St Augustine, St Jerome and the CCC on the origin of the soul

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In ‘Letter 167 (St Augustine) or 132 (St Jerome) From St Augustine to St Jerome, on James 2:10 (A.D. 415)’ newadvent.org/fathers/1102167.htm St Augustine writes (Bold emphasis mine)

“**Chapter 1
  1. My brother Jerome, esteemed worthy to be honoured in Chris t by me, when I wrote to you propounding this question concerning the human soul,—if a new soul be now created for each individual at birth, whence do souls contract the bond of guilt which we assuredly believe to be removed by the sacrament of the grace of Chris t, when administered even to new-born children?**”
St Augustine seems to be referring to this letter ‘‘Letter 166 (St Augustine) or 131 (St Jerome) From St Augustine to St Jerome, on the origin of the soul (A.D. 415)’’ newadvent.org/fathers/1102166.htm in the above, here are some quotes from this letter (Bold emphasis mine. The most relevant parts of the quotes will be in bold, you may skip the non-bold quotes if you wish)

“**Chapter 7
21. … I therefore ask, what is the ground of this condemnation of unbaptized infants? For if new souls are made for men, individually, at their birth, I do not see, on the one hand, that they could have any sin while yet in infancy, nor do I believe, on the other hand, that God condemns any soul which He sees to have no sin.

Chapter 8
22. Are we perchance to say, in answer to this, that in the infant the body alone is the cause of sin; but that for each body a new soul is made, and that if this soul live according to the precepts of God, by the help of the grace of Chris t, the reward of being made incorruptible may be secured for the body itself, when subdued and kept under the yoke; and that inasmuch as the soul of an infant cannot yet do this, unless it receive the sacrament of Chris t, that which could not yet be obtained for the body by the holiness of the soul is obtained for it by the grace of this sacrament; but if the soul of an infant depart without the sacrament, it shall itself dwell in life eternal, from which it could not be separated, as it had no sin, while, however, the body which it occupied shall not rise again in Chris t, because the sacrament had not been received before its dea th?
  1. This opinion I have never heard or read anywhere…**
  2. Let every man, however, believe anything which commends itself to his own judgment, even though it run counter to some opinion of Cyprian, who may not have seen in the matter what should have been seen. But let no man believe anything which runs counter to the perfectly unambiguous apostolical declaration, that by the offence of one all are brought into condemnation, and that from this condemnation nothing sets men free but the grace of God through our Lord Je sus Chris t, in whom alone life is given to all who are made alive. And let no man believe anything which runs counter to the firmly grounded practice of the Church, in which, if the sole reason for hastening the administration of baptism were to save the children, the as well as the living would be brought to be baptized.
  3. These things being so, it is necessary still to investigate and to make known the reason why, if souls are created new for every individual at his birth, those who die in infancy without the sacrament of Chris t are doomed to perdition; for that they are doomed to this if they so depart from the body is testified both by Holy Scripture and by the holy Church. Wherefore, as to that opinion of yours concerning the creation of new souls, if it does not contradict this firmly grounded article of faith, let it be mine also; but if it does, let it be no longer yours.”
    **
    St. Augustine seems to have had a disagreement with St. Jerome on the origin of the soul, whether is it is “produced” by the parents or created. St. Augustine seems to have said that it is “produced” by the parents and St. Jerome seems to have said it is created. **
St. Jerome doesn’t seem to have answered St Augustine’s questions (see above bold quotes) on the origin of the soul.

However, the Catechism of the Catholic Church seems to disagree with St Augustine and agree with St Jerome.

vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/__P1B.HTM
366 The Church teaches that every spiritual soul is created immediately by God - it is not “produced” by the parents - and also that it is immortal: it does not perish when it separates from the body at dea th, and it will be reunited with the body at the final Resurrection.235
…
 
…
My Question:

So, my question is, can anyone here answer St Augustine’s questions? Which are:

“if a new soul be now created for each individual at birth, whence do souls contract the bond of guilt which we assuredly believe to be removed by the sacrament of the grace of Christ, when administered even to new-born children?”

and

“I therefore ask, what is the ground of this condemnation of unbaptized infants? For if new souls are made for men, individually, at their birth, I do not see, on the one hand, that they could have any sin while yet in infancy, nor do I believe, on the other hand, that God condemns any soul which He sees to have no sin.”
 
