Suggestions wanted

[Ana]

A friend of mine has asked me to speak with his girlfriend. I’ve only met her once. She has been considering using birth control. They are sexually active. When she broached the subject with him, he asked her if she would be willing to speak with me, before making a decision.

He is nervous about the idea of birth control because of the many side effects. He said he was hoping I could talk with her because I practice NFP, and know more about these things than he does, being I am a woman and married. She has agreed and is coming over tomorrow night.

I have known him for many years, and I have been priviledged to watch him grow from an Athiest, to believing in God but Jesus was just a man, to believing Jesus is God. Though he does not go to Church regularly, when he does go, he attends my local parish, and visits the Sacrament whenever he is facing a trial in his life.

Anyways, lo and behold his new girlfriend is Catholic. I tease him that he’s being “surrounded”, but it seems she is lukewarm (or poorly catechized?) She does attend Church and sings in the Church choir.

I am glad for this opportunity to witness, and I would be grateful for any pointers those more experienced in presenting these types of arguments have to offer, also prayers would be most appreciated.

Thank you!

 

[kage_ar]

Ana -

To me, it seems your friend is putting you in a tough spot. Why would it be good for this couple to use NFP when they are not married? Pray for them, encourage them to a life of chastity. The “side effects” of pre-marital sex are just as serious as the side effects of ABC…

Praying that you can speak in love and be a shining example to this couple.

 

[JimO]

Do you really want to appear to approve of a mortal sin? By counselling NFP to an unmarried couple, you may be giving tacit approval. I’d speak to a godly priest about this, for your own sake.

Blessings

 

[Scott_Waddell]

Give her a copy of Pure Love from this website. Get a copy for yourself and familiarize yourself with it. Try to have a sit-down talk session with her. Don’t forget to pray for her.

Scott

 

[Ana]

JimO:

Do you really want to appear to approve of a mortal sin? By counselling NFP to an unmarried couple, you may be giving tacit approval. I’d speak to a godly priest about this, for your own sake.

Blessings

I’m sorry I wasn’t more clear, I intend to speak with her about premarital sex also. For their sake and God’s. BUT if they choose to have premarital sex (which I hope to convince them otherwise), I don’t see how it would be good for them to compound their sin by using birth control, especially since certain methods allow for the possibility of a baby conceived ending in death.

I plan on presenting NFP in the context of Church teaching on marriage, so that they may make an INFORMED decision. After that, what they do with the information is in God’s hands.

God bless, and thank you for the replies thus far.

 

[MamaGeek]

She needs to know the abortifacient aspect of BC. When the pill was originally developed, it was supposed to only prevent ovulation - a true contraceptive. The dosage needed to have this effect, however was dangerously high. The lower dosage of anti-ovulatory is not as effective at preventing pregnancy, so the abortifacient was added. It prevents the fertilized egg from implanting in the uterus. All birth control pills have this ingredient. Taking the pill does not guarantee an abortion, but it allows for the possibility - of course the woman taking it would never know.

Returning to chastity once a couple has begun to be sexually involved is much more difficult than practicing abstinence from the start. Ask her if they have ever gone for a long while without having sex, and how much more enjoyable it was when they finally got back together. Ask her to imagine how much more meaningful their wedding night would be if they waited until then to have sex again. BC would not even be an issue then, and the time of chastity could be offered up as a sacrafice for their marriage, as well as a time to monitor and chart monthly cycles in preparation for using NFP once they are married.

Sexual morality is not often preached from the pulpit, and I doubt most “casual” Catholics understand the seriousness of the sin. People tend to laugh at “fire and brimstone,” “hellfire and damnation,” but it is a very real possibility for one who is living in a state of mortal sin. Can you find some kind way of telling her this? Does she have a catechism? You could tell her which passages to read…

God Bless and I will say a prayer for you. Ask the Holy Spirit to guide you, and I am certain that she and your friend will be better off with your words than without.

