Struggling Witb Belief in Triune God

  • Thread starter Thread starter Upgrade25
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
U

Upgrade25

Guest
I am struggling with my belief in the Trinity. Please show Bible quotes, Catchecism, and anything else that explains why Modalism nor 3 separate gods(Father, Son, Holy Spirit) could be true. Please, I can’t doubt the Trinity. Help!
 
Actively think of yourself.

You are now three in one. You are thinker, you are the one being thought of, and you are the thought.

There, a mini-Trinity.

Start approaching the question like that. In God though, actions/thoughts are different than in us such that there are actually true relations in Him in that act of self-reflection/love.
 
I believe in one God,
the Father almighty,
maker of heaven and earth,
of all things visible and invisible.

I believe in one Lord Jesus Christ,
the Only Begotten Son of God,
born of the Father before all ages.
God from God, Light from Light,
true God from true God,
begotten, not made, consubstantial with the Father;
through him all things were made.
For us men and for our salvation
he came down from heaven,
and by the Holy Spirit was incarnate of the Virgin Mary,
and became man.
For our sake he was crucified under Pontius Pilate,
he suffered death and was buried,
and rose again on the third day
in accordance with the Scriptures.
He ascended into heaven
and is seated at the right hand of the Father.
He will come again in glory
to judge the living and the dead
and his kingdom will have no end.

I believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the giver of life,
who proceeds from the Father and the Son,
who with the Father and the Son is adored and glorified,
who has spoken through the prophets.


I believe in one, holy, catholic and apostolic Church.
I confess one Baptism for the forgiveness of sins
and I look forward to the resurrection of the dead
and the life of the world to come. Amen.

usccb.org/beliefs-and-teachings/what-we-believe/
 
We are created as a type of Trinity. Perhaps this is what it means to be “in the image of God”. We have a mind, we have a body, and we have a soul. After death our soul, with the mind, leaves the body. Eventually our bodies will be resurrected and join our minds and souls.

God the Father is the Mind of the Trinity. He is the Creator, the great intellect. God’s soul is the Holy Spirit. God’s body is Jesus.
 
The Trinity IS a MYSTERY, It has been pondered from the beginning by the Apostles who themselves had to struggle to understand it. No human can ever fully comprehend it, since to do so would mean we would have the same level of intellect as GOD.

Because it is a mystery there is no way that this knowledge could have been discerned or gleaned by humans. No theologian or philosopher could discover this “property” of our GOD.

Hence we know about it only because Jesus himself revealed it to us.

Which passages of Holy Scripture point us to this mystery?

Jesus is as John points out “The WORD of GOD”. HE is also the “SON of GOD”.

Jesus refers to HIS father as “GOD the FATHER”. HE also says that GOD the FATHER is also OUR father, HE taught us how to pray.

Our Father who art in Heaven
Hallowed be thy name, thy kingdom come thy will be done
on earth as it is Heaven
give us our daily bread and forgive us
our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us
lead us not into temptation and deliver us from evil.

Jesus also teaches that there is but ONE GOD and we shall have no other gods.

HE also says Whomever receives the SON, receives the Father
Whomever sees the SON also sees the Father.
HE wishes that we abide in HIM as HE abides in the FATHER.

What about the Holy Spirit? Well Jesus also tells us about HIM. When after the resurrection HE “Breathed on the Disciples” saying “Receive the Holy Spirit” Whomever sins you forgive they are forgiven, whomever sins are retained are retained"

Also HE before ascending to Heaven commands HIS Disciples to remain in Jerusalem until the “Paraclete” comes and instructs them. We see that the “Paraclete” IS the Holy Spirit that descended from Heaven and entered all those gathered at Pentecostes in the “Upper Room” as tongues of fire.

All these events are there in the New Testament, I recommend for you to read about them, but the mystery of the Trinity is also dimly revealed in the Old Testament.
One example we have when GOD in Genesis 1:26 says: “And he said: “Let us make Man to our image and likeness”.

