that you have attempted to address unsuccessfully, the next place to go is the Bishop. If it is still not resolved after that, the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith. Or in this case, perhaps the Congergation for Divine Worship and Discipline of the Sacraments. Or both.

Yes,
That is why I said “it is a flaw on my part”…
I think if it led to me stop evangelizing. I can’t be the only one who has stopped from this specific issue. . . Bc I usually find I’m not alone in my views. . . So there must be others struggling with this. . .
And it is even more wrong on my part given the grace I have seen which allows me to cooperate with it, in order to bring the others. So pray mercy on me…

But it is a discouraging thing to continue to witness over & over:

i’m not likely to be a whistle blower to the bishop & raise a ruckus …
I already have hateful letters. . . For asking to go t another parish. . .

I personally was confirmed in mortal sin.
Which means I took the Eucharist my first time in mortal sin.

My mom (whom I brought)
& my fiancées rica’s…
The preist blew off confession for the whole groups
Not to judge anyone but I’ve seen these groups all being confirmed (most likely)in mortal sin (by catholic church standards)…

On my fiancées part
We did as Protestants do; because without a priest to help us, what should we do?
So we said a direct confession to god hoping for divine mercy of some sort…
I have gone to confession
But should we be conditionally confirmed

Or is it all as our priests say to me. These things just don’t matter?
To me it matters…
But should I step out to the bishop? Lol, I guess I’m not as bold as I thought I could be in proclaiming the church. I just don’t know that I’m bold enough to continue to push this issue again & again…

So, if you are confirmed in mortal sin
I suppose the new question is
Does confession erase that & restore confirmation … Or do those ppl need re confirmed?
That # of ppl is piling up in the church…

 

[Mariem2]

Leaving aside the question about the priest refusing to hear confession prior to Confirmation, I have a problem with all this talk about mortal sin. It makes me very uncomfortable to hear Catholics saying someone must be in a state of mortal sin. Whatever happened to perfect contrition whereby sins are forgiven if the sinner repents not from fear of Hell, but from pure love of God and fully intends to receive the Sacrament of Reconciliation at the first opportunity? Is that gone for good?

 

[oxoSarahoxo]

Leaving aside the question about the priest refusing to hear confession prior to Confirmation, I have a problem with all this talk about mortal sin. It makes me very uncomfortable to hear Catholics saying someone must be in a state of mortal sin. Whatever happened to perfect contrition whereby sins are forgiven if the sinner repents not from fear of Hell, but from pure love of God and fully intends to receive the Sacrament of Reconciliation at the first opportunity? Is that gone for good?

That’s why I said “not to judge anyone”
And we prayed … But I noticed most ppl in the group living together before marriage
& then not receiving the sacrament properly…

I believe in perfect contrition
But I don’t know how perfect our contrition was or how to judge that…
So, idk…

On my part I went to confession over the issue…
So if mercy rules … I would think its forgiven…
I’ve never heard of a conditional confirmation or baptisim actually performed
Only theory…

If you get technical
& go by the definition of the cathecisim
It seems a who,e bunch of ppl are in need of a life long confession & conditional confirmation to be sure…

 

[1ke]

Leaving aside the question about the priest refusing to hear confession prior to Confirmation, I have a problem with all this talk about mortal sin. It makes me very uncomfortable to hear Catholics saying someone must be in a state of mortal sin. Whatever happened to perfect contrition whereby sins are forgiven if the sinner repents not from fear of Hell, but from pure love of God and fully intends to receive the Sacrament of Reconciliation at the first opportunity? Is that gone for good?

One can make an act of perfect contrition, but that does not negate the need for reconciliaton. And, reconciliation is readily available. This is not a situation where it must be delayed because it is not available.

 

[Mariem2]

But I don’t know how perfect our contrition was or how to judge that…
.

God judges.

I’m beginning to wonder where will the rest of us fit in Heaven when it’s so full of Pharisees. Are we wasting our time trying to be the best Catholics we can be?

 

[oxoSarahoxo]

God judges.

I’m beginning to wonder where will the rest of us fit in Heaven when it’s so full of Pharisees. Are we wasting our time trying to be the best Catholics we can be?

I understand God judges
That was the reason for the statement
I’m not qualified

That was my point
I’m not even qualified to judge myself!
So, that being said:
Did you just call me a Pharisee & yourself better than I? Or am I misreading this as you obviously misundetand me…

I’m trying to figure out if me & my family

plus my brothers & sisters are in trouble
It’s quite possible
100’s & 100’s of ppl are being given the Eucharist in mortal sin
At their first reception of it

Tell me if I’m wrong that this is no big deal…
I think it’s an issue
But I get hatred in return. . . (Even if its unintended hatred)

What is the solution to this
If it is a problem
I’m not seeing an answer here

 

[Mariem2]

You say you aren’t qualified to judge how perfect was “our” contrition. You didn’t use the singular “my”. You went to confession and received absolution. Why, then, are you now questioning whether you are forgiven? If you aren’t questioning the absolution you received, you must be questioning the sincerity of others in their relationship with God. You are also assuming that people are in mortal sin because they live in the same house. If I shared a house with my brother, would you accuse us of incest?

If you think your priest is leading parishioners into sin, tell his superior. That’s your duty done.

The most accurate statement I have seen on this thread is “I’m not qualified to judge”.