St. Augustine is saying that we don’t aquire souls at birth, and the CCC agrees; we aquire a soul at conception, not birth. I don’t see where St. Augustine is saying that the soul is not created by God.

Peace and God bless!
 
Ghosty said:
St. Augustine is saying that we don’t aquire souls at birth, and the CCC agrees; we aquire a soul at conception, not birth. I don’t see where St. Augustine is saying that the soul is not created by God.

Peace and God bless!
Click to expand...
I think you have misunderstood what St Augustine is saying. He seems to be questioning St Jerome’s claim (i.e. St Jerome’s claim that a new soul is created for each individual at birth, which is what the CCC states as well) by asking if a new soul is created for each individual at birth, then how do souls inherit/contract original sin (in St Augustine’s words “the bond of guilt” [see my quote above]) and continues “which we assuredly believe to be removed by the sacrament of the grace of Chris t” * “when administered even to new-born children?” [see my quote above]

St Augustine seems to have believed that the soul is “produced” by the parents and that is how souls inherit/contract original sin.

And another one of his questions is

“I therefore ask, what is the ground of this condemnation of unbaptized infants? For if new souls are made for men, individually, at their birth, I do not see, on the one hand, that they could have any sin while yet in infancy, nor do I believe, on the other hand, that God condemns any soul which He sees to have no sin.” [see my quote above]

I am probably wrong but this is my understanding of the situation.

Peace and God bless!*
 
According to J.N.D. Kelly, in his book “Early Chris tian Doctrines” 5th Revised Edition pp. 345-346

“The explanation to which Augustine on a whole leaned, although with many hesitations, was the traducianist one associated with Tertullian, viz. that each soul is somehow generated from the parent’s soul. Among the Greeks there are hints of it in Gregory of Nyssa… At the same time, while conscious of difficulties in each case, he remained alive1 to the attractions of various forms of the creationist theory. The truth is that, despite his bias to traducionism, he could never make up his mind about the matter, and in his later writings frankly confessed2 that he was baffled.”

In any case, my question is not about what St Augustine believed but if someone could answer his questions that he wrote to St Jerome in the above letters I quoted.

You may also want to see “Traducianism” in the Catholic Encyclopedia here
newadvent.org/cathen/15014a.htm

And “Creationism” in the Catholic Encyclopedia here
newadvent.org/cathen/04475a.htm
 
The Creation and the Fall of Man
48. What is man?
Man is a creature composed of body and soul, and made to the image and likeness of God.
And God created man to his own image. (Genesis 2:7)
49. Is this likeness to God in the body or in the soul?
This likeness to God is chiefly in the soul.
  1. How is the soul like God?
    The soul is like God because it is a spirit having understanding and free will, and is destined to live forever.
    And the dust return into its earth, from whence it was, and the spirit return to God, who gave it. (Ecclesiastes 12:7)
  2. Who were the first man and woman?
    The first man and woman were Adam and Eve, the first parents of the whole human race.
    And Adam called the name of his wife Eve. (Genesis 3:15)
  3. What was the chief gift bestowed on Adam and Eve by God?
    The chief gift bestowed on Adam and Eve by God was sanctifying grace, which made them children of God and gave them the right to heaven.
  4. What other gifts were bestowed on Adam and Eve by God?
    The other gifts bestowed on Adam and Eve by God were happiness in the Garden of Paradise, great knowledge, control of the passions by reason, and freedom from suffering and death.
    He gave them counsel, and a tongue, and eyes, and ears, and a heart to devise; and he filled them with the knowledge of understanding. (Ecclesiasticus 17:5)
  5. What commandment did God give Adam and Eve?
    God gave Adam and Eve the commandment not to eat of the fruit of a certain tree that grew in the Garden of Paradise.
    And he commanded him, saying: “Of every tree of paradise thou shalt eat; but of the tree of knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat. For in what day soever thou shalt eat of it, thou shalt die the death.” (Genesis 2:16-17)
  6. Did Adam and Eve obey the commandment of God?
    Adam and Eve did not obey the commandment of God, but ate of the forbidden fruit.
    And the woman saw that the tree was good to eat, and fair to the eyes, and delightful to behold; and she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave to her husband who did eat. (Genesis 3:6)
  7. What happened to Adam and Eve on account of their sin?
    On account of their sin Adam and Eve lost sanctifying grace, the right to heaven, and their special gifts; they became subject to death, to suffering, and to a strong inclination to evil, and they were driven from the Garden of Paradise.
    In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread till thou return to the earth, out of which thou wast taken; for dust thou art, and into dust thou shalt return. (Genesis 3:19)
  8. What has happened to us on account of the sin of Adam?
    On account of the sin of Adam, we, his descendants, come into the world deprived of sanctifying grace and inherit his punishment, as we would have inherited his gifts had he been obedient to God.
    But, by the envy of the devil, death came into the world. (Wisdom 2:24)
  9. What is this sin in us called?
    This sin in us is called original.
  10. Why is this sin called original?
    This sin is called original because it comes down to us through our origin, or descent, from Adam.
    Therefore as through one man sin entered into the world and through sin death, and thus death has passed unto all men because all have sinned. (Romans 5:12)
  11. What are the chief punishments of Adam which we inherit through original sin?
    The chief punishments of Adam which we inherit through original sin are: death, suffering, ignorance, and a strong inclination to sin.
  12. Is God unjust in punishing us on account of the sin of Adam?
    God is not unjust in punishing us on account of the sin of Adam, because original sin does not take away from us anything to which we have a strict right as human beings, but only the free gifts which God in His goodness would have bestowed on us if Adam had not sinned.
  13. Was any human person ever preserved from original sin?
    The Blessed Virgin Mary was preserved from original sin in view of the merits of her Divine Son, and this privilege is called her Immaculate Conception.
    I will put enmities between you and the woman, between your seed and her seed; he shall crush your head, and you shall lie in wait his heel. (Genesis 3:15)
 