Peace in Christ,
MamaGeek

 

[Ana]

Thank you mamageek for your thoughtful response. These are the kind of facts I am needing “refreshing” on. I’ve been practicing NFP for a while now and it’s been a long time since I’ve had to explain the Church’s position. You don’t use it you lose it.

About the premarital sex, as well as what you said, I would like to discuss with her WHY the Church teaches that sex is to remain within the Sacrament of Marriage. The unitive and procreative aspect etc. I know that because of my premarital sex, it has caused me much regret later in life.

I also intend on speaking with her about receiving Communion while in a state of mortal sin. I know her parents attend the same Mass as she, and I hope she hasn’t felt the need to “pretend” all is well for their sake.

Please, please pray that I may present these Truth’s in a gentle and loving manner.

If you have anything to add … I’m listening.

God bless!

 

[puzzleannie]

NFP is useful for couples who accept God’s plan for sex and marriage. If they are engaging in premarital sex, they have rejected that plan, and need education on that before they need NFP. The first question you should ask is what are your plans for the baby, which is probably only weeks away since you are having sex w/o ABC.

 

[martino]

I agree that this is a good opportunity for you to be a witness to the faith. You certainly have your work cut out for you. This girl probably has no idea what she is in for if she thinks you are just going to explain how NFP works! I do not expect that she will be particularly open to hear what you have to say, but it is good that you will say it anyway.

I do have a few questions for you: If he wants to have premarital sex, why would he want you to talk her out of it? And if he is against having premarital sex why doesnt he just tell her so himself and not have sex with her? Or does he just want you to talk about NfP and nothing more? It seems that you do better to first convince him that premarital sex is wrong, and then maybe help him convince her. Afterall, if you are the only one among the 3 of you that is against it, I do not see how that is going to affect what they do when you are not there.

I hope and pray that everything goes well and I support your effort. However you should expect to receive some backlash, the truth is never easy to take especially when it is unsolicited and by someone you don’t know.

I wish I had more helpful information for you (maybe hide a scapluar underneath where she is most likely to sit! )

 

[walter.gonzalez]

If it were my friend I would counsel him to consider abstaining from intercourse until he is married.

 

[debbie_m]

Think about the fact that most couples beginning NFP have an unplanned but very loved baby which is conceived in the practicing phase of learning. I disagree with teaching her the specific details of NFP right now - honestly, you and I know that she will probably not get it right at first. Here’s something to ask yourself: If she brings you her charting to look over, will you be comfortable going over it and seeing their sessions of premarital intercourse recorded?

I think you should teach her about the reasons for NFP for married couples. By all means when they get engaged then you can sit down with her and teach away. BTW the guy needs to learn as well.

God bless,
Debbie

 

[Ana]

puzzleannie:

The first question you should ask is what are your plans for the baby, which is probably only weeks away since you are having sex w/o ABC.

Not a bad suggestion!

 

[Ana]

martino:

I agree that this is a good opportunity for you to be a witness to the faith. You certainly have your work cut out for you. This girl probably has no idea what she is in for if she thinks you are just going to explain how NFP works! I do not expect that she will be particularly open to hear what you have to say, but it is good that you will say it anyway.?

No I don’t think she does, and he said he is going to leave us ALONE…Muhahahahahahahaha I don’t know why, but I have this strange feeling that she WILL be open, I can’t explain …

martino:

I do have a few questions for you: If he wants to have premarital sex, why would he want you to talk her out of it? And if he is against having premarital sex why doesnt he just tell her so himself and not have sex with her? Or does he just want you to talk about NfP and nothing more? It seems that you do better to first convince him that premarital sex is wrong, and then maybe help him convince her. Afterall, if you are the only one among the 3 of you that is against it, I do not see how that is going to affect what they do when you are not there.?