 

[oxoSarahoxo]

You say you aren’t qualified to judge how perfect was “our” contrition. You didn’t use the singular “my”. You went to confession and received absolution. Why, then, are you now questioning whether you are forgiven? If you aren’t questioning the absolution you received, you must be questioning the sincerity of others in their relationship with God. You are also assuming that people are in mortal sin because they live in the same house. If I shared a house with my brother, would you accuse us of incest?

If you think your priest is leading parishioners into sin, tell his superior. That’s your duty done.

The most accurate statement I have seen on this thread is “I’m not qualified to judge”.

Wow
Ok… This is not an answer
I used the word “our”
Because I was not speaking singularly

& I don’t know if you commit incest, or what people do in the privacy of their homes for the most part:
I was making an observation, which i also, clearly stated was not a judgement
Just call me a Pharisee too why don’t you…

Let me defend this now:
I used the word “our”
Because
Going back “I” received improper confirmation “I” believe
I confessed , I don’t question my absolution
I do question the validity of my confirmation

& our confirmation …
I use the word “our” bc
I (with the Holy Spirit, let me give credit where it is fully due least you point out any short comings in me or my word usage instead of giving real advice)
Brought others into the church

Separate parishes but, same issue

Then when I brought my mother & others into an rica program together
The preist quit

A group of 25++ people were confirmed without a life long confession
I was told no biggie by church members…
When I asked for help at another parish I was turned away

So I did the only thing I knew how
I prayed with them before confirmation (mentioning this was the first attack I received on this thread btw…)
We prayed together
No preist
No confession
Most of them had been baptized as children
Were they in mortal sin.?
I don’t know , but a lifetime? , ok o I believe in perfect contrition as stated …

& I don’t question my absolution after confession
But
I question
The validity of my confirmation in mortal sin

&
In many of these instances
And yes
Many of them told me they were living together & having a full relationship
They were very open & young… So…

I’ve never heard of recomfirmation being performed
But i just don’t know what the answer is here…
I know a few ppl who are asking me if they should be
Bc I helped bring them in

So if you want to attack my statement this time … Instead of answering the ? I’m here
I’m here trying to get an answer for “us”
I guess I have to go to the bishop? That sounds awful for someone not raised in the church…

Maybe we will get another priest soon who can help…

I was (maybe am) one of the worst sinners you could ever meet
I have no room to ever judge another… I should be punished an eternity over for some things I’ve done in my life
Yet I’m allowed to have the grace to bring others with me towards heaven
I won’t soon figure god out… Or ever…
But I would like to know the answer to this ?

 

[1ke]

I do question the validity of my confirmation

I’ve never heard of recomfirmation being performed
But i just don’t know what the answer is here…

The answer has already been supplied. The validity of your confirmation does NOT depend upon whether or not you were in a state of grace. You are VALIDLY confirmed.

The graces of confirmation would flow to you when you entered a state of grace, whether that was at the time of confirmation or sometime after that when you went to confession.

 

[oxoSarahoxo]

The answer has already been supplied. The validity of your confirmation does NOT depend upon whether or not you were in a state of grace. You are VALIDLY confirmed.

The graces of confirmation would flow to you when you entered a state of grace, whether that was at the time of confirmation or sometime after that when you went to confession.

that’s what I was looking for
So my confession not only absolved me but, allowed the graces of confirmation sometime after when I went t confession …
& thats what i can tell the others too,
Thank you …

 

[Fr_Destoop]

Here is an excerpt from a book on Confession I wrote entitled, “The Gift of Confession: A Positive Approach to the Sacrament of Reconciliation”:

One of the benefits of Confession is that it confers sanctifying grace and sacramental grace. Perhaps you already know that the other sacraments we receive after Baptism also provide these graces according to the purpose for which each of these sacraments is given. However, what many people do not realize is that the Church teaches that no one can receive these graces from the Sacraments of the Eucharist, Confirmation, Marriage, and Holy Orders if they are not in the state of grace (cf. Dr Ludwig Ott, in “Fundamentals of Catholic Dogma,” p. 346). The parable of the Vine and the Branches (Jn. 14:4-8) helps us to understand this. If we (the branches) separate ourselves from the vine (Christ), then how could we expect the sacraments to “bear fruit” (Jn. 15:4) in us given that we are no longer receiving the sap? (God’s grace is like the sap which makes the sacraments efficacious.) Just as Jesus said, “As the branch cannot bear fruit by itself, unless it abides in the vine, neither can you, unless you abide in me … for apart from me you can do nothing,” (Jn. 15:4-5) neither can the other sacraments do anything if, through sin, we do not abide in Christ and He in us.

In practical terms this means that if we are not in the state of grace when we receive the Sacraments of the Eucharist, Confirmation, Marriage, and Holy Orders (known as the Sacraments of the Living*), these sacraments are validly received but we receive no graces from them. Or, if we had received these sacraments worthily, but had subsequently committed a mortal sin, we would not continue to receive the graces from these sacraments. It is comforting to know then that the Church teaches: “The Sacraments of Baptism, Confirmation and Consecration [Marriage and Holy Orders], when they are received validly but unworthily, revive after the removal of the moral indisposition, that is, the sacramental grace is conferred subsequently” (Dr Ludwig Ott, “Fundamentals of Catholic Dogma,” p. 346).

It is clear then that if we have committed a serious sin we need to go to Confession if we wish to benefit from these other sacraments.

*These sacraments are called the Sacraments of the Living because those who receive them fruitfully are already in the state of grace. The Sacraments of the Dead are the sacraments which confer sanctifying grace for the first time (Baptism), or sanctifying grace which has been lost (Sacrament of Reconciliation).