Catechism

ARTICLE 1
“I BELIEVE IN GOD THE FATHER ALMIGHTY, CREATOR
OF HEAVEN AND EARTH”

Paragraph 7. The Fall

385
God is infinitely good and all his works are good. Yet no one can escape the experience of suffering or the evils in nature which seem to be linked to the limitations proper to creatures: and above all to the question of moral evil. Where does evil come from? “I sought whence evil comes and there was no solution,” said St. Augustine,257 and his own painful quest would only be resolved by his conversion to the living God. For “the mystery of lawlessness” is clarified only in the light of the "mystery of our religion."258 The revelation of divine love in Christ manifested at the same time the extent of evil and the superabundance of grace.259 We must therefore approach the question of the origin of evil by fixing the eyes of our faith on him who alone is its conqueror.260

I. Where Sin Abounded, Grace Abounded All the More

The reality of sin

386
Sin is present in human history; any attempt to ignore it or to give this dark reality other names would be futile. To try to understand what sin is, one must first recognize the profound relation of man to God, for only in this relationship is the evil of sin unmasked in its true identity as humanity’s rejection of God and opposition to him, even as it continues to weigh heavy on human life and history.

387
Only the light of divine Revelation clarifies the reality of sin and particularly of the sin committed at mankind’s origins. Without the knowledge Revelation gives of God we cannot recognize sin clearly and are tempted to explain it as merely a developmental flaw, a psychological weakness, a mistake, or the necessary consequence of an inadequate social structure, etc. Only in the knowledge of God’s plan for man can we grasp that sin is an abuse of the freedom that God gives to created persons so that they are capable of loving him and loving one another.
Original Sin—an essential truth of the faith

388
With the progress of Revelation, the reality of sin is also illuminated. Although to some extent the People of God in the Old Testament had tried to understand the pathos of the human condition in the light of the history of the fall narrated in Genesis, they could not grasp this story’s ultimate meaning, which is revealed only in the light of the death and Resurrection of Jesus Christ.261 We must know Christ as the source of grace in order to know Adam as the source of sin. The Spirit-Paraclete, sent by the risen Christ, came to "convict the world concerning sin,"262 by revealing him who is its Redeemer.