Who is “US”, unless Jesus revealed this to us humans, the nature of GOD, we could not know. However we do now know “US” are 3 persons in 1 GOD.
"HE said" NOT “they said” Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

 
I’'m probably the thinker. I’m probably the one being thought of. But thank god I’m not the thought-that is I’m not any of my thoughts.
 
Here you go. Mentions all 3 parts of the Trinity. Along with the other verses, John 16:17 can be taken that Jesus is showing the sameness of He and the Father (along with John 10:30) as he states both He and the Father will send the Spirit.

Matthew 28:19
"Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit

John 10:30
“I and the Father are one”

John 14:26
But the helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, He will teach you all things…

John 15:26New American Standard Bible (NASB)
26 “When the Helper comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, that is the Spirit of truth who proceeds from the Father, He will testify about Me

John 16:17
But I tell you the truth, it is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the helper will not come to you. But if I go away, I will send Him to you.

Good luck!
 
One Person is the apotheosis of Egocentricity.

Two Persons are the apotheosis of Infertility.

Three Persons are essential for Love’s creativity.

Perfect love implies both unity and diversity.

Unitarianism is a simplistic exaltation of egoism. Three is not a crowd if it is a family!

To love oneself and no one else for all eternity is to be in hell not heaven!

Where there is Perfect Love there is total identification of oneself with another person. Even in this world love implies a temporary loss of identity because we forget ourselves when we are concerned about some one else. If we can cease to exist for ourselves for a while surely the three divine Persons **never **exist for themselves.
 
One Person is the apotheosis of Egocentricity.

Two Persons are the apotheosis of Infertility.

Three Persons are essential for Love’s creativity.

Perfect love implies both unity and diversity.

Unitarianism is a simplistic exaltation of egoism. Three is not a crowd if it is a family!

To love oneself and no one else for all eternity is to be in hell not heaven!

Where there is Perfect Love there is total identification of oneself with another person. Even in this world love implies a temporary loss of identity because we forget ourselves when we are concerned about some one else. If we can cease to exist for ourselves for a while surely the three divine Persons **never **exist for themselves.
Thomas Aquinas has an article saying that you can’t prove multiple persons in the Divinity from reason, so the argument from ego-centrality doesn’t seem to work. God could be Love, but not necessarily have anyone to return the Love, since he has all the goodness anyway
 
Thomas Aquinas has an article saying that you can’t prove multiple persons in the Divinity from reason, so the argument from ego-centrality doesn’t seem to work. God could be Love, but not necessarily have anyone to return the Love, since he has all the goodness anyway
I have great respect for St Thomas but he was not infallible. The points I have made - as far as I can see - are still valid:
  1. Where there is Perfect Love there is total identification of oneself with another person.
  2. Perfect love implies both unity and diversity.
  3. Three Persons are essential for Love’s creativity.
I should add:
  1. Belief in the Holy Trinity corresponds to the teaching of Jesus - which is surely an argument based on reason unless we reject His wisdom in every other respect.
 
Jesus had natural and supernatural wisdom. Having someone to love perfects us, but it could be different for God for all our natural reason knows
 
Jesus had natural and supernatural wisdom. Having someone to love perfects us, but it could be different for God for all our natural reason knows
I think I have given sufficient reasons to believe the Holy Trinity corresponds to Our Lord’s teaching. Why else have the vast majority of Christians all over the world, including saints, eminent phliosophers and theologians accepted this doctrine for more than two thousand years?
 
I am struggling with my belief in the Trinity. Please show Bible quotes, Catchecism, and anything else that explains why Modalism nor 3 separate gods(Father, Son, Holy Spirit) could be true. Please, I can’t doubt the Trinity. Help!
Since The Trinity is absolutely simple, there is only one essence, and Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are real differences, not in respect to the essence, but in respect to relations of opposition. It is in our way of thinking that there are three real Persons - opposite relations: Paternity, Filiation, Procession.

St. Thomas Aquinas wrote in* Summa Theologica* Q39, A1:

For person, as above stated (29, 4), signifies relation as subsisting in the divine nature. But relation as referred to the essence does not differ therefrom really, but only in our way of thinking; while as referred to an opposite relation, it has a real distinction by virtue of that opposition. Thus there are one essence and three persons.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top