I don’t think he knows that I intend to speak with her about the dangers of premarital sex. He is not against premarital sex. He didn’t even say that he wanted me to talk about NFP specifically, just to inform her about ABC. He doesn’t like the idea because of potential side effects, possible infertility etc. His concerns are based on a health standpoint, not a moral one. He doen’t know what can happen if you put a lukewarm Catholic at a table with an informed Catholic and say “why don’t you guys have a little talk.”

As for convincing him, it is difficult because he does not regard the Bible or the Church as authoritive, another reason that the strides he has made in his spiritual walk (in my first post) are that much more awesome. He may have a long way to go, but God in His mercy has brought him a LONG wayalready. He, as we all are, is a work in progress.

I am betting on the girlfriend being the one to hear and embrace the Truth, being that she is already Catholic, and does attend Mass. I’m thinking she probably already feels a little guilty, and grace has shown it’s face by the fact she displays already an interior resistance to ABC, and even a willingness to talk with someone she doesn’t really know about such intimate things.

martino:

I hope and pray that everything goes well and I support your effort. However you should expect to receive some backlash, the truth is never easy to take especially when it is unsolicited and by someone you don’t know.?

Thank you for the prayers, and if his girlfriend does respond positively than there might be a backlash from HIM. He will have technically have been …ahem…“cut off.”

 

[Ana]

walter.gonzalez:

If it were my friend I would counsel him to consider abstaining from intercourse until he is married.

I think I have a better chance of convincing *her. *

 

[Ana]

debbie m.:

Think about the fact that most couples beginning NFP have an unplanned but very loved baby which is conceived in the practicing phase of learning. I disagree with teaching her the specific details of NFP right now - honestly, you and I know that she will probably not get it right at first. Here’s something to ask yourself: If she brings you her charting to look over, will you be comfortable going over it and seeing their sessions of premarital intercourse recorded?

Heck no! I think you misunderstand, I have never intended on teaching her the “hows” of NFP, just the “whys”. There are certified NFP couples who are much better qualified to teach than I am. I am hoping merely to lay a foundation.
debbie m.:

I think you should teach her about the reasons for NFP for married couples. By all means when they get engaged then you can sit down with her and teach away. BTW the guy needs to learn as well.

God bless,
Debbie

If they choose to follow God’s plan, I will point them in the direction to learn the things they need, and I agree that he should be involved also.

Thank you everyone for your suggestions. I also appreciate the questions asked to gain a deeper insight into this situation. In an effort to keep my posts brief, there is a lot left out.Please keep the suggestions coming. The “talk” has been postponed because I and my children are sick, so we are getting together next week. I appreciate the discussion and (name removed by moderator)ut from ALL of you, it helps me to feel better prepared, please keep em’ coming.

 

[martino]

Ana, I thought she was coming over last night! In your first post 12/21 she was coming over the next night which would have been the 22nd. Did she cancel out on you or did I misunderstand something. I am very curious to find out how things went!

 

[Ana]

martino:

Ana, I thought she was coming over last night! In your first post 12/21 she was coming over the next night which would have been the 22nd. Did she cancel out on you or did I misunderstand something. I am very curious to find out how things went!

At the bottom of the post above yours, I explained that the get together has been postponed until next week because my children and I are sick.

I will definitely post and let everyone know how things went! Please continue to pray for this endeavor!

God bless!

 

[Ana]

Hello everyone and thank you for your prayers. My friend and his girlfriend came over. She and I kind of went off by ourselves, and talked over some of the issues I brought up previously.

She was very receptive and easy to talk to. We clarified some misunderstandings she had about the teachings of the Church and she did acknowledge the wisdom of the Church’s positions.

I laid the facts out there for her, and now the rest was up to her. To study, to pray.
Please continue to pray for this young woman. She is nineteen, and in college, and it seems her parents, though Catholic, may be a tad liberal.

Knowing the Truth and living the Truth are two different things, may God grant her the grace to LIVE her Faith,

God bless!