389
The doctrine of original sin is, so to speak, the “reverse side” of the Good News that Jesus is the Savior of all men, that all need salvation, and that salvation is offered to all through Christ. The Church, which has the mind of Christ,263 knows very well that we cannot tamper with the revelation of original sin without undermining the mystery of Christ.
How to read the account of the Fall

390
The account of the fall in Genesis 3 uses figurative LANGUAGE, but affirms a primeval event, a deed that took place at the beginning of the history of man.264 Revelation gives us the certainty of faith that the whole of human history is marked by the original fault freely committed by our first parents.265
 
Catechism

Man’s first sin

The consequences of Adam’s sin for humanity

**402 **
All men are implicated in Adam’s sin, as St. Paul affirms: “By one man’s disobedience many [that is, all men] were made sinners”: "sin came into the world through one man and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all men sinned. . . ."289 The Apostle contrasts the universality of sin and death with the universality of salvation in Christ. "Then as one man’s trespass led to condemnation for all men, so one man’s act of righteousness leads to acquittal and life for all men."290

**403 **
Following St. Paul, the Church has always taught that the overwhelming misery which oppresses men and their inclination toward evil and death cannot be understood apart from their connection with Adam’s sin and the fact that he has transmitted to us a sin with which we are all born afflicted, a sin which is the "death of the soul."291 Because of this certainty of faith, the Church baptizes for the remission of sins even tiny infants who have not committed personal sin.292

**404 **
How did the sin of Adam become the sin of all his descendants? The whole human race is in Adam "as one body of one man."293 By this “unity of the human race” all men are implicated in Adam’s sin, as all are implicated in Christ’s justice. Still, the transmission of original sin is a mystery that we cannot fully understand. But we do know by Revelation that Adam had received original holiness and justice not for himself alone, but for all human nature. By yielding to the tempter, Adam and Eve committed a personal sin, but this sin affected the human nature that they would then transmit in a fallen state.294 It is a sin which will be transmitted by propagation to all mankind, that is, by the transmission of a human nature deprived of original holiness and justice. And that is why original sin is called “sin” only in an analogical sense: it is a sin “contracted” and not “committed”—a state and not an act.

405
Although it is proper to each individual,295 original sin does not have the character of a personal fault in any of Adam’s descendants. It is a deprivation of original holiness and justice, but human nature has not been totally corrupted: it is wounded in the natural powers proper to it; subject to ignorance, suffering, and the dominion of death; and inclined to sin—an inclination to evil that is called “concupiscence.” Baptism, by imparting the life of Christ’s grace, erases original sin and turns a man back toward God, but the consequences for nature, weakened and inclined to evil, persist in man and summon him to spiritual battle.

**406 **The Church’s teaching on the transmission of original sin was articulated more precisely in the fifth century, especially under the impulse of St. Augustine’s reflections against Pelagianism, and in the sixteenth century, in opposition to the Protestant Reformation. Pelagius held that man could, by the natural power of free will and without the necessary help of God’s grace, lead a morally good life; he thus reduced the influence of Adam’s fault to bad example. The first Protestant reformers, on the contrary, taught that original sin has radically perverted man and destroyed his freedom; they identified the sin inherited by each man with the tendency to evil (concupiscentia), which would be insurmountable. The Church pronounced on the meaning of the data of Revelation on original sin especially at the second Council of Orange (529)296 and at the Council of Trent (1546).297
A hard battle . . .

407
The doctrine of original sin, closely connected with that of redemption by Christ, provides lucid discernment of man’s situation and activity in the world. By our first parents’ sin, the devil has acquired a certain domination over man, even though man remains free. Original sin entails "captivity under the power of him who thenceforth had the power of death, that is, the devil."298 Ignorance of the fact that man has a wounded nature inclined to evil gives rise to serious errors in the areas of education, politics, social action,299 and morals.

**408 **
The consequences of original sin and of all men’s personal sins put the world as a whole in the sinful condition aptly described in St. John’s expression, "the sin of the world."300 This expression can also refer to the negative influence exerted on people by communal situations and social structures that are the fruit of men’s sins.301
 
Actual Sin
63. Is original sin the only kind of sin?
Original sin is not the only kind of sin; there is another kind, called actual sin, which we ourselves commit.
Amen, amen, I say to you that whosoever commiteth sin is the servant of sin. (John 8:34)
64. What is actual sin?
Actual sin is any willful thought, desire, word, action, or omission forbidden by the law of God.
  1. How many kinds of actual sin are there?
    There are two kinds of actual sin: mortal sin and venial sin.
  2. What is mortal sin?
    Mortal sin is a grievous offense against the law of God.
    Flee from sins as from the face of a serpent; for if thou comest near them, they will take hold of thee. (Ecclesiasticus 21:2)
  3. Why is this sin called mortal?
    This sin is called mortal, or deadly, because it deprives the sinner of sanctifying grace, the supernatural life of the soul.
    Before man is life and death, good and evil; that which he shall choose shall be given him. (Ecclesiasticus 15:18)
  4. Besides depriving the sinner of sanctifying grace, what else does mortal sin do to the soul?
    Besides depriving the sinner of sanctifying grace, mortal sin makes the soul an enemy of God, takes away the merit of all its good actions, deprives it of the right to everlasting happiness in heaven, and makes it deserving of everlasting punishment in hell.
    For the wages of sin is death; but the grace of God, life everlasting in Christ Jesus our Lord. (Romans 6:23)
  5. What three things are necessary to make a sin mortal?
    To make a sin mortal these three things are needed:
    first, the thought, desire, word, action, or omission must be seriously wrong or considered seriously wrong;
    second, the sinner, must be mindful of the serious wrong;
    third, the sinner must fully consent to it.
  6. What is venial sin?
    Venial sin is a less serious offense against the law of God, which does not deprive the soul of sanctifying grace, and which can be pardoned even without sacramental confession.
    Be ye therefore perfect, as also your heavenly Father is perfect. (Matthew 6:48)
  7. How can a sin be venial?
    A sin can be venial in two ways:
    first, when the evil done is not seriously wrong;
    second, when the evil done is seriously wrong, but the sinner sincerely believes it is only slightly wrong, or does not give full consent to it.
  8. How does venial sin harm us?
    Venial sin harms us by making us less fervent in the service of God, by weakening our power to resist mortal sin, and by making us deserving of God’s punishments in this life or in purgatory.
    But I tell you, that of every idle word men speak, they shall give account on the day of judgment. (Matthew 12:36)
  9. How can we keep from committing sin?
    We can keep from committing sin by praying and by receiving the sacraments; by remembering that God is always with us; by recalling that our bodies are temples of the Holy Ghost; by keeping occupied with work or play; by promptly resisting the sources of sin within us; by avoiding the near occasions of sin.
    And if thy right hand scandalize thee, cut it off and cast it from thee. For it is expedient for thee that one of thy members perish rather than that thy whole body go into hell. (Mark 9:42)
  10. What are the chief sources of actual sin?
    The chief sources of actual sin are: pride, covetousness, lust, anger, gluttony, envy, and sloth, and these are commonly called capital sins.
  11. Why are these called capital sins?
    They are called capital sins, not because they, in themselves, are the greatest sins, but because they are the chief reasons why men commit sin.
  12. What are the near occasions of sin?
    The near occasions of sin are all persons, places, or things that may easily lead us into sin.
 
Original Sin is not the same thing as Actual Sin.

So no a baby in the womb does not commit a sin (Actual Sin)
but because he/she is a descendant of Adam he/she come into the world deprived of sanctifying grace and inherit his punishment, as we would have inherited his gifts had he been obedient to God.
So it sounds like when the soul enters the body and is alive in the womb is when we inherit Adam’s sin. I hope I helped.
 
I am not a theologian but this is my answer

When a baby is conceived, God create a soul immediately and infuse the soul to the baby or we can say fetus to bring it to life in the womb. Since the soul is created by God therefore during this time the soul is sinless

However, the flesh has Original Sin, once infused, the soul to the body, it becomes ONE, so soul during this time is stained by Original sin.

even upon death of an innocent infant, the soul is unworthy to to God as it now contains sin.

hope this explanation is not heretical
new12345 said:
…
My Question:

So, my question is, can anyone here answer St Augustine’s questions? Which are:

“if a new soul be now created for each individual at birth, whence do souls contract the bond of guilt which we assuredly believe to be removed by the sacrament of the grace of Christ, when administered even to new-born children?”

and

“I therefore ask, what is the ground of this condemnation of unbaptized infants? For if new souls are made for men, individually, at their birth, I do not see, on the one hand, that they could have any sin while yet in infancy, nor do I believe, on the other hand, that God condemns any soul which He sees to have no sin.”
Click to expand...
 
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